Hollow Points (45 ACP in particular)

[inspecting1]

Ok so I was McDonalds outside of New Orleans (Heck of a place to be thinking thoughts along those lines) last night and got to thinking about hollow points. I normally shoot FMJ's through my carry pistol mainly because they are cheep and easier to find but I'm concerned about the residual effects of this round. You know you shoot the assailant and the bullet keeps traveling hopefully into an inanimate object. What are the opinions of the guys on here about hollow points. Like in Hunting the ideal situation would be for the round to stop under the outer layer of skin. With a 45 I do not see this happening. I would like to hear the comments from the guys and gals on here as to what there experiences are with hollow points and which one would be recommended for limited secondary damage. I have a 3 small children and a wife in my house. So shooting through walls spooks the hell out of me.

[nightrunner]

for hunting you normally use a soft-point instead of FMJ or JHP(jacketed hollow point), for the mushrooming effect, the JHP does too much damage and destroys too much of the animal.

I dont know if you are saying that you think that a .45 will still go all the way through with a JHP or if it wont make it past the outer layer, but remember the .45ACP is the slowest, widely used semi-auto pistol cartridge(except .380ACP), only travelling at 850fps(normal pressure) normally, where as a 9mm or .40 is moving a good bit faster, and .357sig and 10mm are even faster.

IMHO, a .45ACP JHP +P is the best self-defense cartridge in a pistol available, approx. 950-1050 fps .45 caliber, 230gr. JHP projectile, will make a man think twice.

Most times a .45 wont go through an assailant, most JHPs period wont.

I dont know where to even start looking on here, but someone posted up a link to a survelliance video in a police precinct, where a suspect wasnt padded down and while he was waiting to be interrogated, pulled out a 1911 in .45 and shot himself in the head, point blank. The bullet didnt exit the other side, and I doubt a guy like that had JHP loaded in it.

[dats82]

If you are wanting to minimize secondary damage, you should get rid of the fmj for sure. I would go with a jhp with the idea that if you do miss your target and send a couple into walls, the hollow points will mushroom and disipate energy much quicker than a fmj. As for hitting your soft target, I do not know if the fmj 45 will stay in the target, but a jhp will almost certainly stay in your target.

[inspecting1]

If you are wanting to minimize secondary damage, you should get rid of the fmj for sure. I would go with a jhp with the idea that if you do miss your target and send a couple into walls, the hollow points will mushroom and disipate energy much quicker than a fmj. As for hitting your soft target, I do not know if the fmj 45 will stay in the target, but a jhp will almost certainly stay in your target.

Yes thats what I was thinking also that a JHP would be the way to go. I was interested in what brand would be recommended on this site ie; one of the cartridges loaded with a barnes solid copper hollow point (Not sure about this one I like barnes but solid copper even though hollow point still should have a lot of penetration power), Corbon, Fed Hydra-shock, Rem. Golden Saber, or Gold Dot.

I guess what I'm asking is which one of the above cartridges would have the least amount of penetration.

[daddyo]

The objective of self-defense should be stopping the threat, not making as many holes as you can. Everything I've read indicates that the JHP is a much more effective fight-stopper than the FMJ round.

[1gewehr]

The .45acp is not known for over-penetration. I would not worry about that with almost any .45acp load.

As stated above, faster Hollow-point bullets have a better chance of expansion than slower ones. So, if your goal is terminal effect on the target, the 185gr JHP would be your best load. Make sure that your pistol can reliably feed this as many cannot. The Remington Golden Saber +P 185gr is going 1140fps at the muzzle from a 5" barrel. If your barrel is shorter, you'll lose a little velocity and gain some extra muzzle blast. None of the Golden Saber loadings have a reputation for over-penetration, and they are reliable defense cartridges.

[inspecting1]

The .45acp is not known for over-penetration. I would not worry about that with almost any .45acp load.

As stated above, faster Hollow-point bullets have a better chance of expansion than slower ones. So, if your goal is terminal effect on the target, the 185gr JHP would be your best load. Make sure that your pistol can reliably feed this as many cannot. The Remington Golden Saber +P 185gr is going 1140fps at the muzzle from a 5" barrel. If your barrel is shorter, you'll lose a little velocity and gain some extra muzzle blast. None of the Golden Saber loadings have a reputation for over-penetration, and they are reliable defense cartridges.

Cool Thank You very much

[DavidD]

The .45acp is not known for over-penetration. I would not worry about that with almost any .45acp load.

As stated above, faster Hollow-point bullets have a better chance of expansion than slower ones. So, if your goal is terminal effect on the target, the 185gr JHP would be your best load. Make sure that your pistol can reliably feed this as many cannot. The Remington Golden Saber +P 185gr is going 1140fps at the muzzle from a 5" barrel. If your barrel is shorter, you'll lose a little velocity and gain some extra muzzle blast. None of the Golden Saber loadings have a reputation for over-penetration, and they are reliable defense cartridges.

+1. I came to the same conclusion and chose Golden Sabre for my .45 EDC.

[molonlabetn]

Just see for yourself... go buy two watermelons, shoot one with a FMJ and shoot the other with a JHP and see the difference.

Edit: Just for conversation-sake, it is far more likely that you will penetrate walls due to missing than by overpenetration, statistically... and a JHP will penetrate just as much drywall as a FMJ.

