bump in the night

[wipfel]

i'm relatively new to handguns and handgun carry, and, while i don't want to fire up a couple of common debates, i had an experience last night that gave me new perspective on a couple of features of a pistol when one is being used for home defense.

just as the wife and i were drifting to sleep (you know that point where you don't realize you're asleep, but you start having psuedo-dreams?), we heard a loud noise downstairs that jolted both of us. i wasn't sure it was even from downstairs at first, but i was completely sure no one had come up the stairs since they stop just outside our opened bedroom door.

as soon as came awake enough to realize that was a very out-of-place noise, i rolled out of bed and grabbed the holstered Sig P229 i keep close by. this where the new perspectives happened. i was surprisingly relieved i didn't have to do anything other than pull the trigger if necessary since a round was chambered and there is no safety. i've been wary of both in the past. in this case, when i was struggling to wake up quickly while trying to determine the direction and source of the sound...all in the dark...i was happy to not have more to do to coerce the pistol into going bang.

in the end i cleared the downstairs and found the noise was a little, portable car-powered air compressor that had fallen into the laundry room sink, which is about a foot from our garage door.

in critiquing the situation, i found out a few useful things. for one it's impossible to get my dog to go more than about 4 steps down the stairs before he stops to see if i'm following. second, once he gets down there, he's just going to follow me to see why we're up in the middle of the night. third, i assumed (there's that nasty word) my wife would stay at the top of the stairs until she heard from me one way or the other. she ended up following me down after a couple of minutes delay, but didn't say anything to let me know she was now downstairs with me.

on the plus side, it made my wife even more pro-gun, and was glad i went straight for my handgun.

[Guest B_Carter]

Tell her to yell "clear" so you know she is there and no a BG....

[MCSCOTT]

This kinda thing is why alot of the folks on here practice HD situations and drills on a regular basis so that both you and your wife know exactly what to do. Personally, you can't doubt the dog just yet either. After all, there was no intruder in the house. He probably knew that from not smelling anyone, and was following you around trying to figure out what the heck you were looking for. Had he smelled someone different, he may have been in a completely different mood.

Glad everything turned out ok though, this in itself gives you practice.

[LngRngShtr]

MCSCOTT, you beat me but here is my post

The concerns I would have:

1.Would be the wife needs to stay put and standby with a cell phone ( not landlines, if someone is in the building they may have been disabled ) and after training a suitable defensive device,

2. dogs , usually if someone/something is about the dogs here tend to bark.. I have had a similar situation happen where a picture fell and broke its glass after we returned from a long trip which made the night longer the dogs looked up sniffed and went back to sleep the house was cleared after waiting a few minutes for any other noises or outside sounds,hearing none I then secured the perimiter.

If I come home and have a friend try to get close to the house ( after letting the wife know we are trying this) the dogs come unglued, try it sometime with a co-worker the dogs haven't met to see how they react. most dogs have this hardwired to protect their "pack" on a side note a pet underfoot while trying to out maneuver a possible adversary negates home field advantage.. might look into training him to stay and protect "mom" or work out from underfoot giving you room to move without tripping over him..

3. Lights,.. what did you do with the lighting as you cleared the house? did you back light yourself? going into a downstairs is a tough maneuver maybe someone here with more experience can chime in but think of how you view it from below... legs and lower abdomen before gun,.. kind of a good target for BG if one is hiding there...

If it is just you,the wife, and dogs maybe staying put is best make the threat come to you where you are in a strong defensive position not caught in a stairwell with no room to move and 2 armed homeowners together is better than 2 separate ones wondering if the noise is a BG or your SO and hesitating (because the BG won't hesitate if he is solo he knows anyone else is a threat)

Just some thoughts : replay the incident during the day with your wife and have her retrace your steps WITHOUT a gun and play the part of a bad guy hiding downstairs to see and hear it from their view then switch positions it may help you learn a few things in case the next time it isn't an air compressor

I am glad all ended well and nothing got shot..

John

[Mark@Sea]

Valuable conclusions to be drawn here, and dirt cheap at the price!

Most dogs are pets. I don't pet watchdogs, I don't expect pets to do more than bark, if that.

