National Park Carry Law

[PC7]

Does anyone know what day this goes into effect next month? Also, does the state the park is in have to allow carry in state parks to allow carry in national parks? I’ve searched the web, to include the Dept of the Interior website and I can’t find any solid answers.

[TripleDigitRide]

I think it's the 22nd, but I'm trying to clarify.

[TripleDigitRide]

Yosemite National Park - Weapons/Firearms (U.S. National Park Service)

The National Park Service will follow Congress’s directive and implement the new firearms law, which states that its provisions will take effect nine months from today (May 22, 2009). For the time being, the current Reagan Administration regulations governing possession of firearms in national parks remain in place. Under the current regulation, firearms are generally prohibited, but citizens may transport unloaded and dismantled or cased firearms within or through Yosemite National Park, as described above.

[Fallguy]

Yep, Feb 22, 2010 is the date.

[Guest SUNTZU]

WooHOO!

[macville]

Does anyone know what day this goes into effect next month? Also, does the state the park is in have to allow carry in state parks to allow carry in national parks? I’ve searched the web, to include the Dept of the Interior website and I can’t find any solid answers.

That's been a question I have been wondering since the Smokey's splits NC and many hiking trails start in TN and end up in NC. Here's my understanding of it. It goes by state law is what it's supposed to it. With the passage of the state parks carry law TN also added wording allowing carry in the NP's. However, I don't believe they NEEDED to do that since the law only tells you what you CAN'T do, not what you can do. Therefore, since the law before only said state and local parks, I firmly believe that you would have still been able to carry in the NP here in TN. I believe (don't take my word on this) that NC should be the same way.

When I looked up the NC state law about carrying in parks it said it applied to state, county, and city owned parks-nothing about federally owned parks. So I believe that while you can't carry in NC state or local parks, you should be okay in the NP. I still would like to hear something from the NC AG or a lawyer who has research it.

Matthew

[Fallguy]

Whether a state allows carry in State parks or not does not affect carry in National Parks within that state.

If you can legally carry on "Main St" in that state then you can carry in a National Park in that state unless that state has a law that specifically prohibits carry in National Parks.

[Mike.357]

and am I understanding correctly that OC would also be legal if state law allows OC on main street?

[Fallguy]

and am I understanding correctly that OC would also be legal if state law allows OC on main street?

I don't think so.

I believe the Federal Law will only allow for concealed carry in National Parks, even if OC is legal in the state.

Also another thing to remember is that any Federal Buildings within the National Park would still be off-limits.

[Mike.357]

I believe the Federal Law will only allow for concealed carry in National Parks, even if OC is legal in the state.

i hope that is the case. It will at least give some pause to the OCing guy who shall not be named by me. I would have been waiting to read about another romp in the woods with an AK pistol by the end of next month.

[Oh Shoot]

I don't think so.

I believe the Federal Law will only allow for concealed carry in National Parks, even if OC is legal in the state.

Also another thing to remember is that any Federal Buildings within the National Park would still be off-limits.

I'm pretty sure THIS new law allows carry in the same manner that the state in which the park resides allows and that the PREVIOUS Interior Dept. rule change, signed during Dubya's time, only allowed concealed carry.

- OS

edit: I could have this backwards, but I can't prove it to myself one way or the other yet - can't find copy of actual new law.

Edited January 11, 2010 by OhShoot

[Fallguy]

I'm pretty sure THIS new law allows carry in the same manner that the state in which the park resides allows and that the PREVIOUS Interior Dept. rule change, signed during Dubya's time, only allowed concealed carry.

- OS

I think it still only allows concealed carry. Working on finding it again.

The one main difference between this and what W signed, is that what W signed did go by what the state law was on state park carry, but this new one would allow carry in National Parks within states that ban carry in state parks so as they don't have a law against carry in National Parks.

EDIT: Here is the link to the final rule. Check the last couple of pages for what the changes in the law will be. Seems to may to say concealed.

http://www.doi.gov/issues/Final%20Rule.pdf

Edited January 11, 2010 by Fallguy

[Oh Shoot]

I think it still only allows concealed carry. Working on finding it again.

The one main difference between this and what W signed, is that what W signed did go by what the state law was on state park carry, but this new one would allow carry in National Parks within states that ban carry in state parks so as they don't have a law against carry in National Parks.

EDIT: Here is the link to the final rule. Check the last couple of pages for what the changes in the law will be. Seems to may to say concealed.

http://www.doi.gov/issues/Final%20Rule.pdf

That's the previous Dept. of Interior rule, that was squashed, FG.

I'm looking for the actual congressional LAW that will go into effect, the one tacked onto the credit card bill.

I've found two renditions, one mentions concealed with an "or", one mentions concealed with an "and", but neither are the final version of what actually was signed into law. Neither NRA-ILA nor the federal archive sites have been any help.

It certainly doesn't matter to me, as I conceal carry everywhere, but just as a point of interest.

- OS

[Fallguy]

That's the previous Dept. of Interior rule, that was squashed, FG.

I'm looking for the actual congressional LAW that will go into effect, the one tacked onto the credit card bill.

