The Answer Is *NOT* Thug Tactics

[TGO David]

I am a bit saddened at some of the posts that I have seen on TGO subsequent to Chancellor Bonnyman's overturning of the restaurant carry provision for HCP holders.

Tempers are flaring, people are upset and emotion rather than calm, logical thought seems to be dictating some of what people are saying. Emotionally based, knee jerk reactions, are the domain of the weak minded. Why are we falling prey to this?

Case in point:

A contingent of TGO members feels that a "scorched earth" policy of boycotting any restaurant that serves beer or alcohol is in order. Think about that for a minute. Scorched Earth. Do you know where this term comes from? Do you understand the implications of enacting a policy that gives no regard to guilt or innocence but rather declares that a blanket punishment should be applied to everyone in a certain segment of business society?

I am appalled at this. I am appalled that any of our members think it is a good idea. This is a tactic that has been used by totalitarian regimes throughout history. It is a tool of repression and oppression. It is a tactic that creates fear and hatred. It is not a tool that wins the hearts and minds of those whom we desperately need as our allies.

There are plenty of restaurants that serve alcohol by the drink who have been on the side of the Tennessee HCP holder through this entire ordeal. There are plenty who did not exercise their right to prohibit carry. There are plenty who did not post that their restaurants were off limits, who refused to subscribe to the illogical, irrational, emotion-driven fears being dished out by the media.

Why do those restauranteers deserve to be punished? The answer is simple: They do not.

The concerned, angry gun owner need look no further than Tennessee's capitol hill to find a worthy target of his or her disdain. Place the blame and the consequence where it belongs, not on the backs of those who have either publicly or silently abided with us by not posting their eating establishments as off-limits to the gun owner.

Anything less than this is a pathetic exercise in "Thug Tactics" and most certainly will cost the cause of the gun owner in the months ahead. Mark my words.

[Guest Bronker]

Spot on, David.

Eloquently put and well-played.

[Guest HexHead]

The vast majority of restaurants that were silent, took our money and gave their tacit approval to what Rayburn et all were doing.

Look at what "playing nice" has gotten us?

[Metalhead]

took our money and gave their tacit approval to what Rayburn et all were doing.

Look at what "playing nice" has gotten us?

And you know this how? Calm down dude, the sky isnt falling yet.

[oldogy]

" The Answer Is *NOT* Thug Tactics"

Right on, David. That is for the present administration and Chicago politicians. It has no place in a Republic.

oldogy

[Guest HexHead]

And you know this how? Calm down dude, the sky isnt falling yet.

Where were the letters to the editors or comments from restaurant owners disagreeing with Rayburn's positions? I never saw ONE. All I saw was restaurant owner after restaurant owner agreeing with him in articles. Peter Demos may have backed down after all the nasty emails he received and didn't end up posting (same with the guy that owns Calhoun's) but you can bet they were silently behind Rayburn. Places like Paradise Ridge that originally posted, but took the sign down after a week or so of getting complaints are probably breathing a sigh of relief today.

Sorry Daniel, but the sky did fall yesterday. We had the right to carry into restaurants that served alcohol for 4 months and had that law ripped to shreds and thrown in our faces. To add insult to injury, it wasn't even because of one single incident of an HCP holder acting inappropriately. It's going to be a much tougher road to get that right back again now, you'll see.

We're facing a well connected, well funded adversary using the liberal's playbook, that if you can't win in the legislature, beat them in the courts. And with only the State representing our side, led by an Attorney General that's proven himself through recent decisions to be no friend of gun owners, and Bonneyman's court being the one that hears these types of cases, I don't see another outcome anytime soon. The plaintiff attorneys, buoyed by their win, lost no time in declaring they would continue the fight to circumvent the legislature on this issue. Contrast that with the AG office's not knowing if they even plan to appeal or not.

[Guest gunslinger707]

I am a bit saddened at some of the posts that I have seen on TGO subsequent to Chancellor Bonnyman's overturning of the restaurant carry provision for HCP holders.

Tempers are flaring, people are upset and emotion rather than calm, logical thought seems to be dictating some of what people are saying. Emotionally based, knee jerk reactions, are the domain of the weak minded. Why are we falling prey to this?

Case in point:

A contingent of TGO members feels that a "scorched earth" policy of boycotting any restaurant that serves beer or alcohol is in order. Think about that for a minute. Scorched Earth. Do you know where this term comes from? Do you understand the implications of enacting a policy that gives no regard to guilt or innocence but rather declares that a blanket punishment should be applied to everyone in a certain segment of business society?