You need a (preferably, very bright) flashlight next to your pistol. Make it a 'dedicated' flashlight so it doesn't end up left under the sink with dead batteries.

Some good slip-on shoes might be helpful, too.

You and your wife really need to have a clear understanding of what each is going to do. Stay in the bedroom or right beside you, either is fine - but surprise meetings, esp. in the dark, when you aren't expecting it - or more accurately, when you are expecting/fearing an intruder - is bad. Make sure she gets this. You might explain why her turning on the lights behind you is a bad idea, too....

Critique isn't criticism, I think things turned out very well. These are just some suggestions that might help insure that outcome....

Best

Mark

Edit: Geez, there were no replies when I started to type this. Guess I need a faster connection or faster fingers. Anyway, seems to be a pretty common set of comments.... GMTA and all that

And a post-script; Cellphone is great to have at hand (landline, not so much), but don't worry about it until after the incident is resolved. If you're involved in calling 911 - which cannot respond quickly enough to be of any real use - you aren't paying enough attention to your environment. People can't drive and make phone calls at the same time.

Edited January 8, 2010 by Mark@Sea

[Guest Drewsett]

My wife and I had a similar experience, except I grabbed my 12 gauge, as it is what I keep handy near the bed.

She stayed upstairs with her cell while I made sure there weren't any BG's downstairs. We have a totally ridiculous word we use to signify everything is okay, and if I don't say it, she gets the other gun and prepares to defend herself from whatever BG might have overpowered me and put a gun to my head in an effort to get her out in the open.

Also, if I happen to get accosted in the parking lot on my way into the condo I am to come in the house as loudly as possible (I get home late night from work) and yell "Honey I'm home", which is not my normal behavior (I usually try to be as quiet as possible), so that she will be up, armed, and ready.

We hope we never have to use any of these plans though.

[Motasyco]

Nothing to add but I'm sure glad I clicked this thread. Good stuff! It's got me thinking now about scenarios I hadn't considered.

[LagerHead]

I've had a similar situation that happened multiple times before I realized it was a shampoo bottle dropping in the shower. Definitely an advocate of one in the chamber at all times. Now I need to get a light. I've been using a small hand held LED light that is great, but not attached to the gun.

[Guest RemedyCNC]

I had a situation where wife was home alone and heard something. She "doesnt do the gun thing" so I had to think of something to get her calm enough to make sure there was actually a threat. I told her to grab both sets of car keys and set off both panic alarms. I figured if there was someone around, the noise of two car horns going off at midnite would be enough to scare them away. Long story short, it was the patio door banging in the wind. I figured that any attempt to bring attention to our house would scare off any outside intruder. Comments?

[LngRngShtr]

on the wait to call 911,.. all 911 calls are recorded.. if your spouse can dial while you defend against a break in or attempted break in and something does occur it can help when replayed later.. legal eagles please clarify

I was taught that it can help if the Jury hears the recording and you are stating clearly that you are armed intend to defend and they need to leave NOW and you end up having to shoot it out it shows your " I was in fear of my life or grave bodily harm would come to me/my spouse" mindset during your civil trial...

I am not a lawyer nor do I have legal experience...

John

I have heard of the car alarm idea and it makes sense in that the intruder does not want attention from the outside world while they work but I put it in the "another piece of the defensive toolbox " file and would not rely on it as the only tool to summon help or defend..

Edited January 8, 2010 by LngRngShtr
car alarm comment

[Guest Drewsett]

I had a situation where wife was home alone and heard something. She "doesnt do the gun thing" so I had to think of something to get her calm enough to make sure there was actually a threat. I told her to grab both sets of car keys and set off both panic alarms. I figured if there was someone around, the noise of two car horns going off at midnite would be enough to scare them away. Long story short, it was the patio door banging in the wind. I figured that any attempt to bring attention to our house would scare off any outside intruder. Comments?

This is actually a really good idea. Will definitely be putting that in the bag 'o tricks

[Luckyforward]

I have long kept my car key on the bedside table (right next to the Model 686). A few months ago around 2 AM, the outside motion light came on and I heard voices. I immediately set off the car alarm and from the window saw two persons run down the driveway towards the street.

