HK reverses decision, will sell semi 416 & 417 to civilans...

[creeky]

From HKpro...

As of now, and as has been rumored for several weeks on the Internet, HKPRO.COM can report with accuracy that HK has indeed reversed that decision, and has decided to introduce to the market, a civilian legal version of the HK416 and HK417!

At the time of this writing, the information is very preliminary and it should be noted that HK is quite a way from being able to deliver on this decision.

This could still fall apart... but i must say... I am surprised that HK is looking

into doing this. They said they wouldn't, and now are.

I wonder how much they will cost though.

Full articale here:

http://hkpro.com/hkpro416civilianannouncement.htm

[BimmerFreak]

Thats great for HK fans, but it absolutely sucks for all those fools that paid 4500-5500 for the 416 upper

[creeky]

Thats great for HK fans, but it absolutely sucks for all those fools that paid 4500-5500 for the 416 upper

And you thought you heard people moan and groan when apple cut the

iPhone by $200 bucks. Yikes! There will be nashing of teeth and bleed'n

out the anus over that! LOL!!!

I'm thinking complete rifles will start at the $1800 dollar range. If so

they could have gotten about 3 complete rifles for the price of what those uppers have been going for. Ouch...

I must say... even though I own a measly little USP compact... I have rearly seen such die hard brand loyality like I have with Hks. Well... except for macs...

[molonlabetn]

The 416/417 is cool and all... but I fail to see how it is worth the extra cost over, say, a RobArms XCR or Sig 556 which are arguably more robust piston guns.

I dunno... for the average civvie shooter who will not be doing full-auto mag dumps, going through thousands of rounds of dirty ammo in a sitting, or crawling in the mud... I see zero benefit over the simplicity and accuracy of the original Stoner DI gas setup, which is one of the main beauties of the AR platform. I'd much rather buy an AK (which I did), or simply clean the gun more often and save my money for ammo, etc.

[Marswolf]

I must say... even though I own a measly little USP compact... I have rearly seen such die hard brand loyality like I have with Hks.

Well, H&Ks only come in two flavors - good and gooder.

[Cruel Hand Luke]

Article says not likely available until 2009.....wonder if who will be in the White House then will have any effect on this?.....Don't get your hopes up yet guys.

[towerclimber37]

Mark@sea and I had a discussion about this thread...

I think this was some of the conclusions we came up with.

and one especially for Mars!

[Marswolf]

If it don't have a hammer, it ain't a real handgun.

[creeky]

Here is a link to the a blog about the "HK: Because yousuck" stuff.

Guy makes some pretty good points in a really funny way.

http://larrycorreia.wordpress.com/2007/10/09/hk-because-you-suck-and-we-hate-you/

[Marswolf]

Just sounds like a lot of Heckler envy to go with their penis envy.

Oh yeah, I do sorta agree about the G3. That's why H&K decided to not continue manufacture of it, I guess.

Actually, I've been shooting a bunch of H&Ks this past week. Fantastic weapons. And yes they are expensive and H&K couldn't care less whether mere mortals like them or not.

[creeky]

And yes they are expensive and H&K couldn't care less whether mere mortals like them or not.

I'm hoping (in vain maybe) that with a release of semi-416s and such that this might be a signal that HK is starting to change it's position on the cilvian market.

Unfortunitely I haven't shot any Hk's except for my own.

I've wanted to try the MP5, but just haven't had a good oppurtunity.

[towerclimber37]

well..I've had it from someone who test fired the USPs'...he said it shot RINGS around a standard 1911.....literally. heheh I'll go with the 1911 for 900 dollars less, please Alex.

and I could care less if the Germans like it or not..we kicked the crap out of them how many times so far?

[Joseg]

I'm hoping (in vain maybe) that with a release of

I've wanted to try the MP5, but just haven't had a good oppurtunity.

OnTarget rents them, trust me it's a really nice SMG especially the MP5SD, but it will get old after a while..

Nothing like going click and wondering it you broke it or something and having a few holes on the target..

[creeky]

I've heard a lot of nice things about "On Target". I'll have to venture down ther eone

day. It seems I'm always heading in the other direction.

[Marswolf]

well..I've had it from someone who test fired the USPs'...he said it shot RINGS around a standard 1911.....literally. heheh

The USP 45 is BIG! And the DA trigger on the USP sucks. But the SA trigger is very nice. To be fair, the DA does smooth out after a while but I doubt it would ever become pleasant. I use it only for emergency firing. Since it's so easy to cock and de-cock the USP, it isn't a problem.

I got used to the size of the Beretta 92 with wooden factory grips, so the size of the USP 40 wasn't a problem for me.

I've said before that you need to get the USP out and practice with it at least once a month (at least for me). But if you do that, the accuracy is very good. If you don't.... But it's the user, not the weapon that is the problem. The weapon is super-repeatable.

I've run through a bunch of guns for "business purposes." Of maybe a dozen I've carried at one time or another, two of the ones I've kept are H&Ks. The other two are the Beretta 92SB and the Kel-Tec P3AT.

Choosing a H&K isn't not a matter of snob appeal or professional appearance, although that is one of the things I look at when doing a quick appraisal of likely professionalism. H&Ks have quality manufacture and professional features. You pay for that, of course, and frankly, most people probably don't need to spend the extra money for H&K quality. A plastic trigger probably works just fine for most people, rather than paying extra for the polymer encased metal trigger on the USP. Unless you get a magnet and check out the USP, you likely won't even know the trigger is metal. But it is, and you pay extra for its design and execution.

The more you learn about H&Ks, the more you understand why they cost more and why they are professional class weapons - and why some other guns that look good, are not as professional in their design and quality of manufacture.

It's sort of like cooking equipment. You can use a $35 set of Ginsu knives for quite a while, but if you are really into cooking you might want to eventually buy Wüsthof at $75 or more per knife. And $125 for a Calphalon frying pan doesn't seem ridiculous after you use one for a while and understand why they are expensive. Quality costs.

Same with a professional use firearm.

I like my inexpensive Rock Island 1911 a lot. Probably more than my Wilson Combat. But I wouldn't trust my life to either weapon, given a choice. You can certainly get by with lesser weapons, but if you can use the best why not do that?

And I got to fire about 300 rounds through a MP5 this morning.

[creeky]

And I got to fire about 300 rounds through a MP5 this morning.

That was cold man... stone cold.

[Marswolf]

Didn't take long....

[Marswolf]

Got a chance to fire a few rounds today including out of one of these:

H&K MP7 A1

Rate of fire - 950 rpm. Fun fun fun!

I got to thinking about what I wrote before. I wasn't trying to say that you had to have a H&K to be considered "professional." Even I'm not that anal retentive.

Lots of good guns out there carried by very professional people. H&K, FN, Beretta, and yes...even that ugly Austrian thing.

[Guest someguy12341]

My first gun was an HK USPc in 40sw. Still have it, and enjoy it, although the Sig P220c is now my primary.

HK is great stuff, but they pooched it with the 416. I'm sure they'll sell by the truckload, if they aren't banned by then. However, by releasing it when they did and basically restricting it for so long, they've allowed others to innovate up to or above the level of the 416. POF, LWRC and others are all making piston uppers that have fewer moving parts, are made in the US, and are sold by companies whose customer service makes a mockery of HKs. (Let's face it - HK's service makes a mockery of itself.) I just ordered my first (of several, more than likely) LWRC; an SRT upper in 6.8. Their forums have several posts from professional operators (SWAT, SF, other) who own both the 416 and either an LWRC or other and have compared them exhaustively.

Bottom line; I think HK just waited too darn long.