38 special vs the .380

[Will Carry]

I can't understand why the ballistic tables and "One Shoot Stop" charts rate the 38 special round so low and seem to rate the .380 so high. It would seem to me that a 38sp 157 grain wadcutter would hurt worse than a 80 grain .380 JHP simply becuase the wadcutter has twice the mass.

I'm new to pistol shooting. Where I grew up we didn't have no need for handguns, but where I'm living now, if you want to shoot, you got to shoot PISTOLS, indoors! That's just crazy! Yeah I had to leave the old home place to feed my family so I came to Raleigh. For sixty miles in any direction there are people packed in yard to yard. Millions of us. You can't just drive out into the country anymore and shoot. If I couldn't get on I-40 westbound once or twice a year I'd go crazy.

[dats82]

One shot stops refer to the amount of energy in a shot. Energy = .5 * mass * velocity * velocity. That being said, you need to know the velocity of the round to truly decide which one has more energy. When comparing balistic charts, always remember to keep an eye on the weapons used. Barrel length has a large impact on velocity. A given round does not have the same energy from every weapon.

Short answer to your question, the charts I quickly glanced at appeared to have the two rounds at similar velocity; thus, the 38 special would win out in my book. I carry a .38 and I do not own a .380.

Also remember that the energy must be transfered to the target. If the round passes through the target, wasted energy. One of the biggest reason to use hollow points is so the round stays in the target and transfers the maximum amount of energy or knock-down power to the target.

Edited February 18, 2010 by dats82

[molonlabetn]

It's no secret that a 158gr wadcutter out of a snubnose, especially, is going really really slow (like barely over 700fps). It's just going to punch a hole... which is fine for most situations, but it doesn't really impart any 'shock' on the target. The lighter .380 bullet is travelling significantly faster, and is able to produce a larger temporary cavity, which is more noticable to the person shot even if it is not as likely to penetrate far enough to be lethal...

Lethality does not mean it subdues quickly.

This is why 110, 125 and 135gr +p choices are most often preferred in .38spl. The 158gr SWC "FBI load" were simply better than round nose, since hollowpoints were moving too slow to expand.

[daddyo]

Can you provide a link to the ballistic tables you are referring to?

[Guest Ae-35]

We could be in this for a long time, short answer. The 38sp. in a standard pressure factory is loaded way down. The reason, there's a lot of really old 38s still out there. the 38sp loaded to +P, in a 4in. barrel is very close to the 9mm. +P offering. The 38 took a lot of "heat" because in the 50s, 60s, and early 70s , most police dept. issued the lead round nose bullet. Which in a lot of shootings , was not as effective as desired. The 380 has never been proven to be a consistent "stopper" ( hate that term). It's so under powdered, that the pistols it's used in have to be "blow-back" operated, which can produce less than acceptable reliability. When you compare "apples to apples" , meaning the same bullet, and pressure (+p to +p and standard to standard) the 380 always has "power" less than the 38sp.

[dats82]

terminal ballistics

This is where I was looking. I am not really sure how scientific it is, but I figure it is close enough for a ballpark figure.

[Guest bugmanz]

do a google search for:

handgun wounding factors and effectiveness

this will allow you to read and down load a paper that if studies will get you going in the direction to answer many questions in regards to the area in question. have a good one..............

[daddyo]

do a google search for:

handgun wounding factors and effectiveness

this will allow you to read and down load a paper that if studies will get you going in the direction to answer many questions in regards to the area in question. have a good one..............

Thanks for this, bugmanz. Looks like very interesting reading.

[Will Carry]

Thanks Bugmanz! That dispels a lot of myths about hand guns.

[Guest 70below]

The 380 has never been proven to be a consistent "stopper" ( hate that term). It's so under powdered, that the pistols it's used in have to be "blow-back" operated, which can produce less than acceptable reliability. When you compare "apples to apples" , meaning the same bullet, and pressure (+p to +p and standard to standard) the 380 always has "power" less than the 38sp.

Just a note......many of the newer 380 designs feature a locked breach. Not only does this make the most use of lower power cartridge but it helps with small pistol recoil as well. That said, there are definitely better options available for most people.

[kwe45919]

do a google search for:

handgun wounding factors and effectiveness

this will allow you to read and down load a paper that if studies will get you going in the direction to answer many questions in regards to the area in question. have a good one..............

That's a 19yr old article from 89'....While it's a good read with great info in it, today's production ammo is scientificly different than back in 89' so keep that in mind and add that to the knowledge presented in these FBI files.....

[Guest .45]

I can't understand why the ballistic tables and "One Shoot Stop" charts rate the 38 special round so low and seem to rate the .380 so high. It would seem to me that a 38sp 157 grain wadcutter would hurt worse than a 80 grain .380 JHP simply becuase the wadcutter has twice the mass.

your thinking is on the right track... .38SP is a better choice than .380.

BUG's: .380 ACP vs. .38 Sp - M4Carbine.net Forums

bottom line = in most modern professional settings (LEO/military), both would be considered BUG cartridges, not primary sidearm material.

of the 2, the .38SP is a better choice...

.45