Underground shelter

[Mark@Sea]

With delivery/setup, it'll run about 3K. Then add a little for gravel underneath, and a bit of block work to build a stairwell down to it, and whatever its' gonna cost me for a heck of a lot of fill dirt.

[Guest SUNTZU]

You could always extend your range and get the fill dirt from there.

[Guest 3pugguy]

Got a phone # or e-mail?

I have a fair sized sinkhole on the property. Figured I would put it in along one side and cover it up. It'd be at least 5 or 6 feet deep, maybe more. I could use block to build a passageway.

Be sure to check the local regs on sink holes - it might even be be state law. There were some recent problems with sink holes and flooding and who "owned" the problem over here in the Clarksville area. I recall something in the article about filling in or otherwise disturbing the sink hole and laws against it. Sorry I don't recall, but you might could find it on the Leaf Chronicle site.

[Mark@Sea]

No way I could fill the thing in. It is a good 150x100x20-25 feet. Anyway, the wife says the sinkhole is too far from the house....

[Mike.357]

I think facing the house, off to the right between the house and garage would be a good spot. Near the house, but on a hillside. The doorway could face out onto the hill. Plant some vines and they will eventually cover over the front of it for some concealment.

[Guest 3pugguy]

No way I could fill the thing in. It is a good 150x100x20-25 feet. Anyway, the wife says the sinkhole is too far from the house....

I keep toying with putting a storm shelter in the garage, but have a hard time justifying the 7K or so for the one I want - then everytime we get bad storms in this area, I think of it again...

[Mark@Sea]

Yeah, know what you mean. Primary use for this, though, is as a 'root cellar'. It should stay cool enough year 'round for storage of canned goods and whatnot.

We lost power at the house a couple of days ago, actually - trees down across the lines. Power was out all day. Last big winter storm a few years ago it was out for 3 days.

Sometimes, collecting old gasoline appliances comes in handy

[Guest 3pugguy]

Yeah, know what you mean. Primary use for this, though, is as a 'root cellar'. It should stay cool enough year 'round for storage of canned goods and whatnot.

We lost power at the house a couple of days ago, actually - trees down across the lines. Power was out all day. Last big winter storm a few years ago it was out for 3 days.

Sometimes, collecting old gasoline appliances comes in handy

Sorry for the lag in response - have had some server issues!

A root cellar would be great; we are adding to our garden each year and that would be a great idea for a way to store taters and onions, plus a good place for canned goods.

Plus the benefit of storm hidey-hole. I hadn't thought of that, so maybe I should look into it; good thinking!

[Guest Red Legs]

I keep toying with putting a storm shelter in the garage, but have a hard time justifying the 7K or so for the one I want - then everytime we get bad storms in this area, I think of it again...

4 - 5 thousand should be the max you spend on a Texas tech approved shelter with installation. The Barger shelter meets that.

[Chief07]

Interesting. I am thinking a dual purpose shelter.I need a root celler for tatters, apples and other fruit.A storm shelter is always a good idea.You never know

[Guest dart67eb]

I read that shipping containers are cheap nowadays but you have to reinforce the sides.

[Bubba0031]

Barger and Sons is in Harriman, TN. They are #1 in the #2 business. Being a utility guy here in Oak Ridge I use them both as a contractor and supplier. I have used some of their septic tanks as under ground meter vaults and they work perfectly.

[JW3Percent]

Please remember that when you are designing an underground (confined space) facility that you need a MINIMUM of TWO modes of egress. Do not allow yourself to become trapped in your shelter. buried alive=fail

[Guest Austin454]

Just a thought. But even 2 feet below surface will hold at a steady temperature in most parts of the state. Another thing to think of if you are planning to use this storm shelter for storage is do you want it to be dry or moist. Traditional root cellars are higher in humidity, whereas a dry storage will serve most people better. And before you bury a minivan remeber to consider the structural integrity. For instance some people who have buried shipping containers have had bad experiences with them collapsing with a full load of their belongings inside. Just my 2 cents

[Moped]

Something made out of concrete would be more structurally sound.

[Guest 73challenger]

That is such a good idea. I love these storm shelters. I would really like to have one of these when I am in a position to build a house. Do you guys think someone could be a underground range with some of those 3-4ft diameter concrete pipe? I have dreamed about doing this for along time. I would think if lead free ammo was used it would be a lot easier to ventilate.

[Louisb]

A big ol +10 on what Garufa said.

Sink holes are a good thing to avoid, including the depression around them.

I think you can get thermal stability in a shallower hole considering you are going to need relative easy access to get canned goods in and out, especially in.

I suggest a steel framed steel door opening IN and cast concrete or rebar in concrete filled block construction.

Good drainage around and above the site will be a must.

