ROCK RIVER ARMS ??

[Guest gms_77]

i been lookin for an upper for my bushmaster and do to alot of help from this forum i found alot of good places to look i've almost decided on a RRA 20" upper but my question is how good are they? any feed problems...etc.... also will it be a good match for my bushy???? actually just lookin for info all together good or bad...this upper will be used for plinkin and some varmints any help would be greatly appreciated...thanks

[Guest 2HOW]

check AR15.com , all kinds of info, I have heard the RR are very good, so you are switching from 5.56 to .223?

[Guest Verbal Kint]

I have owned a complete RRA AR-15 before, and thoroughly enjoyed it. I put several hundred rounds through it, if not 1K+, before I sold it... and never experienced a single problem with it. It was built really well.

Like a lot of people, I simply sold it to fund other projects.

[Rightwinger]

Fantastic quality for the dollar from RRA. The only issue the last two years is they are experiencing so much popularity along with the metal shortages that sometimes their stuff is hard to come by. If you can wait 10-12 weeks then you will get a great upper. It may come sooner, but plan on 3 months from order date. They have a sale going on right now for certain uppers I think as well!

[Guest gms_77]

thanks i shoot 223 through my ar now is that gonna be a problem with the RRA UPPERS???? thanks guys

[Guest Verbal Kint]

thanks i shoot 223 through my ar now is that gonna be a problem with the RRA UPPERS???? thanks guys

I shot .223 religiously through my RRA AR-15... matter of fact, I believe that's all I ever shot through it.

You won't have any problems.

[Guest 2HOW]

RRAs are chambered for .223 , Bushmasters are chamberd for 5.56. You have to think about what you will shoot and what twist you want. No 5.56 in a .223 upper.

[Rightwinger]

Get a Wylde chamber if your especially worried about the minor differences, but the RRAs shoot both 5.56 and .223 ! Buy it and shoot it. Of course they disclaim for their warranty that you should shoot only brass factory cased ammunition so Wolf Blasting would "void" a warranty but you gotta do what you gotta do.

Here is a link and you will see it shoots both. The link to their Wylde chamber is near the top/middle of the page. Don't worry bout it if you go RRA!

http://www.rockriverarms.com/item-detail.cfm?ID=AR0874X&storeid=1ℑ=uelute07.gif&CFID=553403&CFTOKEN=97676976

[Guest gms_77]

what grain bullet do yall recommend for varmints such as coyotes????

[Guest 2HOW]

What's the difference between 5.56MM and .223 Remington chambers in the AR-15®-type rifle?

Would someone care to comment on shooting 5.56 mil spec ammo in a .223 SAAMI chrome lined AR? I've heard everything from yea to nay on other lists and am looking for the voice of reason here. I have an Armalite M15A2 on order that I was told by Armalite would have an M16 Nato chamber (I specifically asked this before I ordered). Now they say all their guns have SAAMI spec chambers but they are going to switch the chrome lined ones to Nato in the future due to customer demand. I know that SAAMI says not to shoot 5.56 in a .223 chambered gun, but Armalite says it's fine. --Chance

If we are talking about .223 Remington SAAMI-spec chambers in an AR15, OH NO!

Do NOT use such a chambering if you EVER plan on shooting any military NATO 5.56 ammo, which happens to be only the most common, least expensive and most widely used AR15 cartridge available in all the world. In other words, NEVER buy/use a SAAMI-spec chamber in a battle rifle, especially if the barrel and chamber are chromed, as you cannot fix it!

Here's the problem. Many NATO cartridges have bullets that will become jammed into the rifling of a SAAMI chambering (the throat is too short). This is VERY DANGEROUS, for a grat number of reasons.

Fulton Armory uses a "5.56 Match" chambering in its rifles/uppers/barrels (in fact our barrels are marked as such), which is a slightly modified SAAMI chamber with a tad longer throat to accommodate NATO bullets. The Fulton Armory 5.56 Match chamber allows for the safe and reliable use of all SAAMI and NATO ammo, while offering the accuracy potential of the SAAMI chamberings with match commercial cartridges. Remember, there's often a large difference between bolt guns and military rifles. This particularly true for the 5.56 vs .223; Fulton Armory is well known for the finest performance for any given platform, and our 5.56 Match chamber is one way we achieve that performance with the AR-15-type rifle.

[Rightwinger]

The RRA standard chambering is NATO so 5.56 and .223 are fine.

[Guest 2HOW]

Rock River Arms Standard Carbines & Rifles Rock River Arms Standard Carbines & Rifles are dependable and accurate. Entry Tactical Rifles feature a Wylde Chambering designed to accomadate both .223 & 5.56MM NATO ammunition. The case body has been relieved to aid in extraction and improved reliability. The throat has been shortened for improved accuracy!It is Wylde not NATO, we are both right and we are both wrong, I stand corrected. Its the only one I know with a standard Wylde chamber.It is neither SAAMI nor NATO, hmm

[Guest gms_77]

thanks guys i appreciate all the help

[Guest Mugster]

Some RRA chambers are a bit too tight to handle true m193 ammo without pressure signs showing on the brass. I have one, a 20" flattop A4. It handles m193 fine. It is very accurate. Just be aware that it could be an issue, and check your brass the first time you shoot it...although at somewhere around $12-$18 a box of 20, shooting it might not be much of a problem ever again.

And actually, the RRA 2 stage trigger is suh-weeeeeeeet. Thats the thing they do the best on their production rifles, imo.

[Guest Todd@CIS]

My RRA CAR-A4 has a factory, 5.56mm NATO chamber ($40 upgrade).

I've got approx 3000 rounds through it (.223 and 5.56mm) without a single malfunction.

It's been run pretty hard in several schools (Pat Rogers, TacResponse, etc.) and I couldn't be happier with it.

