Sweatshirt Sparks School Controversy

[BrasilNuts]

Sweatshirt Sparks School Controversy - Detroit Local News Story - WDIV Detroit#

So what do you all think?

[Guest db99wj]

I don't get it.

I guess I can see the "twin towers" and all, but what does "LOUI" mean?

[Guest SUNTZU]

I'd make a Crusader sweatshirt in response. I don't think new rules should be made, but appropriate responses should be allowed by other people. Or instead of the Crusader you could make a Shock and Awe sweatshirt.

[Reservoir Dog]

I don't get it.

I guess I can see the "twin towers" and all, but what does "LOUI" mean?

From the school's website:

January 4, 2010

Dear Parent/Guardian,

Today, we noticed a group of male students wearing black sweatshirts (hoodies) with wordings on the front and back. The front side had: Edsel Ford, class of 2011.

The back side had a nickname for each student in addition to our Thunderbird logo and the number 11. The number eleven had a ten window design on each strand. Beneath the number eleven, the words “You can’t take us down “were printed. The whole design gave prominence to the 9-11 tragedy. It made several staff members and students upset because of the perceived message. The students in question were processed in the main office and their hoodies were confiscated. I am meeting with their parents tomorrow to discuss this incident and its ramifications. After talking with the students, it became clear that there were no intentions of harm rather a very inappropriate and distasteful attempt to draw attention to themselves and to the class of 2011. I want to reassure everyone that the safety of our students and staff will always remain our prime priority here at Edsel Ford. Edsel Ford administration, the district’s student services and communications offices and our school police officer have all been involved in addressing this incident.

Please don’t hesitate to contact me if you have any questions regarding this incident.

Yours truly,

Hassane Jaafar

Principal

Edsel Ford High School

So, it appears that "LOUI" was the nickname for that student. I guess each hoodie had a different name on it.

The hoodies are definitely disrespectful and in very poor taste.

[Guest Caveman]

I'm a bit confused as to what the student's intention was behind the shirt. Were they attempting to be Pro-America or was this meant to be an Anti-American statement? Either way I believe it is distasteful, but I would think the severity of the punishment would be reflected by their intention.

[Mike.357]

I do not see anything wrong with it.

On 9-11 there was a terrorist attack. Thats a fact. The shirt does not belittle that attack or glorify it.

I like it and admire the creativity of the students involved.

I graduated in 1976, there was a huge board over the tower windows at the school painted up patriotic like that said "Spirit of 76" Obviously a play on the Revolutionary War. I did not find that disrespectful either.

People just look for stuff to raise a stink about now days

[Smith]

It seems rather patriotic to me. "You can't bring us down" I would think refers to the American mentality that you can take our symbols, stuff, lives, but not our spirit. I can' seem to think of any negative connotation.

[poak]

It seems rather patriotic to me. "You can't bring us down" I would think refers to the American mentality that you can take our symbols, stuff, lives, but not our spirit. I can' seem to think of any negative connotation.

That's kind of what I was thinking.

[trblmkr13]

Even if I was offended by this, you have a right to be distatseful and offend people in this Great Country of ours

[Smith]

Even if I was offended by this, you have a right to be distatseful and offend people in this Great Country of ours

Only if you are liberal, socialist, and or ethnic - otherwise no.

[Guest SUNTZU]

Even if I was offended by this, you have a right to be distatseful and offend people in this Great Country of ours

That's what I was saying. No more rules needed, just be distasteful back, if that's your bag.

[KahrMan]

From the Fox News Story...

The boys are Arab-American, as are about half the school's 1,700 students.

I wonder if that had anything to do with it....

[Guest db99wj]

I thought knowing what "LOUI" ment would clarify what I was missing...it didn't. I still don't get it and understand what the big deal is. Is it Anti American or not?

[Steelharp]

People just look for stuff to raise a stink about now days

And THIS man gets the Grand Prize!!! (I don't know what it is, but he gets it.) Applause, applause!

[Guest Drewsett]

Reading through the comments on the article there are several assertions that the students chose the design with malicious intent due to the negative feelings towards Arab-Americans in Detroit following the attempted Christmas Day bombing.

That would cause me to have a problem with it...if true.

[trblmkr13]

And THIS man gets the Grand Prize!!! (I don't know what it is, but he gets it.) Applause, applause!

Maybe he can have the internet once Jackdm3 is done with it

[Punisher84]

The only thing I can think of is if, since they are using it as a slogan, they are attempting to be disrespectful in trying to convey "You can bring the towers down, but not US because we are better" and hyping it since they are Arabs.

I dunno. Just my guess.

[Kelemvor]

Even if I was offended by this, you have a right to be distasteful and offend people in this Great Country of ours

Exactly, the school can ban inappropriate clothing, since I believe all schools have some rule like that, but outside of that kind of thing, people are free to make whatever kind of statement they want, however offensive it may be.

[Guest Muttling]

Yep, Kelemvor hit the nail on the head.

As a high school teacher I can say that this shirt is pushing the line for what to wear to school. Outside of school is a completely different story.

The issue is that we require (by law) all kids go to school. They are not there by choice. If you are at Walmart and hear offensive language or someone wears a shirt with logos of hatetred towards you....you can leave. Kids can't leave school or not come to school, that is a crime.