I am appalled at this. I am appalled that any of our members think it is a good idea. This is a tactic that has been used by totalitarian regimes throughout history. It is a tool of repression and oppression. It is a tactic that creates fear and hatred. It is not a tool that wins the hearts and minds of those whom we desperately need as our allies.

There are plenty of restaurants that serve alcohol by the drink who have been on the side of the Tennessee HCP holder through this entire ordeal. There are plenty who did not exercise their right to prohibit carry. There are plenty who did not post that their restaurants were off limits, who refused to subscribe to the illogical, irrational, emotion-driven fears being dished out by the media.

Why do those restauranteers deserve to be punished? The answer is simple: They do not.

The concerned, angry gun owner need look no further than Tennessee's capitol hill to find a worthy target of his or her disdain. Place the blame and the consequence where it belongs, not on the backs of those who have either publicly or silently abided with us by not posting their eating establishments as off-limits to the gun owner.

Anything less than this is a pathetic exercise in "Thug Tactics" and most certainly will cost the cause of the gun owner in the months ahead. Mark my words.

Exactly!!! Let's start a"Scorched Earth" in the Capitol by working to unseat every anti gun politician serving currently..

[Guest HexHead]

" The Answer Is *NOT* Thug Tactics"

Right on, David. That is for the present administration and Chicago politicians. It has no place in a Republic.

oldogy

The Republic is on life support. Once the entitlement class is given their free healthcare and the number of people that don't have to pay taxes is raised that last few percentage points to 50%, voting will have as much meaning here as it does in Cuba, Venezuela or N. Korea.

[oldogy]

The Republic is on life support. Once the entitlement class is given their free healthcare and the number of people that don't have to pay taxes is raised that last few percentage points to 50%, voting will have as much meaning here as it does in Cuba, Venezuela or N. Korea.

In reality, you are so right. Damn scarry, ain't it!

oldogy

[TGO David]

The vast majority of restaurants that were silent, took our money and gave their tacit approval to what Rayburn et all were doing.

Look at what "playing nice" has gotten us?

If you really believe that this is the way to achieve a clean victory, then I feel sorry for you. But if you want to pursue it, you do not need my blessing to take it somewhere else and run it out as far as you can. It just isn't going to happen here where it can do nothing but damage the integrity of this forum.

Think for a moment: There are curent 5,677 other members of this forum beside you. Only a handful have voiced their support for your idea that every single alcohol-serving eating establishment should be blacklisted. Using your logic, the other 5,650-ish members are tacitly against your proposal.

Are they all off their rocker, or are you?

[TGO David]

Exactly!!! Let's start a"Scorched Earth" in the Capitol by working to unseat every anti gun politician serving currently..

A much more noble cause.

[macville]

Guys, if you want to make the restaurant/"bar" owners pay, this is what I suggest.... Write EVERY SINGLE Rep/Senator who voted for the bill in the first place and suggest that they support a bill that removes the restrictions on EVERY place that serves alcohol. Then suggest to them that if a business owner complains to them about it, tell them that they have the right to post via TN code 39-17-1359 and that's EXACTLY what that part of the code is there for. That way it takes pressure off the the rep and puts it where it should be...on the blasted business owner who wants to restrict your rights. Also remind them that you vote, and that other gun owners vote, and we will support them in every way we can.

If you want to get the jerks back, help push forward a law that hits them harder than the law that they were against the first time. Payback is a *itch!

Matthew

[Guest grimel]

I am a bit saddened at some of the posts that I have seen on TGO subsequent to Chancellor Bonnyman's overturning of the restaurant carry provision for HCP holders.

Tempers are flaring, people are upset and emotion rather than calm, logical thought seems to be dictating some of what people are saying. Emotionally based, knee jerk reactions, are the domain of the weak minded. Why are we falling prey to this?

Case in point:

A contingent of TGO members feels that a "scorched earth" policy of boycotting any restaurant that serves beer or alcohol is in order. Think about that for a minute. Scorched Earth. Do you know where this term comes from? Do you understand the implications of enacting a policy that gives no regard to guilt or innocence but rather declares that a blanket punishment should be applied to everyone in a certain segment of business society?

I am appalled at this. I am appalled that any of our members think it is a good idea. This is a tactic that has been used by totalitarian regimes throughout history. It is a tool of repression and oppression. It is a tactic that creates fear and hatred. It is not a tool that wins the hearts and minds of those whom we desperately need as our allies.

