Questions on Class 3 trust/corp.

[Guest mgjohn]

Wanting to purchase several new class 3 items. I understand that a Class 3 corp/trust will save me a lot of time in not having to get a LEO sign off.

Q1. What kind of cost can I expect in setting this up?

Q2. How long a time peroid does it take to set up?

Q3. Pro's/ Cons's trusr/corp vs LEO sign off?

Q4. How to find a lawyer that knows how to do this right the first time ?

Q5. Questions I need to ask but have not? Or other info I need to know?

TIA

[Superman]

http://www.tngunowners.com/forums/cain-law-firm/37413-new-vendor-special-offers.html

Cain law firm in Franklin Tn, also a vendor here.

The way i understand it, without a trust you have to be with the gun or else it is locked up where only you have access. With a trust several people can be named, so you don't always have to be there. So your son, wife, freind, or whoever you have listed on the trust can take the gun to the range without you. Plus you don't have to do the fingerprints, pics, CLEO signoff.

Edited March 26, 2010 by Superman

[Guest TwoLaneBlackTop]

I highly advise going to individual route in Tennessee. The CLEO is required to sign your forms due to Tennessee law if you are eligible to make the purchase.

[Superman]

People do trusts all the time in Tennessee. Trusts have way to many benifits not to do one, IMO. To name a couple-You don't have to be with the gun all the time whenever it is out of the safe, if you die your wife or kids don't have to have it transferred to them if they are on the trust.

[Guest TwoLaneBlackTop]

You don't have to be with the gun all the time whenever it is out of the safe

That is hyperbole if you ask me. There is no law saying you have to keep it in a safe whenever you are not present that's a myth. You are supposed to keep it in a manner so it is not readily accessible to others though, but I have never heard of a case where someone was arrested by the ATF because their wife knew the combination to the safe, or she knew where it was stored and could get to it, etc those stories are just that, fictitious stories and nothing more.

I am not against using a trust, and in places where people can't get the sign off I understand 100%, but when the sign off is not a problem why go through all the trouble of setting up a trust when it is so easy to go individual.

One thing bad about a trust that I know of is..... If a person ever gets involved in a divorce and they have their wife on the trust and she turns out to be a gold digger and knows what the NFA items are worth, watch out as there is a good chance one would have to kiss their high $ machineguns goodbye.

Edited March 26, 2010 by TwoLaneBlackTop

[midtennchip]

One thing bad about a trust that I know of is..... If a person ever gets involved in a divorce and they have their wife on the trust and she turns out to be a gold digger and knows what the NFA items are worth, watch out as there is a good chance one would have to kiss their high $ machineguns goodbye.

Not sure why the trust would make any difference on that issue. The amount of assets you have (whether in a trust or not) will be subject to the division of assets in a divorce anyway.

[Guest shodges308]

Wanting to purchase several new class 3 items. I understand that a Class 3 corp/trust will save me a lot of time in not having to get a LEO sign off.

Q1. What kind of cost can I expect in setting this up?

Q2. How long a time peroid does it take to set up?

Q3. Pro's/ Cons's trusr/corp vs LEO sign off?

Q4. How to find a lawyer that knows how to do this right the first time ?

Q5. Questions I need to ask but have not? Or other info I need to know?

TIA

Brother, dont waste your time with a trust if u havent by now. If u are eligible to make the purchase then the CLEO which would be truman jones at the rutherford county sheriffs office has to sign off. And as far as worrying about fingerprints and pics for the CLEO ? seriously.... After u just sent two sets of prints and like 4 passport pics to the feds with form 4 to even have it to begin with. Got bad news for u , Your prints are already in the system. So one more set of prints is no big deal, basically just overkill required by the feds. I am a LEO myself and i have a good buddy who works for rutherford county SO and we shoot together and he has class 3 and had them before he worked there and never had a problem. The CLEO sign off form is so over hyped its ridiculous. The sheriffs office which in every county in this state except Davidson to my knowledge, the Sheriff is the one that signs. (Sirpas in Metro) It is not a big deal. I got mine done in a couple of hours . You will wait longer for the ok to come back from the feds anyway. So, trust me in this great state, most sheriffs offices are not nazis when it comes to having class 3 items. If u can legally own them then as long as ur not firing in parking lot at walmart or trying to redecorate your neighbors house, your ok. As long as there is a stamp to go with the item , most sheriffs office have bigger fish to fry than tieing up manpower investigating if ur were in the room when ur son , or wife was holding it. Thats Obsurd. I have dealt with this situation several times on duty and have found that this is a common misconception of civilians. WE ARE GUNS OWNERS TOO! ;And i will say that Every one of my cop buddies are pro - gun and almost all of them are NRA members or members here or both like me. We dont want the feds taking anyones guns, cause that means our personal arsenal too. Bottom Line go to the sheriff. its quicker, less paperwork overall less headache. And if for some reason u have a problem , hit me up on here and i will reach out to some of my contacts there and see what u can do to resolve it. Hope this perpestive helped u, and BUY ALL U CAN WHILE U CAN!