My car and truck were the only ones in an eight house radius that were not broken into that night.

[MCSCOTT]

This is actually a really good idea. Will definitely be putting that in the bag 'o tricks

I agree, never can have enough good resources in HD situations, and no matter what I must say again that it is important to practice, or at least have definate plans in certain situations as to what each person in the home should do, and even the wives need to have a plan. Here not too long ago a woman broke into my cousin's house by breaking a window out with a flower pot. Her husband was out of town, and her and the kids were in her bedroom watching tv. She obviously heard the window breaking and knew someone was breaking in, and decided to stay in the bedroom until the cops got there, and she was armed and ready for the BG to come through the bedroom door. The disturbing part is they ended up finding the BG hiding in the attic (the BG had even managed to pull the folding stairs to the attic back up and everything). Had the BG not cut herself coming through the window, they may have never known that she went up in the attic. This would have let her come down more quietly after the police had left, and possibly after my cousin had gone to sleep (if that would have been possible). That whole possible scenario bothers me every time I think about it.

[shortround]

Make sure she gets this. You might explain why her turning on the lights behind you is a bad idea, too....

Back when my wife and I were newlyweds, I went outside to investigate some noises one evening. After slipping quietly out and around to the front porch, my wife 'helpfully' turned on the porch light, blinding me and lighting me up like I was onstage. I patiently explained to her why this was not good.

Okay, maybe I wasn't all that patient...

[Guest rebelyell]

Great stuff guys!In my family we all have a code word just in case my teenagers come in late and i wake up to noises since i work long hours,one night my son came in later than usual and was supposed to be spending the night with a friend,the house was all locked up for the night,instead of him calling me to tell me he needed to come and get some stuff he needed for the next day he thought he would just let himself in and get what he needed and not wake me up.but guess what i heard noises downstairs,i bang on the floor three times with the heel of my foot,he yells out the code word,if he had not, me and ole 12 gauge pump were going for a walk downstairs.all turned out good but i bet he calls the next time.

[wipfel]

MCSCOTT, you beat me but here is my post

The concerns I would have:

1.Would be the wife needs to stay put and standby with a cell phone ( not landlines, if someone is in the building they may have been disabled ) and after training a suitable defensive device,

2. dogs , usually if someone/something is about the dogs here tend to bark.. I have had a similar situation happen where a picture fell and broke its glass after we returned from a long trip which made the night longer the dogs looked up sniffed and went back to sleep the house was cleared after waiting a few minutes for any other noises or outside sounds,hearing none I then secured the perimiter.

If I come home and have a friend try to get close to the house ( after letting the wife know we are trying this) the dogs come unglued, try it sometime with a co-worker the dogs haven't met to see how they react. most dogs have this hardwired to protect their "pack" on a side note a pet underfoot while trying to out maneuver a possible adversary negates home field advantage.. might look into training him to stay and protect "mom" or work out from underfoot giving you room to move without tripping over him..

3. Lights,.. what did you do with the lighting as you cleared the house? did you back light yourself? going into a downstairs is a tough maneuver maybe someone here with more experience can chime in but think of how you view it from below... legs and lower abdomen before gun,.. kind of a good target for BG if one is hiding there...

If it is just you,the wife, and dogs maybe staying put is best make the threat come to you where you are in a strong defensive position not caught in a stairwell with no room to move and 2 armed homeowners together is better than 2 separate ones wondering if the noise is a BG or your SO and hesitating (because the BG won't hesitate if he is solo he knows anyone else is a threat)

Just some thoughts : replay the incident during the day with your wife and have her retrace your steps WITHOUT a gun and play the part of a bad guy hiding downstairs to see and hear it from their view then switch positions it may help you learn a few things in case the next time it isn't an air compressor

I am glad all ended well and nothing got shot..

John

thanks for the tips! i'm grateful for the feedback from everyone. the wife didn't hit any lights since i'd already turned on enough to pretty much light up the downstairs (we have an open floorplan).

moving down the stairs is something i don't like. there just doesn't seem to be a way to get down without making yourself a target if someone knows your coming.

i've already taken much of this advice and gone over it with the wife. i'm making plans to get nice flashlight and working on a systematic plan to clear the house.