There are plenty of restaurants that serve alcohol by the drink who have been on the side of the Tennessee HCP holder through this entire ordeal. There are plenty who did not exercise their right to prohibit carry. There are plenty who did not post that their restaurants were off limits, who refused to subscribe to the illogical, irrational, emotion-driven fears being dished out by the media.

Why do those restauranteers deserve to be punished? The answer is simple: They do not.

The concerned, angry gun owner need look no further than Tennessee's capitol hill to find a worthy target of his or her disdain. Place the blame and the consequence where it belongs, not on the backs of those who have either publicly or silently abided with us by not posting their eating establishments as off-limits to the gun owner.

Anything less than this is a pathetic exercise in "Thug Tactics" and most certainly will cost the cause of the gun owner in the months ahead. Mark my words.

we had lots of restauranteers writing letters against the law. We had lots of restauranteers taking our money while it was legal. So, now, they get to not get my money. I'm not going into a victim dis-armament zone and paying to do so. If they can see a correlation between the law and their nightly receipts they will care. If they don't, they won't.

We play nice, we lose. They play not nice and get compromise after compromise. Squeaky wheel, grease and all that.

[Guest grimel]

I am a bit saddened at some of the posts that I have seen on TGO subsequent to Chancellor Bonnyman's overturning of the restaurant carry provision for HCP holders.

Tempers are flaring, people are upset and emotion rather than calm, logical thought seems to be dictating some of what people are saying. Emotionally based, knee jerk reactions, are the domain of the weak minded. Why are we falling prey to this?

Case in point:

A contingent of TGO members feels that a "scorched earth" policy of boycotting any restaurant that serves beer or alcohol is in order. Think about that for a minute. Scorched Earth. Do you know where this term comes from? Do you understand the implications of enacting a policy that gives no regard to guilt or innocence but rather declares that a blanket punishment should be applied to everyone in a certain segment of business society?

I am appalled at this. I am appalled that any of our members think it is a good idea. This is a tactic that has been used by totalitarian regimes throughout history. It is a tool of repression and oppression. It is a tactic that creates fear and hatred. It is not a tool that wins the hearts and minds of those whom we desperately need as our allies.

There are plenty of restaurants that serve alcohol by the drink who have been on the side of the Tennessee HCP holder through this entire ordeal. There are plenty who did not exercise their right to prohibit carry. There are plenty who did not post that their restaurants were off limits, who refused to subscribe to the illogical, irrational, emotion-driven fears being dished out by the media.

Why do those restauranteers deserve to be punished? The answer is simple: They do not.

The concerned, angry gun owner need look no further than Tennessee's capitol hill to find a worthy target of his or her disdain. Place the blame and the consequence where it belongs, not on the backs of those who have either publicly or silently abided with us by not posting their eating establishments as off-limits to the gun owner.

Anything less than this is a pathetic exercise in "Thug Tactics" and most certainly will cost the cause of the gun owner in the months ahead. Mark my words.

BTW, those aren't thug tactics. It's following the law. Are advocating I violate the law and go eat at places that supported us?

[JayC]

David,

While I'm in agreement that targeting all restaurant is a bad idea, because the vast majority of restaurant owners are either pro-2nd amendment or are at least not anti-2nd amendment.

BUT there are a number of businesses, police chiefs and lawmakers, which did actively campaign against this law, and did everything in their power to stop this law from going into effect that should be held accountable for either activities.

And with those folks, I'm all for a targeted boycott, or trying to prevent them from being re-elected, or pushing for their termination as police chief. And since these folks actively supported anti-2nd amendment lawsuits or actively fought pro-hcp legislation, I think every LEGAL avenue to cost them money, ruin their businesses reputation, or remove them from public office should be used by members of the HCP community.

I am a bit saddened at some of the posts that I have seen on TGO subsequent to Chancellor Bonnyman's overturning of the restaurant carry provision for HCP holders.

Tempers are flaring, people are upset and emotion rather than calm, logical thought seems to be dictating some of what people are saying. Emotionally based, knee jerk reactions, are the domain of the weak minded. Why are we falling prey to this?

Case in point:

A contingent of TGO members feels that a "scorched earth" policy of boycotting any restaurant that serves beer or alcohol is in order. Think about that for a minute. Scorched Earth. Do you know where this term comes from? Do you understand the implications of enacting a policy that gives no regard to guilt or innocence but rather declares that a blanket punishment should be applied to everyone in a certain segment of business society?

I am appalled at this. I am appalled that any of our members think it is a good idea. This is a tactic that has been used by totalitarian regimes throughout history. It is a tool of repression and oppression. It is a tactic that creates fear and hatred. It is not a tool that wins the hearts and minds of those whom we desperately need as our allies.

