Any Gearheads? Clutch engagement point too low?

[SavageSig]

Yep. I bought mine as a "beater" and to help with fuel usage (other vehicle is a GMC crew cab 4X4). Got a used RSX-S and I love it. No troubles as of yet. Just gas and go. Gotta love it!

Good luck with the repair and let us know what the outcome is.

Thank you, will do. I should also note that I have a Base, and from what I understand the Type-S actually has a different CMC that is sturdier.

[tennessee01tacoma]

Once air is introduced into system, you will have a bad pedal feel as air does not compress.

Actually air compresses very readily that's what gives you a spongy feel, lol or "no pedal" in brakes.

You could try flushing the system it could help definitely won't hurt. Brake fluid draws moisture and if it draws too much moisture it lowers the boiling point which is very important in the brake system don't think the clutch system would get that hot.

It shouldn't be hard to replace either one but I would probably start with slave cylinder they actually do the work.

[tennessee01tacoma]

Actually when it comes to hydraulic clutches, if the master is bad you get a soft, spongy feeling pedal.

On a brake system, a bad brake master cylinder results in a hard pedal.

Dude I am not slamming you but think about this Bad brake master cylinder will let fluid bypass and let the pedal be spongy. bad vacuum booster equals hard pedal. Do you just do tech support or do you actually work on vehicles?

[dats82]

You can easily drive the car without the clutch disengaging. Shifting in and out of first is a bit tricky, but between gears is not bad. You have to find the right rpm for the speed and gear such that you are pushing the car under power, nor is the compression of the engine braking the car. Typically, if you drive conservatively, when it comes time to shift, ease off the gas with applying a gentle pressure to the shifter, it will slip out of gear. Then feather the gas, and it will fall into the next gear. This is one way to conserve what life you have left in your clutch while you are trying to get it fixed.

[tennessee01tacoma]

So back the the clutch I seriously doubt the clutch is worn out yet my toyota tacoma with a 4cyl and 32" tires has 189k miles on the factory clutch doesn't slip, can't make it slip. Unless some amateur straight shift driver had your car before you and rode the clutch all the time then I don't think the clutch is your problem. If you car has an external slave cylinder that pushes on a clutch fork then that fork needs grease where the slave cylinder pushes on it. It probably won't fix your problem but it is another variable that you can get rid of easily.

Edited January 16, 2010 by tennessee01tacoma

[SavageSig]

A small update:

This morning I started up the car and the clutch felt dead. First half of the stroke was completely limp, and the 2nd half felt anemic. Car basically refused to go into 1st gear. Here's where it gets interesting: in desperation I mashed the clutch down 4 or 5 times and to my amazement, the pedal feel got progressively better. After that, the car slipped easily into gear and the engagement point was actually higher on the clutch.

The rest of the day, I didn't have much trouble from the clutch. Any time it felt a little funky going into gear, I pumped the clutch a few times and then tried again with no issues. I ended up doing that maybe 4 times during 2 hours or so of driving.

So what does that mean? I should also add that I was in a minor wreck and repaired less than a month ago.

[56FordGuy]

A small update:

This morning I started up the car and the clutch felt dead. First half of the stroke was completely limp, and the 2nd half felt anemic. Car basically refused to go into 1st gear. Here's where it gets interesting: in desperation I mashed the clutch down 4 or 5 times and to my amazement, the pedal feel got progressively better. After that, the car slipped easily into gear and the engagement point was actually higher on the clutch.

The rest of the day, I didn't have much trouble from the clutch. Any time it felt a little funky going into gear, I pumped the clutch a few times and then tried again with no issues. I ended up doing that maybe 4 times during 2 hours or so of driving.

So what does that mean? I should also add that I was in a minor wreck and repaired less than a month ago.

You have a failing cylinder. As you pump the pedal, it builds up fluid pressure and causes the system to work.

[SavageSig]

You have a failing cylinder. As you pump the pedal, it builds up fluid pressure and causes the system to work.

Slave or master? Or still undetermined?

I'm definitely going to the mechanic on Monday.

[56FordGuy]

Slave or master? Or still undetermined?

I'm definitely going to the mechanic on Monday.

I would bet master. A failing slave cylinder would probably be leaking, and lowering the fluid level.

[SavageSig]

I took it to the shop today. They adjusted some clutch linkage and my clutch feels brand new again. Engagement is right near the top of the stroke, as opposed to near the floordboard.

They did say that I should keep an eye on it, and if it starts feeling spongey again, that I definitely need to get a new slave and master cylinder. But I'm keeping my fingers crossed that I don't need that just yet.

[Guest 1817ak47]

if the clutch isn't fully disengaging, it can damaged and destroy the gears and synchroniser from the clutch "dragging" the synchros kinda act like a brake to synchronize the gears speeds when changing gears. but grinding will damaged the cogs on both the gears nad the slider hubs.

[56FordGuy]

That sounds funny to me. The mechanical linkage shouldn't have caused a spongy feeling, and I wouldn't think pumping the pedal would have any effect on mechanical components. Hydraulics parts, yes, but linkage? That's a new one.

I'm not saying they're wrong, as I haven't looked at your car and they have, but that seems unusual.

[Superman]

Sounds to me like they basically said, "We don't know what's wrong with it" LOL

If you pump it up and that makes it work, then it's like 56FordGuy said it's a bad master. Or there could be a small leak that has allowed a little fluid out and a little air in. I have seen it several times with Hondas. A little air in the system and when you pump the pedal several times it will make everything feel like normal for a while. Then when the problem comes back pump several times and all is good.

ETA: The only adjustment I am aware of on these is on the rod that connects the pedal to the master.

Edited January 20, 2010 by Superman

[MCSCOTT]

I'm betting they didn't adjust anything. Most likely what they did was bleed the system if you have a small leak. If pumping the pedal helped, then you almost definately had air in the line from a leak somewhere, and by them bleeding it that would put it back to feeling good. However, if there is a leak or a failing cylinder simply bleeding the system wont last too long. I know you checked and said that it wasn't leaking, but if the fluid level was just above the min and below the max as you stated then that sounds to me like it was a little low. If the slave cylinder is leaking, it's possible that it's leaking into the bell housing where you can't see it. Plus if it's a small leak with the way hydraulic fluid is you most likely wouldn't notice it at all unless you're use to what to look for. However, even the smallest of leaks can allow air to get into the system and cause the pedal to feel spongy.

Basically just keep an eye on it and hope for the best. Since they've done enough to get you by, you may want to do some reading up on the vehicle so that you might be able to do the work when the time comes. Factories now on alot of vehicles sell the clutch master cylinder and the slave cylinder, line and all, pre-filled from the factory so that there's no need for bleeding. You may be able to buy the whole setup and put it on yourself cheaper than you would pay someone to just put one or the other on for you.

[Guest 1817ak47]

I don't ever recall hearing of a hydralic clutch system being able to be adjusted. not saying it isn't made, just is not at all common

[Superman]

Lots of them have an adjustment on the rod going into the master. If it isn't adjusted right the master can bottom out before the pedal is pressed all the way or the pedal could hit the floor before the clutch is disengaged completely.

[SavageSig]

One theory he said was what Superman said. The 1st half of my old clutch stroke had no resistance because it wasn't activating the hydraulics. Now that I have a full stroke, it seems to be fine. Drove around yesterday and all day today without any degradation in feel. He also topped off my fluid, so I'll keep a really close eye on it. It's right on the MAX line now.

Thanks for the tip also about pre-filled master and slave cylinders. I think I'll definitely do some research on that.