[wipfel]

This kinda thing is why alot of the folks on here practice HD situations and drills on a regular basis so that both you and your wife know exactly what to do. Personally, you can't doubt the dog just yet either. After all, there was no intruder in the house. He probably knew that from not smelling anyone, and was following you around trying to figure out what the heck you were looking for. Had he smelled someone different, he may have been in a completely different mood.

Glad everything turned out ok though, this in itself gives you practice.

you knowl, this is a very good point. i was just reading that a human's olfactory area is about the size of a postage stamp and a dog's is about the size of a 8x11" piece of paper. he very well knew there were no unusual smells in the house.

[wipfel]

Valuable conclusions to be drawn here, and dirt cheap at the price!

Most dogs are pets. I don't pet watchdogs, I don't expect pets to do more than bark, if that.

You need a (preferably, very bright) flashlight next to your pistol. Make it a 'dedicated' flashlight so it doesn't end up left under the sink with dead batteries.

Some good slip-on shoes might be helpful, too.

You and your wife really need to have a clear understanding of what each is going to do. Stay in the bedroom or right beside you, either is fine - but surprise meetings, esp. in the dark, when you aren't expecting it - or more accurately, when you are expecting/fearing an intruder - is bad. Make sure she gets this. You might explain why her turning on the lights behind you is a bad idea, too....

Critique isn't criticism, I think things turned out very well. These are just some suggestions that might help insure that outcome....

Best

Mark

Edit: Geez, there were no replies when I started to type this. Guess I need a faster connection or faster fingers. Anyway, seems to be a pretty common set of comments.... GMTA and all that

And a post-script; Cellphone is great to have at hand (landline, not so much), but don't worry about it until after the incident is resolved. If you're involved in calling 911 - which cannot respond quickly enough to be of any real use - you aren't paying enough attention to your environment. People can't drive and make phone calls at the same time.

my wife and i went over the situation tonight and figured out how we should have done thing as well as how we would plan to do thing in the future. it was a great lesson for the both of us.

[Mark@Sea]

Now go get some nerf guns and practice clearing the house in the dark

[Guest janwbrown616]

MCSCOTT, you beat me but here is my post

If it is just you,the wife, and dogs maybe staying put is best make the threat come to you where you are in a strong defensive position not caught in a stairwell with no room to move and 2 armed homeowners together is better than 2 separate ones wondering if the noise is a BG or your SO and hesitating (because the BG won't hesitate if he is solo he knows anyone else is a threat)

To me this is the safest route. It's your house. He does not know where you are...Yet. When you come out of the bedroom and down the stairs...NOW he know's where you are. If there are children in the house this is not an option, but just you and the wife and the mute mutt, well my bet is stay put and wait, with a phone and your weapon. As for outside issues. I'd be willing to say more people are hurt going outside to clear the area than anywhere else. Again, it's your house, he does not know where you are, TILL you go outside. I can think of several cases where police responding to a prowler have shot an armed homeowner in the dark. If the noise is outside and you turn on the flood lights and they STILL are outside, then call the PD. You stay put. Most burglarys happen during the day when people are at work. At night they're probably after something else....

[Will Carry]

I am a firm believer in making my bedroom a fortress and letting the bad guy come to me and my 870. In house fighting, the man who is moving is going to get shot by the man who is in a good defensive position, 9 times out of 10. "Clearing" the downstairs is going to get you killed. What downstairs is worth dying for? Housing clearing, room to room, is an offensive military tactic. It looks really good in practice but it will get you killed in the real world.

Another thing to remember in defending your home and family. Sheet rock is concealment not cover. A .357 magnum will go through several walls, a 30.06 will go through your house. You can use this to your advantage.

[rentalguy1]

Glad it turned out ok.

My$.02:

1. Stay up late a few nights and listen to the sounds your house makes when everyone else is asleep. This will train your senses to anything that is abnormal.

2. If wife is unarmed, she stays in the bedroom with a cellphone and the door locked. If she does not hear you yell CLEAR in two minutes, she calls 911.