Edited February 25, 2010 by molonlabetn

[memphismason]

I use Golden Saber 230 grain .45acp in my Glock model 30.

[DavidD]

Just see for yourself... go buy two watermelons, shoot one with a FMJ and shoot the other with a JHP and see the difference.

That does sound pretty fun.

[Guest C3Defense]

extreme shock ammo! Awesome Stuff!

[MacGyver]

I like the Federal 230gr HST. Hard to find, but a great round.

[inspecting1]

That does sound pretty fun.

Yea but with my kids they might take the gun away from me and pistol whip me with it for wasting watermelons

[Guest 6.8 AR]

I use Golden Saber 230 grain .45acp in my Glock model 30.

Same here. They feed well in my G30 and my SA 1911:D

I haven't tried 185's but I will.

Hydrashocks are good,too.

[peejman]

As stated, FMJ's are for perforating paper (or military use) only.

Buy one box of a couple different JHP rounds and try them. Pick the one that performs best (no malfuctions, best groups, ...) and go buy a few more boxes of it. Shoot 100 or so rounds of FMJ's to get the gun dirty, then shoot all of the JHP's to verify no malfunctions. Then go buy a few more boxes for carry use.

There's a "rule of thumb" that 200 rounds with no malfuctions is good enough for carry. Obviously at $1+ a shot, that gets expensive. There's another rule of thumb that says buy new carry rounds once a year. Use your own judgement.

I use Hornady TAP 200gr JHP's. They're hard to find anymore so I assume I'll have to switch to something else when I run out.

Be aware of bullet "set-back" when re-chambering a round. For example, your carry gun has JHP's in it. You go to the range, unload those rounds and perforate some paper with FMJ's. Then reload the JHP's when you leave. The act of chambering the same cartridge several times can push the bullet down in the case a bit. This can cause the pressure to increase to an unsafe level. .45 ACP ammo is known to be more prone to set-back than others.

[gregintenn]

Our military used the 1911 with 230 grain ball ammo for most of a century, back when the military leaders were allowed to think for themselves, and I've yet to read anything about them being concerned with over penetration. They simply wanted to impart lethal damage to the enemy, and have a reliable firearm. I do realize that FMJ is a rule of the Geneva Convention, but I believe this combination served the military well anyway.

[BBill_TN]

Our military used the 1911 with 230 grain ball ammo for most of a century, back when the military leaders were allowed to think for themselves, and I've yet to read anything about them being concerned with over penetration. They simply wanted to impart lethal damage to the enemy, and have a reliable firearm. I do realize that FMJ is a rule of the Geneva Convention, but I believe this combination served the military well anyway.

I think it was the Hague Convention of 1899 actually

[E4 No More]

Army soldiers liked the .45 against the Moro warriors because it would travel through the body and stop from the elasticity of the skin on the other side, so I don't think FMJ is a problem with over-penetration: however, I prefer the JHP for carry because I want the round to open up for a larger wound channel. Early JHPs wouldn't open up when shooting a frigg'n jug of water, but modern ammo such as the HST does.

[hipower]

Currently using 185 jhp in my SA Operator. The round feeds well, is very accurate and my old wrists really appreciate the slightly lessened recoil on them. I usually practice with WWB 185 and keep Golden Sabre, Speer Gold Dot for hd/pd loads.

So far, the little 4" has digested every 45 load run thru it.

[nightrunner]

some .45 JHPs expand to over .70caliber on impact!

[Il Duce]

As stated, FMJ's are for perforating paper (or military use) only.

Buy one box of a couple different JHP rounds and try them. Pick the one that performs best (no malfuctions, best groups, ...) and go buy a few more boxes of it. Shoot 100 or so rounds of FMJ's to get the gun dirty, then shoot all of the JHP's to verify no malfunctions. Then go buy a few more boxes for carry use.

There's a "rule of thumb" that 200 rounds with no malfuctions is good enough for carry. Obviously at $1+ a shot, that gets expensive. There's another rule of thumb that says buy new carry rounds once a year. Use your own judgement.

I use Hornady TAP 200gr JHP's. They're hard to find anymore so I assume I'll have to switch to something else when I run out.

Be aware of bullet "set-back" when re-chambering a round. For example, your carry gun has JHP's in it. You go to the range, unload those rounds and perforate some paper with FMJ's. Then reload the JHP's when you leave. The act of chambering the same cartridge several times can push the bullet down in the case a bit. This can cause the pressure to increase to an unsafe level. .45 ACP ammo is known to be more prone to set-back than others.

G T Distributors Product Detail

[Guest spoolie]

I carry FMJ ball all the time...always have. I've shot gel/jugs/wood studs and there isn't that big of a difference. Inside the house that is what the shotgun is for, or the wife has a 9MM in her nightstand.

[peejman]

G T Distributors Product Detail

I appreciate the effort, but ....

G T Distributors is a Law Enforcement wholesaler who, by contract, is only authorized to sell ammunition to the Law Enforcement community.

[E4 No More]

I appreciate the effort, but ....

Try here, they don't care: Streichers.com Police Equipment Supply Headquarters - 800-367-3763

.45 HST is on a loooong lead time, but they have TAP.