body armor

[nightrunner]

are you? reason i ask is i looked into it a little while back and found out its not practical to wear every day unless you are practically forced to. i want one simply to have it in case i need it a level II for lite occasions and a level IIIA with ceramic trauma plates if im expecting needing it against highly penetrating pistol or rifles

directed at "justme"

also c.a.s., would you wear BA daily if you had it?

[Guest c.a.s.]

You're obviously forgetting that less than 1% of the US population is in the military - this means the need for body armor by civilians would have to be 100x greater than the military to be equal.

Speaking of which, is there STILL not progress on replacing the old armor overseas or improving on it?

[nightrunner]

Speaking of which, is there STILL not progress on replacing the old armor overseas or improving on it?

some units tested dragonskin but i think they deemed it too heavy to wear all day even though it can with stand a frag grenade to the chest with no penetration.

[Punisher84]

C.A.S, physical age may not mean much and from your past posts on here I will give you the credit of saying you are very mature and intelligent for your age. Take that compliment.

Now, take this criticism, there is a wisdom that comes with age and there is a wisdom that comes with experience. I have lived 24 years, but I have done things alot have not. I have served in the military, I have been shot at, I have been stabbed, I have chased, fought with, subdued, and arrested criminals.

I still do not want to wear a vest off-duty. You may also notice the absence of a badge symbol by my username, I have done most of the above as a private security officer. The rest has happened as a civilian.

I understand your "Brady Campaign arguments" argument, but what you are missing is not that we are saying no one besides a cop or military or security officer should own body armor, but questioning the thought process of someone who views their everyday life as being that dangerous.

Justme can make all the arguments he wants about violent crime etc, but in the grand scheme of things members of our military and law enforcement communities are much more likely to be injured or killed by criminals then the average citizen.

I don't expect you to change your thoughts on what I say alone, but you also won't change my mind because I've been there and done it. When you can buy a vest and want to wear it/have it do it because you can and because you want it. That's about all I got.

[Guest c.a.s.]

are you? reason i ask is i looked into it a little while back and found out its not practical to wear every day unless you are practically forced to. i want one simply to have it in case i need it a level II for lite occasions and a level IIIA with ceramic trauma plates if im expecting needing it against highly penetrating pistol or rifles

directed at "justme"

Comfort can highly lean on the ambient environment. I can imagine it's extremely uncomfortable to wear in heat. Scratch that, I KNOW it is because me and a large group of students tried out a Level II vest brought in by the teacher (Criminal Justice II) the last week of school, unluckily on the hottest day that week.

Body type might also play a part. I don't think any would really be comfortable on me, because of my somewhat odd body type.

Price is also another big factor. It all depends on how much you're willing to spend.

[willis68]

C.A.S, physical age may not mean much and from your past posts on here I will give you the credit of saying you are very mature and intelligent for your age. Take that compliment.

Now, take this criticism, there is a wisdom that comes with age and there is a wisdom that comes with experience. I have lived 24 years, but I have done things alot have not. I have served in the military, I have been shot at, I have been stabbed, I have chased, fought with, subdued, and arrested criminals.

I still do not want to wear a vest off-duty. You may also notice the absence of a badge symbol by my username, I have done most of the above as a private security officer. The rest has happened as a civilian.

I understand your "Brady Campaign arguments" argument, but what you are missing is not that we are saying no one besides a cop or military or security officer should own body armor, but questioning the thought process of someone who views their everyday life as being that dangerous.

Justme can make all the arguments he wants about violent crime etc, but in the grand scheme of things members of our military and law enforcement communities are much more likely to be injured or killed by criminals then the average citizen.

I don't expect you to change your thoughts on what I say alone, but you also won't change my mind because I've been there and done it. When you can buy a vest and want to wear it/have it do it because you can and because you want it. That's about all I got.

Exactly!

[Guest c.a.s.]

some units tested dragonskin but i think they deemed it too heavy to wear all day even though it can with stand a frag grenade to the chest with no penetration.

I heard it was recalled for some issue like it was falling apart or something.

[Guest c.a.s.]

C.A.S, physical age may not mean much and from your past posts on here I will give you the credit of saying you are very mature and intelligent for your age. Take that compliment.

