Will you allow concealed carry?

[Guest boatme99]

Please stop asking restraunt employees about carrying. It just makes them think about signing. Concealed means "hidden". If you'e concealed, they'll never know.

If they do post a legal sign, then talk to the manager and corporate and tell them you and 200,000 other people wil be going elsewhere to spend our money.

I think all the hoopla will die down in about a year, and almost nobody will care anymore. That's what happened in Florida.

Remember the old saying: Never argue with a pig, it just frustrates you, and angers the pig.

[BrasilNuts]

I agree with the boatme99.

If you just have to know if XYZ bar and grill is going to post just look at one of their stores in a state where carry is permited and see if it is posted. For the love of God don't ask your server.

[analog_kidd]

I don't know. If they are going to post, they have already made up their mind. If they are riding the fence, then an articulate, well-mannered, cool headed HCP holder may be able to sway them over. I'd rather find out now how they feel. Why continue to support a business that I am definitely not welcome in?

Once they go through the trouble of posting, you'll never convince them to remove the sign. So if you take a wait and see approach, it may become too late.

Just my $.02

[whiskey]

I don't know. If they are going to post, they have already made up their mind. If they are riding the fence, then an articulate, well-mannered, cool headed HCP holder may be able to sway them over. I'd rather find out now how they feel. Why continue to support a business that I am definitely not welcome in?

You are assuming that the manager is a cool headed, logical person capable of having an intelligent conversation.

The difference in Florida is that there is no "posting signs". Business owners aren't allowed to post their restaurants off limits.

The only way I would approach a manager or owner is if I had a relationship with them already and knew what to expect from them.

[Guest KevinM]

I don't know. If they are going to post, they have already made up their mind.

Dunno about that. Plenty of fence sitters around. My roommate works for Big River downtown and she made it sound like they were undecided. Sounds like the ownership aren't gun people but also do not want to piss of people that are...That is why I think there are some vested interests that don't want to have to post because it will show their political stripes.

[Guest Alpha Dog]

I agree with boatme99.

If you want to know if a restaurant is going to allow guns...LOOK AT THE DOOR!!

[Wingshooter]

No doubt there are some restaurant owners/managers that don't follow state politics and the news as closely as we do. Some might not even care about this issue or know too much about it until we start asking. I don't know, but I am inclined to just wait and see who posts. If they don't post by July 14, I doubt they will. If they do post, then I will complain.

I seems like bringing up the question of whether or not an establishment will post also alerts them to the fact that they can post.

<----- mine.

[JayC]

Dunno about that. Plenty of fence sitters around. My roommate works for Big River downtown and she made it sound like they were undecided. Sounds like the ownership aren't gun people but also do not want to piss of people that are...That is why I think there are some vested interests that don't want to have to post because it will show their political stripes.

+1 4% of the general population, much larger chunk of the 21+ population... Nobody in this economy wants to upset what could be a 5-7% bump in sales, or worse cause a 5-7% drop in sales.

[analog_kidd]

You are assuming that the manager is a cool headed, logical person capable of having an intelligent conversation.

The difference in Florida is that there is no "posting signs". Business owners aren't allowed to post their restaurants off limits.

The only way I would approach a manager or owner is if I had a relationship with them already and knew what to expect from them.

If they're not cool-headed and logical, then nothing you say, before or after they post, will make them change their mind. But now you know where they stand, and you can beat the July rush on boycotting their establishment by getting a head start.

[analog_kidd]

Dunno about that. Plenty of fence sitters around. My roommate works for Big River downtown and she made it sound like they were undecided. Sounds like the ownership aren't gun people but also do not want to piss of people that are...That is why I think there are some vested interests that don't want to have to post because it will show their political stripes.

Well, if they are fence sitters, then they are already aware of the new law. If we show them how responsible we are and how we are just regular guys and gals, then maybe they will fall over to our side of the fence.

I still think there are very few owners who are unaware of the law. Just ask around your work, or some of your non-gun owning friends if they have heard about it. I bet most of them have, and they aren't in the business. So just ignoring it and hoping for the best is nieve. Once they post, it's all over. They won't undo all that they went through to get the sign up. But if we convince them before hand to change their mind, we'll all be better off.

[Guest stovepipe]

Analog, be careful. I asked my bank about carrying years ago. A couple of weeks later it was posted. The Mgr didn't have an opinion either way, until I opened my mouth.

Gun boards are full of storys of "backfired" good intentions, when it comes to asking a business owner to take a pro gun stance... It's best to take the classic "let a sleeping dog lie" approach.

[JayC]

Analog, be careful. I asked my bank about carrying years ago. A couple of weeks later it was posted. The Mgr didn't have an opinion either way, until I opened my mouth.

Gun boards are full of storys of "backfired" good intentions, when it comes to asking a business owner to take a pro gun stance... It's best to take the classic "let a sleeping dog lie" approach.

I'd be looking for a new bank the next day...

[analog_kidd]

Analog, be careful. I asked my bank about carrying years ago. A couple of weeks later it was posted. The Mgr didn't have an opinion either way, until I opened my mouth.

Gun boards are full of storys of "backfired" good intentions, when it comes to asking a business owner to take a pro gun stance... It's best to take the classic "let a sleeping dog lie" approach.

I'm not talking about raising the question for a place that's already legal and there are no upcoming issues that may change that. What my point is, is that this is a new law, and these restaurant owners most certainly are aware of it. The anti's are definitely going to be speaking their mind about it, so we should too. Once they post, it'll be too late to try to convince anyone.