There are plenty of restaurants that serve alcohol by the drink who have been on the side of the Tennessee HCP holder through this entire ordeal. There are plenty who did not exercise their right to prohibit carry. There are plenty who did not post that their restaurants were off limits, who refused to subscribe to the illogical, irrational, emotion-driven fears being dished out by the media.

Why do those restauranteers deserve to be punished? The answer is simple: They do not.

The concerned, angry gun owner need look no further than Tennessee's capitol hill to find a worthy target of his or her disdain. Place the blame and the consequence where it belongs, not on the backs of those who have either publicly or silently abided with us by not posting their eating establishments as off-limits to the gun owner.

Anything less than this is a pathetic exercise in "Thug Tactics" and most certainly will cost the cause of the gun owner in the months ahead. Mark my words.

[Motasyco]

Before July I didn't eat at restaurants that served alcohol because I couldn't carry. After July I was able to enjoy eating at restaurants that served alcohol. Now I'm just back where I started. No "thug tactics" intended. It's not my intention to try to put someone out of business nor do I believe my business will make or break a restaurant. I won't leave my gun in the car just so I can eat at a restaurant that serves alcohol and I won't break the law. There are enough places to eat that don't serve alcohol that I have no fear of going hungry. The door was opened to me for a while and now it's been closed again. As a HCP holder I can and do carry. If I have a choice, I don't go where I can't carry. It's as simple as that. I don't see how this makes me a bad guy.

[extremescene]

BTW, those aren't thug tactics. It's following the law.

maybe not thug tactics as we generally think of them, but a scorched earth boycott is definitely reckless and while I feel the entire thing would go largely or entirely unnoticed, the intent is to harm many innocent businesses that did nothing to hurt our culture or restrict our privileges in their establishments.

I'm just as frustrated as anyone, but this entire argument is ridiculous and shows severe lack of rational thought.

[dunndw]

I want a list of every owner who was behind this BS

[eapking]

We all need to chill. We're going to get this back, and maybe an improved version at that. It just might take a few months. We need to take the high road as law abiding HCP holders. That's why we got our permits in the first place, because we take the high road when it comes to the law.

[JayC]

We all need to chill. We're going to get this back, and maybe an improved version at that. It just might take a few months. We need to take the high road as law abiding HCP holders. That's why we got our permits in the first place, because we take the high road when it comes to the law.

I disagree taking the high road is what leads to stupid rulings and lawsuits like this... People who are for taking our rights away should be held accountable for their actions...

If you vote against 2nd amendment or pro-hcp legislation you need to have your political career ended, if you file a lawsuit to stop all citizens from carrying, your business needs to suffer, and if you support lobbyists to try and keep pro-gun laws from being passed your name and businesses name should be on a list.

This IS how the other side fights these battles, it's time for us to get smart and not forget who is trying to keep our rights from being restored.

[Guest truthsayer]

Saul Alinsky had some great ideas for dealing with ideological battles not unlike the one we're facing. Middling apologist ideals and hoping that the powers that be have our best interests at heart is, in my judgment, closer to doing nothing than it is anything else.

[Guest grimel]

maybe not thug tactics as we generally think of them, but a scorched earth boycott is definitely reckless and while I feel the entire thing would go largely or entirely unnoticed, the intent is to harm many innocent businesses that did nothing to hurt our culture or restrict our privileges in their establishments.

I'm just as frustrated as anyone, but this entire argument is ridiculous and shows severe lack of rational thought.

No, the severe lack of rational thought is by those who think somehow I need to be breaking the law to not punish those who didn't actively campaign against me.

[Guest bkelm18]

Who said anything about breaking laws? I don't recall seeing that in David's post. Personally, I agree. It's frightening how a minor setback in gun rights sparks off a torrent of irrationality and skewed, ill-conceived thoughts. Playing dirty is not the answer. Taking the high road is. Somebody has to. They fought us with the system and won, now it's our turn to do the same. This is how government works. It's high time some of us realize that. Nobody said you had to like it. If you don't like it, take it out at the voting booth, not on innocent bystanders, like some of these restaurants that supported us in the past months. Don't want to eat where you can't carry? Good for you! Nobody said you had to! Will I eat in places that require me to disarm? Yep! Good for me! Damn I missed this place.

[Semiauto]

Gentlemen, may your chains rest lightly upon thee.

[Motasyco]

I've yet to experience dining in a Tennessee restaurant that was exceptional enough to make me want to disarm to eat there. The good stuff comes from my kitchen. No, that's not an invitation.