Now, take this criticism, there is a wisdom that comes with age and there is a wisdom that comes with experience. I have lived 24 years, but I have done things alot have not. I have served in the military, I have been shot at, I have been stabbed, I have chased, fought with, subdued, and arrested criminals.

I still do not want to wear a vest off-duty. You may also notice the absence of a badge symbol by my username, I have done most of the above as a private security officer. The rest has happened as a civilian.

I understand your "Brady Campaign arguments" argument, but what you are missing is not that we are saying no one besides a cop or military or security officer should own body armor, but questioning the thought process of someone who views their everyday life as being that dangerous.

Justme can make all the arguments he wants about violent crime etc, but in the grand scheme of things members of our military and law enforcement communities are much more likely to be injured or killed by criminals then the average citizen.

I don't expect you to change your thoughts on what I say alone, but you also won't change my mind because I've been there and done it. When you can buy a vest and want to wear it/have it do it because you can and because you want it. That's about all I got.

Can you prove that they are more likely, you know, SOLID NUMBERS. Last time I checked, there were far more citizens injured and killed than police/security officers.

According to the National Law Enforcement Officers Memorial Fund, only 54 police officers were shot to death in 2007, and that was a RECORD number, a 59% increase from '06.

It may be their job, bit Citizens still get the sh*t end of the stick. I have always thought it funny the way people rationalize things.

It's perfectly fine for an officer to have a fully automatic firearm, but Joe Shmoe is paranoid or crazy.

An officer is perfectly fine with armor, even though he's less likely to be shot, but Joe Shmoe is paranoid.

What about the thought processes about carrying a gun? "The world isn't a dangerous place", as you were saying?

[Guest c.a.s.]

also c.a.s., would you wear BA daily if you had it?

Not in this heat and humidity. I'm lucky to get away with a A-shirt.

[Punisher84]

Not in this heat and humidity. I'm lucky to get away with a A-shirt.

Well...I just broke my desk from slamming my head into it so hard. You realize this is like debating the benefits of open carry and then saying "Well I only carry concealed."

I think this thread has run it's natural course of life. It's just a carousel now.

[Mike]

Not in this heat and humidity. I'm lucky to get away with a A-shirt.

[Guest c.a.s.]

Well...I just broke my desk from slamming my head into it so hard. You realize this is like debating the benefits of open carry and then saying "Well I only carry concealed."

I think this thread has run it's natural course of life. It's just a carousel now.

Just because I argue for something doesn't mean I HAVE to practice it (especially since armor is WAY too rich for my family's blood--we've never made a lot)

That's like saying because I am an ardent supporter of gun rights I HAVE to carry a gun--which I CAN'T.

FYI, I'll probably Open Carry during the Summer when I turn 21, and the only reason I'd CC in the winter is because I like longer jackets.

I'm not arguing for forcing anybody. I'm arguing in the same way you argue for the normality of carrying a loaded gun. It sounds utterly PARANOID to the leftists, but you do it anyway and say it ISN'T paranoid. What's the fracking difference?

[Kegger]

I just read this whole thread and I think people have though into it too much.

I think the original question was meant as a SHTF type deal. Not as a daily wear thing.

I've worn body armor at several points in my life, working EMS, as a PD explorer, and as a soldier. And, yes, it sucks big ole balls to wear it all day.

I currently have BA, with soft inserts and SAPI-X plates, I don't wear it all the time, in fact I only wear it when I have to and when I'm training.

As for the original question, by all means go out and get it. If you feel the need to have it handy, get it. It's just another measure of protecting yourself should a situation necessitating its use arise. I advocate it whole heartedly.

[Guest c.a.s.]

I like you.

How much did your setup run you? I know it's WAY too rich for my blood, but I'm curious.

[Kegger]

I didn't pay a dime for any of my stuff. My brother's in 7th SFG and they didn't want the older issue IBA back after they issued the Eagle Industries CIRAS to the teams, so he shipped it to me, along with an ACH.

YOu can usually find them online for like 800 bucks though.

[Guest c.a.s.]

I must say, you are lucky. I'm not so lucky. My uncle didn't keep any of his stuff after he "retired", all he had was his BDUS, which I do have now.

Yeah, $800 is spendy for my family. We live in an extremely low income ladder.

[Kegger]

Spendy!!!!! That's a Yankee word!!!! Beat yourself child!!!!!