[Guest stovepipe]

I understand where you are coming from, but I don't think, other than maybe a handful of rabid anti gunners, there is a big movement to push for signage. Since most people carry concealed, and with the July 14 waiting period, I think it's going to be a relatively smooth transition and non-event. If you start asking the question to restaurant owners, and they in turn start asking their spouses, biz partners, lawyers, and customers, I think many will post out of an uneducated knee jerk reaction, just to be safe.<O:p

<O:p

If a restaurant does post, they can un-post as well. I’ve made that happen before, too, with a large home improvement store.<O:p

[JayC]

I'm not talking about raising the question for a place that's already legal and there are no upcoming issues that may change that. What my point is, is that this is a new law, and these restaurant owners most certainly are aware of it. The anti's are definitely going to be speaking their mind about it, so we should too. Once they post, it'll be too late to try to convince anyone.

I disagree once a place has been posted there is nothing you can do about it. We can and should as a community place pressure on any business that chooses to post. Requesting that all HCP holders email the business in question and complain about them posting and how that will cost them business as well as make their business a criminal safe zone.

Also posting lists/reviews on websites showing which restaurant don't want HCP holders doing business with them... Posting negative reviews on 'restaurant review' sites telling regular customers how this policy makes the restaurant less safe, how it's not in a safe area of town, how their food isn't any good...

This is one area that the liberal activists in this country do a much better job than we generally do... We need to take a page from their play-book and place reasonable pressure on businesses which want to disarm us and make criminal safe zones to change their minds.

How many anti's do you think they're hearing from? Most businesses probably half a dozen maybe a dozen... We can carpet bomb any business with 200?, 500?, 1000? emails in a week... Causing the business owner to think the majority of people are against their move by a factor of 10x to 100x...

You must keep in mind for the average anti-gunner they have nothing at stake in preventing you from carrying into a restaurant, they hear the news media and can't properly determine risk for themselves, but few are even willing to visit an anti-gun forum on the Internet over it, even fewer are going to ask their favorite restaurant to do anything about it... 6 months from now they'll have some other news generated worry to focus on.

While the average HCP holder has spent 200-400 Dollars on getting thier permit, probably that again at least on a pistol and holster to carry... Now fewer bother to be active on websites such as TGO and TFA but it gives those of us the ability to coordinate and express our views that criminal safe zones aren't a good business plan.

I know for a fact that certain at large councilmembers received 100's of pro-carry emails in a matter of a couple of days, while only receiving a couple dozen anti-carry emails in that same period. We can have an impact on businesses who incorrectly choose to make their establishment a criminal safe zone.

[Guest HexHead]

One thing to add Jay, most anti's that do contact the restaurants are only paying lip service. They may say they won't patronize the place unless it posts, but my guess is very few would actually follow through with that. That would require having a backbone.

Piss off a large group of HCP holders with a sign and I'm sure as a group many more of us truly will boycott the place while the sign stands.

[Guest AmericanWorkMule]

I agree with these guys. I also would like to find out before I gave them anymore business. Don't ask the server, they might disagree and spit in your Sweet Iced Tea?

I agree with the boatme99.

If you just have to know if XYZ bar and grill is going to post just look at one of their stores in a state where carry is permitted and see if it is posted. For the love of God don't ask your server.

[Guest crotalus01]

I will not ask, but I damn sure will tell them I will no longer give them my business if they post. My landlord gave me a gift certificate to Boscos for Christmas, I took my GF last week, they had a generic gun slash sign in the window. We went in, ate, I asked for the manager and told him to let the owner know I would never darken their door again as long as that sign was up, and would have walked that night had I not had a gift card.

I did not point out the sign was not legally binding - I know their intentions and that is enough for me to never go there again until it is removed (DAMN am I gonna miss that encrusted Ahi Tuna)...

[Guest Satt]

I will carry (concealed) where I damn well please (except the obvious highly illegal places). All these silly signs mean nothing to me. If noone knows, noone cares. Just my .

[Guest mustangdave]

I will carry (concealed) where I damn well please (except the obvious highly illegal places). All these silly signs mean nothing to me. If noone knows, noone cares. Just my .

I LIKE your ATTITUDE:death:

[Guest benchpresspower]

I will carry (concealed) where I damn well please (except the obvious highly illegal places). All these silly signs mean nothing to me. If noone knows, noone cares. Just my .

I LIKE your AVATAR!!

[Guest ncc74656b]

I will carry (concealed) where I damn well please (except the obvious highly illegal places). All these silly signs mean nothing to me. If noone knows, noone cares. Just my .

If you are caught, what's the penalty for you?

[Fallguy]

If you are caught, what's the penalty for you?

Depends on the location.

Here are some examples

Violation of 39-17-1359 sign $500 fine

Illegal carry in park, up to 11 months and 29 days in jail and up to a $2500 fine.

School grounds, up to 6 years in prison and up to $3000 fine.

[DaveTN]

For someone to not be aware of the changes and be part of the decision making process about whether or not the business is posted; they would have to be living in a cave. I doubt that is the case for many restaurant managers.

Don't be afraid to speak out. We are a very small group, the idea that we could have any financial impact on a restaurant is ridiculous. Information and conversation will go much farther than idle threats that have no teeth.

[LagerHead]

Along the lines of this thread, I can't seem to find a thread that has a list of restaurants that post. I would like to suggest a sticky thread, like the ones announcing July 14th get-togethers, that list anti-gun restaurants. In my view it would also include, if available, manager's name, phone number, e-mail address, etc. so we can contact them en masse and let them know they are losing business.