- A pint of sweat will save a gallon of blood

- General Patton

[Guest drv2fst]

I have not done a Trust but have some class 3 items in my name and some in my company name. I prefer personal registration over the company route. But can't speak about a Trust.

I have had no trouble getting sign off from CLEO in Rutherford county. Sometimes they get backed up and it takes 2 weeks but usually they are very quick and worry free.

I agree with shodges308 about the "on file with the FEDS" issue. I have had several people seem offended when I mention that I had to register with the NFA to get these items. They seem to think that somehow makes me more visible to the Feds than they are. I disagree. I think anyone that fills out a W-2, W-4, 1099, 1040 is already on the list and that means all of us. Get over worrying about privacy, it's long gone. Might as well enjoy some cool toys.

[Guest shodges308]

my first post may have come on a little strong, so let me clarify by saying im not putting down trust, i think they are a great tool for all of us gun nuts who may not have the good fortune of living in the jurisdiction of a like minded CLEO. My comment about the sheriff , i meant to say in my professional experience in this state, most agency chiefs defer to the sheriff of that particular county except in places such as davidson where the sheriffs office was stripped of police powers when they went metropolitan. But having the benefit of living in one of the best if not the best (my opinon) states in the country in relation to ownership of firearms, most of the CLEO are like minded individuals and have no problem signing off on a form. i meant to agree with TWOLANEBLACKTOP in that we just so happen to live in a state where the CLEO is legally required to sign within 15 days unless he can show cause that u intend to commit a crime with the said item or u are not compitent enough to posses it. In either case you would not be eligible to own the item in the first place. I also agree highly with him in the post talking about the CLEO's normally attitutde towards the sign off. Since they are elected officials and not appointed it is a great oppurtunity to help out citizens on a more personal level. I am not speaking for the tn sheriffs acossiation by any means but i will say to all members in sumner county , the sheriff has no problem with the sign off as long as u are law abiding. All that being said i am not attacking trusts as i think they are invaluable tools in states where the political climate is a bit farther to the pleft. Im just glad i live in a state where i dont have to worry about that while also worrying about gettin everything else in order in a class 3 purchase. Just another opinon on this matter, but u know how opinons are..

[quesogrande]

I went the trust route, I walk in the dealer buy my stuff and walk out. When the paper work comes back, I go and pick the item up. I just like it better. There is no disadvantage, the advantage to me is simplicity.

[Guest mgjohn]

shodges308

Not worried about prints or pics the Feds have quite a few copies of mine. (12 sets at last count)

The reason I am interested in the Trust route is that I went by the Sheriffs office and got the brush off.

They did not seem to want to help me out and I was told if I dropped my paper work off it would take upwards of 90 days to get it signed if they did sign it.

Really did not want to wait 3 months to find ot the Sherriff would not sign.

No one I talked to at any of the area Class 3's told me TN was a must sign state.

I moved here from KY and know very few people and none who are rubbing shoulders with the powers that be. All of my Class 3 stuff was purchased in KY.

[Guest crotalus01]

Well, you should inform that Sheriff that BY LAW in the state of TN he has (damn I forget) either 5 or 15 days (I think 5) to sign unless he has a LEGAL reason not to - that does not include him thinking you should not possess the item. I have heard of others in M'boro have problems with the jackasses up there.

To the OP - I have done both individual transfers and trust transfers. The benefits of the trust far outweigh the disadvantages IMO, plus if you want to purchase multiple NFA items over the years it will save you a decent amount of money as you can skip submitting photos and fingerprints (plus some LEOs will charge you for running a "no wants/no warrents" before signing your f4).

Personally I will only do transfers on a trust now. YMMV...

[Guest mgjohn]

I never got close to talking to the Sheriff, I was given the brush off/runaround by a couple of the deputies. Guess I can always move back to KY for my Class 3 stuff. At least there I know how the system works.

[gotigers]

I have read that local DAs and other Law officials can sign NFA forms. But, there is a time limit for the sheriff. he has to sign in so many days. I can't remember the time limit either.

[DaveTN]

I never got close to talking to the Sheriff, I was given the brush off/runaround by a couple of the deputies. Guess I can always move back to KY for my Class 3 stuff. At least there I know how the system works.

Did you go to the Sheriff’s Office? Since this is pretty common I would guess the secretaries in the Sherriff’s Office would know more about this than Deputies that have absolutely nothing to do with it…. Wouldn’t you?

I doubt that you would need to talk to the Sherriff himself, would you?

[Guest drv2fst]

I have gone to the Sheriff's office before and had no trouble at all. I have also left the forms at the gun shop (On Target) and they have a deputy that brings signed forms back and takes unsigned forms to the Sheriff about once a week or so. That way you don't even need to go to the office. Either way, I have always found the local Sheriff's office to be very easy to work with on NFA forms.