I know, lol. It's something your save your nickles and dimes for.

[Guest justme]

are you? reason i ask is i looked into it a little while back and found out its not practical to wear every day unless you are practically forced to. i want one simply to have it in case i need it a level II for lite occasions and a level IIIA with ceramic trauma plates if im expecting needing it against highly penetrating pistol or rifles

directed at "justme"

am I what--buying BA? I'm considering it for a shtf type situation--but for that kind of situation I would want a level III with trauma plates. The issue for me is the money--and I would also like to find a combination bullet proof/knife proof vest--not sure if I could find something like that, but it would be nice. I mean for the price of a good ballistic vest plus a little to boot I could buy a lovely new rifle I've been wanting...

would I wear BA on a regular basis--no, not unless I had to walk the streets after dark in Cleveland Ohio or in downtown Chicago or down in south central LA...it would be useful then to a point--or travel in some parts of Knoxville, Nashville, or Memphis--but as someone else said, and as I full agree--BA does nothing to protect the head. There are limits and I never said otherwise. BA just provides another small layer of protection, nothing more and nothing less.

I merely asked the question about who all considered buying it, or already has it, and their reasons for buying...some people just got bent out of shape simply by the question...and I still don't quite know why...

[Punisher84]

Body armor should not just be available to the police/military.

the people are at more risk of being victims of violent crime than military or police.

I got slightly crooked here, then got more bent as I went along. I'm over it now though.

[willis68]

am I what--buying BA? I'm considering it for a shtf type situation--but for that kind of situation I would want a level III with trauma plates. The issue for me is the money--and I would also like to find a combination bullet proof/knife proof vest--not sure if I could find something like that, but it would be nice. I mean for the price of a good ballistic vest plus a little to boot I could buy a lovely new rifle I've been wanting...

would I wear BA on a regular basis--no, not unless I had to walk the streets after dark in Cleveland Ohio or in downtown Chicago or down in south central LA...it would be useful then to a point--or travel in some parts of Knoxville, Nashville, or Memphis--but as someone else said, and as I full agree--BA does nothing to protect the head. There are limits and I never said otherwise. BA just provides another small layer of protection, nothing more and nothing less.

I merely asked the question about who all considered buying it, or already has it, and their reasons for buying...some people just got bent out of shape simply by the question...and I still don't quite know why...

You can legally buy it, it is very expensive and if you truly need it I suggest that you get the good stuff I prefer to spend all of my defensive money on guns though

[Guest c.a.s.]

Spendy!!!!! That's a Yankee word!!!! Beat yourself child!!!!!

I know, lol. It's something your save your nickles and dimes for.

I couldn't think of a better word for the term.

But for the same price, I could get a good firearm is the issue.

Or not, since I can't technically buy a firearm, only be gifted one.

[Guest justme]

I got slightly crooked here, then got more bent as I went along. I'm over it now though.

we all do...we're human. My post wasn't meant to tick anyone off--the thread just went downhill in hurry, and I didn't start it off like that--it was a legitimate question that just was taken all the wrong way.

[Guest justme]

You can legally buy it, it is very expensive and if you truly need it I suggest that you get the good stuff I prefer to spend all of my defensive money on guns though

that is my thoughts too--but a good ballistic vest could prove highly useful in a real SHTF situation.

[Guest 70below]

You people crack me up.......I can't believe I just wasted time reading that whole thread.

Nobody asked for my opinion, but I think you're both right and stubborn as h*ll to boot.

Yes, civilians are under attack daily, more in some places than others......would body armor have save a life, sure, maybe a few, maybe a lot. Criminals victimize those who are easy targets, who are weak, who are oblivious. For those reasons, perhaps they will be victims regardless.

I'm sure most of you know about the things that criminals look for and prey upon. Most criminals don't prey upon the strong, the observant, and the protected. If you're wearing BA, you may or may not be a victim regardless, simply because you may be more wary and observant of your surroundings.

And Yes, police do tend to respond to violent crimes, or most crimes for that matter when called upon. The crime may have impacted society first, but because of a enforcement officers duty to protect and serve.......he or she has a greater risk because they specifically are called to a criminal act. Am I more likely to get shot making 10 trips a day to get milk at walmart, or responding ten times a day to a violent crime call?

Ok....maybe walmart wasn't a good example