As a school, we have a duty to provide a safe and non-threatening learning environment. While I don't think these kids had the intent of being threatening or inappropriate, that shirt could easily be taken as a display of anger towards Muslims and could easily be threatening to Muslim or Arabic students. I don't think it's school appropriate. Outside of school, go for it and I'm very cool with the shirt.

[Smith]

Yep, Kelemvor hit the nail on the head.

As a high school teacher I can say that this shirt is pushing the line for what to wear to school. Outside of school is a completely different story.

The issue is that we require (by law) all kids go to school. They are not there by choice. If you are at Walmart and hear offensive language or someone wears a shirt with logos of hatetred towards you....you can leave. Kids can't leave school or not come to school, that is a crime.

As a school, we have a duty to provide a safe and non-threatening learning environment. While I don't think these kids had the intent of being threatening or inappropriate, that shirt could easily be taken as a display of anger towards Muslims and could easily be threatening to Muslim or Arabic students. I don't think it's school appropriate. Outside of school, go for it and I'm very cool with the shirt.

Funny how leftist minds think. There is absolutely no anger associated with the image nor statement. Rather it is a viewpoint of American resolve. The fact you identify as an American means you are excluding anyone who opposes us. You can't cheer opposing sides at the same time. This peewee football here.

[Guest Muttling]

Funny how leftist minds think. There is absolutely no anger associated with the image nor statement. Rather it is a viewpoint of American resolve. The fact you identify as an American means you are excluding anyone who opposes us. You can't cheer opposing sides at the same time. This peewee football here.

I tell you what. You come manage a classroom of 14 to 35 teenagers and then tell me all about it.

I am tasked with teaching ALL of my kids, not just the ones I pick and choose. I can't teach 25 of 30, I have to teach ALL 30.

When you're man enough to do that, get your butt in the classroom. We need more teachers. Until you're man enough to accept the difficulty of teaching an entire class of teenagers, you have a LOT to learn.

If we didn't require them by law and make it a crime to not show up at school, I would agree with you. But we don't. If you don't like how public schools work then pay the bucks to send your kids to a private school where ONLY your views are accepted.

I know this is a BIG revelation for you, but you're NOT the only person in this world and your view is NOT the only view in world. You are NOT all knowing. Get over it.

Edited January 7, 2010 by Muttling

[Smith]

I tell you what. You come manage a classroom of 14 to 35 teenagers and then tell me all about it.

I am tasked with teaching ALL of my kids, not just the ones I pick and choose. I can't teach 25 of 30, I have to teach ALL 30.

When you're man enough to do that, get your butt in the classroom. We need more teachers. Until you're man enough to accept the difficulty of teaching an entire class of teenagers, you have a LOT to learn.

If we didn't require them by law and make it a crime to not show up at school, I would agree with you. But we don't. If you don't like how public schools work then pay the bucks to send your kids to a private school where ONLY your views are accepted.

I know this is a BIG revelation for you, but you're NOT the only person in this world and your view is NOT the only view in world. You are NOT all knowing. Get over it.

You took that a little more personal than intended. It's was more tongue in cheek from a righty to my leftist friend.

BTW - I have many teachers in my family and I have taught and continue to teach - albeit a different platform. My butts been there and back again. I might also add private schools are from the robot isolationist you assume.

Edited January 7, 2010 by Smith

[Guest mosinon]

I can't even tell if this is anti US or not.

And that is crazy. high school kids doing something older folks just don't understand? That's never happened before. Back in my day we knew what the kids meant when they double tied their belts.

Teaching is a tough job. imagine you were in charge of thirty sub contractors and had to get the most out of them. I have actually done that and it isn't easy. Now imagine the subs aren't there for a check, they are there because they have to be there. I give you second grade. I couldn't do it so teachers get my respect.

[Guest Muttling]

Thanks for the reply Smith. No I didn't recognize the sarcasm, but I do LOVE sarcasm and apologize for not getting it.

Teaching is a tough job. imagine you were in charge of thirty sub contractors and had to get the most out of them. I have actually done that and it isn't easy. Now imagine the subs aren't there for a check, they are there because they have to be there. I give you second grade. I couldn't do it so teachers get my respect.

My first 15 years were as an environmental engineer doing consulting to the military. My small jobs had 7 subcontractors and it wasn't uncommon for me to have more than 20.

They were a royal PITA at times, but I had my contract clauses and could fire them or cost them a bunch of money. If I "fire" a student, it means I give them an F and it reflects poorly on my job performance. Try to imagine having a sub who doesn't do anything that is required by the contract, but you can't fire them or charge them for liquidated damages and their total NON performace still reflects upon YOU.

It's a very different environment, but I can change the rules if the rules aren't working. (Can't do that in consulting.)

Back to the original topic, the BIG issue is managing my classroom. Teens thrive on conflict and drama, but it hurts the learning. I can easily see how this tee shirt would up conflict and drama in the name of personal expression. The purpose of the school is teaching, not personal expression. Do we sacrafice our mission in the name of encouraging personal expression? How would No Child Left Behind or whatever program you want to implement view that? How is that appropriate at all?

If a student wants to express the views of this shirt, I'm all for it. However, I'm not for them doing it in a way that interupts the learning in my classroom and I think wearing it to school would.

Final Note: I'm hard core American and have a flag hanging from the ceiling in my classroom. I also have a class celebration of the birthday of the Marine Corps. I embrace my immigrant students, but I also do a number of other things to recognize America and we spend a lot of time looking at the math/science that played such a role in WWII.

Edited January 7, 2010 by Muttling