I've found two renditions, one mentions concealed with an "or", one mentions concealed with an "and", but neither are the final version of what actually was signed into law. Neither NRA-ILA nor the federal archive sites have been any help.

It certainly doesn't matter to me, as I conceal carry everywhere, but just as a point of interest.

- OS

I had links to the new as well, but still kind find them, but I do remember it seemed to change, harder to keep up with than state bills even.

I'm with you in that I will conceal most of the time, but just want to know.

[Fallguy]

Ok...here is what I can find.

It was Sec 512 of HR 627 that allowed carry in National Parks. Read The Bill: H.R. 627 - May 21, 2009 - GovTrack.us

Part ((2) seems to say you can carry however as long as it is legal by state law. So it would seem to allow OC and even carry without a permit in states like AK and VT...and maybe even OC without a permit in states that allow OC without a permit.

[Oh Shoot]

Ok...here is what I can find.

It was Sec 512 of HR 627 that allowed carry in National Parks. Read The Bill: H.R. 627 - May 21, 2009 - GovTrack.us

Part ((2) seems to say you can carry however as long as it is legal by state law. So it would seem to allow OC and even carry without a permit in states like AK and VT...and maybe even OC without a permit in states that allow OC without a permit.

Yeah, that's what I've seen quoted on some forums, but you're the first to find actual bill, so that's what I wanted to see quoted from.

Congrats, FG! (I'm sorry, there's no cash prize).

"...

( Protecting the Right of Individuals To Bear arms in Units of the National Park System and the National Wildlife Refuge System- The Secretary of the Interior shall not promulgate or enforce any regulation that prohibits an individual from possessing a firearm including an assembled or functional firearm in any unit of the National Park System or the National Wildlife Refuge System if--

(1) the individual is not otherwise prohibited by law from possessing the firearm; and

(2) the possession of the firearm is in compliance with the law of the State in which the unit of the National Park System or the National Wildlife Refuge System is located."

I'm also pretty sure that the previous DOI rule only allowed concealed, regardless of state open carry laws.

-OS

Edited January 11, 2010 by OhShoot

[macville]

Jeez guys, if you had asked me earlier I could have given you the info on open carry and the actual law. I looked it up a few weeks ago and posted what I found on glocktalk.

The old rules (what Bush had put into place) allowed for CC only. The new law only requires what the state you are currently in requires for carry. So VT and AK will have unfettered carry. Places like KY should have no permit OC.

It's actually a pretty good law. The only thing that would be better would be if you can carry in your own state, then you can carry in any NP in the country. But alas I don't plan on going to any state I can't carry in legally anytime soon, so that doesn't bother me.

Matthew

[Fallguy]

Jeez guys, if you had asked me earlier I could have given you the info on open carry and the actual law. I looked it up a few weeks ago and posted what I found on glocktalk.

The old rules (what Bush had put into place) allowed for CC only. The new law only requires what the state you are currently in requires for carry. So VT and AK will have unfettered carry. Places like KY should have no permit OC.

It's actually a pretty good law. The only thing that would be better would be if you can carry in your own state, then you can carry in any NP in the country. But alas I don't plan on going to any state I can't carry in legally anytime soon, so that doesn't bother me.

Matthew

In your earlier post you didn't seem so sure....

I saw lots of misinformation on GT, (about following state park carry laws in the state you're in etc...) hope you got them straight.

[Mike.357]

so we are back to OC being allowed in a national park in TN.

Is North Carolina an OC state?

I don't generally OC , but would hate to get busted because I was simply printing or inadvertantly exposed a holster or something.

[Fallguy]

so we are back to OC being allowed in a national park in TN.

Is North Carolina an OC state?

I don't generally OC , but would hate to get busted because I was simply printing or inadvertantly exposed a holster or something.

According to OpenCarry.org - A Right Unexercised is a Right Lost! NC is an OC state OpenCarry.org - State Information For North Carolina

[GKar]

This from the GSMNP web site:

Change in Concealed Weapons Regulations

Due to recently enacted Federal law, there will be significant changes in the firearms regulations pertaining to the National Park Service which will take effect on February 22, 2010.

Until the new regulations takes effect, carrying a concealed firearms is not allowed and all possession of firearms within National Park Service lands must be in accordance with 36 CFR 2.4, which states firearms must be "rendered temporarily inoperable or are packed, cased or stored in a manner that prevents their ready use."

Information concerning the new regulations will be posted prior to the February 2010 implementation date.

[macville]

In your earlier post you didn't seem so sure....

I saw lots of misinformation on GT, (about following state park carry laws in the state you're in etc...) hope you got them straight.

No, I didn't seem so sure about carrying in NC because while I've looked through their laws, I haven't done a 100% search (in case they have an obscure law that's not with the other weapons and parks carry law.) As far as what the NPS law says, I knew exactly what that said.

Matthew

[Guest marine77]

N. C. used to have a law that was "armed to the terror of the people" or

some such thing as that. That's why sometimes it's still dicey to carry

open in N. C. although i do when there.