3. If wife is armed, you are a team. You stay together, and clear the house, one room at a time. You lead, and go left, scanning the room from left to right at about a 3' height. She follows and goes right scanning right to left at the same height. When your flashlights meet, you say CLEAR! The sound of your voice alone can scare off a intruder. Especially if they get the idea that you are clearing rooms. Most people have watched enough TV to know if they hear this phrase, you are armed and sweeping.

3. Do this until the entire house is cleared, and you have determined where the noise came from.

4. Practice this a few times per month until it is drilled in both of your brains. Make sure the wife knows it is not a game, and can be the one thing that saves both of your lives in the event of a real BG coming into your house. Times are bad, and a lot of people are getting more desperate.

5. I ditto the flashlight comment. Even if you have a tac-light, keep a 3 D-cell MagLight on each side of the bed. These are your back up weapons, and I have seen tac-lights fail.

6. Think about investing in a laser. Rail mounted, guide rod mounted, or grip mounted...it doesn't matter. It takes the guess work out when the adrenaline is pumping.

EDIT: No defensive position has ever held in the history of warfare. They only serve to become a trap. If you opt for this line of defense, be sure you have a way out.

Edited January 9, 2010 by rentalguy1

[Guest B_Carter]

Glad it turned out ok.

My$.02:

1. Stay up late a few nights and listen to the sounds your house makes when everyone else is asleep. This will train your senses to anything that is abnormal.

2. If wife is unarmed, she stays in the bedroom with a cellphone and the door locked. If she does not hear you yell CLEAR in two minutes, she calls 911.

3. If wife is armed, you are a team. You stay together, and clear the house, one room at a time. You lead, and go left, scanning the room from left to right at about a 3' height. She follows and goes right scanning right to left at the same height. When your flashlights meet, you say CLEAR! The sound of your voice alone can scare off a intruder. Especially if they get the idea that you are clearing rooms. Most people have watched enough TV to know if they hear this phrase, you are armed and sweeping.

3. Do this until the entire house is cleared, and you have determined where the noise came from.

4. Practice this a few times per month until it is drilled in both of your brains. Make sure the wife knows it is not a game, and can be the one thing that saves both of your lives in the event of a real BG coming into your house. Times are bad, and a lot of people are getting more desperate.

5. I ditto the flashlight comment. Even if you have a tac-light, keep a 3 D-cell MagLight on each side of the bed. These are your back up weapons, and I have seen tac-lights fail.

6. Think about investing in a laser. Rail mounted, guide rod mounted, or grip mounted...it doesn't matter. It takes the guess work out when the adrenaline is pumping.

EDIT: No defensive position has ever held in the history of warfare. They only serve to become a trap. If you opt for this line of defense, be sure you have a way out.

WOW...this is great! I would like to be in your house when these drills go down (not as the BG of course)...in my mind I am seeing an episode of The Unit! I have not given much thought into practicing this but it makes sense.

[Guest don_m]

I am a firm believer in making my bedroom a fortress and letting the bad guy come to me and my 870. In house fighting, the man who is moving is going to get shot by the man who is in a good defensive position, 9 times out of 10. "Clearing" the downstairs is going to get you killed. What downstairs is worth dying for? Housing clearing, room to room, is an offensive military tactic. It looks really good in practice but it will get you killed in the real world.

Wise words. No matter how well you know your home, if the BG chooses to hang around when he knows you are aware of his presence, he feels prepared to deal with you -- and you now have to deal with an ambush. Even with a tactically trained team and body armor, this is very risky business. Unless you have no choice, like to get a child to safety, hunker down and be prepared if he comes after you -- and let the LEOs do their job.

The ability to turn on lights throughout your home from the safety of your bedroom is a great idea and will scare off most intruders. Then be patient and listen -- obviously you can't call the cavalry unless you're reasonably certain someone is there. You also don't want to shoot you son's friend who crashed on your sofa after a party.

[Volzfan]

These suggestions are all great to practice.

We have an alarm system that covers every opening in the house including the garage door. We also have 2 Yorkies that sleep in a pen in the kitchen at night. They are very good about alerting me to anything out back. Thankfully it has only been a cat or opossum so far. I hope it stays that way.