[Guest 2HOW]

I would suggest the 5.56 chamber, you can shoot both and unless your out for long range accuracy you dont need .223 chamber.

[Guest Todd@CIS]

I would suggest the 5.56 chamber, you can shoot both and unless your out for long range accuracy you dont need .223 chamber.

Totally agree.

Personally, I wouldn't own an AR without a 5.56 chamber and chrome-lined bore.

Edited to ad: I should add that all my ARs are 16" and defense oriented.

I'm issued a Bushmaster...I bought an RRA and Colt.

[molonlabetn]

I've owned neither, but have gotten the impression from handling several examples of both, and discussions with owners, that the RRA is more highly regarded than the Bushmaster... though either one would serve just fine.

[Guest gms_77]

the RRA is more highly regarded than the Bushmaster

that's impressive...i thought that bushmaster or dpms was on top?

[Guest Mugster]

I'd tend to agree. Fit and finish wise, there's not much difference. I think RRA takes the win on the trigger and the tight chamber if you are looking to do some serious shooting.

If you are getting a 16" carbine for a plinker...get the cheapest one of the three mentioned.

[Guest 2HOW]

Yes the 16" is the starting point, many cheap 1s out there, olympic is under 700.00 msrp for a starter. My Bushy is a V-Match 16" floating barrel chambered for 5.56. HMMM why a 16" match rifle chambered for 5.56? hell I dont know, I bought it cause it was cheap, its a great shooter and I put a reflex scope on the flattop, great so far inside 100yds. Im a AK guy but had an issued A1 for many years and I guess I got DEJAVU. whatever, I will sell it for 800.00 FTF. its like new really.

[Guest Mugster]

Hey 2HOW, me too on the A1 thing. Real colt A1 uppers are available surplus off and on as police dept's upgrade to the m4's. I combined that with a sabre defense lower and made a real nice plinking rifle. The hard thing for me was finding an A1 buttstock and pistol grip that were in really good shape.

I'd get an SP-1, but i never liked the lack of a forward assist on them.

I don't care for the shorter 16" carbines as much, especially for shooting with iron sights.

[Guest gms_77]

well i wanna thank everyone that helped me out this board is awesome i called Hero Gear and they set me straight on everything i'm just gonna get a scope for my 16" and go from there....once again thanks to all for the help and information

[Guest brandon_pitt]

I have an RRA upper on my ar and its been excellent. No issues ever and very easy to maintain. Only issue I've had is with my 24 inch bushy bull barrel, because of the narrow throat, is it will not chamber that steel cased Wolf ammo. I started cheapest to expensive to see which brand and grain it shot the best, only to find out that wolf maybe too cheap (not putting down Wolf ammo, my gun just isn't a fan ). I have never had an issue shooting brass, whether it be Remington, Winchester, Hornady, etc. All shoot great. My ar is chambered. 223/5.56 with a 1 in 9 twist in the barrel. Can't go wrong with RRA, IMHO.

[Dolomite_supafly]

the RRA is more highly regarded than the Bushmaster

that's impressive...i thought that bushmaster or dpms was on top?

DPMS is on the bottom of almost any list you might see. Most parts used do not meet milspec. Milspec is a minimum standard for quality, not an assurance of high quality. It just makes sure the parts made meet the minimum criteria set forth in the contract. It says its guns are milspec but it is only the stripped lower that meets the minimum milspec standard.

There are only a few makers of the major components of an AR. Look at different AR's at the next show. You will notice several different makers have the same forging marks on their uppers. Lowers are also only made by a few companies but they engrave the lowers for a particualr manufacturer because most makers aren't setup as a forge. Same goes with the barrels and unless you are having a gun custom built you are going to get the same components as any other maker. The exception to this is DPMS because they make a lot of their products in house and that is why their products do not meet the milspec standard which, again, is a minimum standard.

The only good thing that DPMS makes is their lower parts kits. I have used them for years and they have always worked great.

Chamber specs should be the same between makers for a given catridge. There are standards and most makers are going to build to those standards. Saying one is tighter than the next is only speculation unless dozens have been tested from one maker to get an average. And even then it is the individual barrel that determines accuracy. Identical barrels will not shoot identically, doesn't happen.

As far as twist goes I would get a 9 twist. Avoid the 7 twist coolaid drinkers suggestions. A 9 twist barrel will let you shoot everything from 69 grain bullets down to 35 grain bullets without issue. The only advantage to having a 7 twist barrel is being able to shoot 90 grain bullets but those will have to be single loaded as they can't be fired from a magazine. Something else, with a fast twist certain bullets will fly apart from centrifugal force. I have a 7 twist gun that when shooting 53 grain SMK's at anything above 3300 fps it turns them into a gray dust cloud. Same bullet in a 9 twist at even greater velocities is not a problem.

Read this:

BCM Complete AR15 Upper and Lower Receivers [2010-01-01] - 03DESIGNGROUP

And notice the absence of anything DPMS. There is a reason.

And then there is this:

Notice that DPMS is at the end. Then notice how much they DO NOT do to the weapons.

For most people they will not notice that DPMS is lacking in quality because it will be their only or their first gun. And in most cases those people aren't going to put 1,000 rounds throguh the gun in a life time. So for most DPMS owners they are "good enough" but far from being anything I would trust my life with.

Now I am not a high end AR owner or even a fan boy of the high end guns. I don't believe you need to spend $2,000+ to get a quality gun. My main gun I built for less than most brand name guns and it has been flawless since day one. As long as you use quality components you can have a quality gun you can trust your life with. Now there is a certain amount of quality that the higher end guns have but that is not needed in order for you to have a gun to trust your life with. And in the end all guns may be used to save a life.

Dolomite