Food storage and someplace to go when you hear a freight train coming sounds like a plan.

Remember soome sort of long lasting lighting and antenna for a radio when you are in the "hole".

[Guest 85rx-7gsl-se]

Mom & the wife have been canning alot too.

Conex boxes work.

check these out... Survival Center - Underground Shelters

"Starting at $69,995.00 plus delivery and installation." :shock:

Edited November 12, 2010 by 85rx-7gsl-se

[Guest Red Legs]

For the user wanting to use pipe, use manhole sections layer on the side.

Two entry points on a shelter should not be needed. Let friends and family know that's where you will be in an emergency.

Septic tanks in TN generally have 2.5" thin walls. Barger and sons has single compartment septic tanks up tp 8" thick that i can find oon their website that are big enough to park a few cars in. Most septic manufacturers don't use rebar to reinforce their tanks and you should steer clear of these.

It seems that traffic rated tanks at bargerandsons.com could be used in a garage basement floor application. Should be a good question to ask them.

I know the Barger's are pro gun because they are big sporting clay guys. I see them often at Chillhowee.

[Guest Austin454]

Just an additional thought for those planning on using pre-made concrete sections. Depending on the size those can be 600-thousands of dollars each. A cheaper but more labor intesive soluiton is to go to a concrete block plant and buy "seconds". These are blocks that have a slight chip or a crack. Typically you can buy them for .75 cents each as opposed to the 1.10-1.30 you would pay for the same 8" block at a big box. If you have access to earth moving equipment or are not afraid of a huge amount of shoveling and you use seconds with a poured concrete ceiling, and floor and fill your walls with concrete. At current prices you can build a building 8x20x9(internals are slightly smaller because of block width) for around $1,800.00. Thats including your waterproofing and gravel for backfill. Plus a solid concrete shelter is VERY secure. For additional security why not build it on level ground and put in a top access door. Stick a Storage shed on top to add camouflage.

Edited November 19, 2010 by Austin454

[Guest Red Legs]

Texas Tech showed on the Discovery channel 2x4's going through a block wall with little resistance. Scary. Fill them block with concrete and maybe someone has a video.

Just an additional thought for those planning on using pre-made concrete sections. Depending on the size those can be 600-thousands of dollars each. A cheaper but more labor intesive soluiton is to go to a concrete block plant and buy "seconds". These are blocks that have a slight chip or a crack. Typically you can buy them for .75 cents each as opposed to the 1.10-1.30 you would pay for the same 8" block at a big box. If you have access to earth moving equipment or are not afraid of a huge amount of shoveling and you use seconds with a poured concrete ceiling, and floor and fill your walls with concrete. At current prices you can build a building 8x20x9(internals are slightly smaller because of block width) for around $1,800.00. Thats including your waterproofing and gravel for backfill. Plus a solid concrete shelter is VERY secure. For additional security why not build it on level ground and put in a top access door. Stick a Storage shed on top to add camouflage.

[Guest Austin454]

TCLouis.... Well said. A thought.. Digging into a hillside can provide access along one wall and good thermal insulation along the other three.

Texas Tech showed on the Discovery channel 2x4's going through a block wall with little resistance. Scary. Fill them block with concrete and maybe someone has a video.

I hadn't seen about the study, but I can easily see how a 2x4 could go through a standard block wall. For our family's storm shelter we filled the walls with concrete added an offset entrance hallway made of railroad timbers and covered the whole thing with over two feet of dirt. The sides and back are more like 50' of dirt. Basically it would take a MAJOR storm or an aggressor with H.E. to breach it. Not bad for less than it would have cost to buy 2 sections of manhole culvert.

Edited November 20, 2010 by Austin454

[Guest Red Legs]

Texas Tech recognizes that a 3" thick concrete wall with rebar reinforcing (#3 rebar each way) will stop a 2x4 at 100 mph. By stop I mean completely stop it.

Manholes are commonly produced in 4', 5', 6', 8', and 10' inside diameters. 4' and 6' being the most used. An 11' foot tall manhole would run around $1200.

[Garufa]

Something to think about....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4drosYSvBz0&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AMClf5zqG0A&feature=related

[Guest Austin454]

Texas Tech recognizes that a 3" thick concrete wall with rebar reinforcing (#3 rebar each way) will stop a 2x4 at 100 mph. By stop I mean completely stop it.

Manholes are commonly produced in 4', 5', 6', 8', and 10' inside diameters. 4' and 6' being the most used. An 11' foot tall manhole would run around $1200.

That's a much better price than I could get through connections with Lo Jac. Plus Manholes and storm culverts may be that deep but normally are only 2 feet wide per section. If you have different info I would love to have it. The next time I build one of these I would prefer to use something prefab if I can find it cheaper than building it myself.