What brand of ammunition do you use in your carry weapon?

[Falcon1]

In semi-automatics, I usually use Federal Premium Personal Defense Hydra-Shok. If I'm carrying a revolver, I use either Remington Golden Saber or Remington .38 Special +P 158-grain LSW-HP. I may check out the Buffalo Bore .38 Special +P (Buffalo Bore claims 1000fps from a two-inch barrel without heavy recoil, but I'm a little skeptical--violating the laws of physics usually only happens in fantasy movies ).

[Donnie]

Since I just traded off my Sub-Compact XD and got a 1911, I have been carrying 200 grain +P Speer Gold Dots in it.

[Guest drewi]

Gold Dots.

[Guest Len]

In my Glock 19: Extreme Shock R2LP Air Freedom.

These are an excellent round for HOME defense due to their design. Check 'em out at: http://www.extremeshockusa.com/

An instructor friend of mine turned me on to them.

A bit pricey, though...

-Len

[Guest GlocKingTN]

In my Glock 19: Extreme Shock R2LP Air Freedom.

These are an excellent round for HOME defense due to their design. Check 'em out at: http://www.extremeshockusa.com/

An instructor friend of mine turned me on to them.

A bit pricey, though...

-Len

Would these be good for carrying?

[Guest Len]

Would these be good for carrying?

It depends. These rounds are designed to not penetrate solid objects (such as car doors, drywall, etc) but do extreme damage to organic matter. So, in a house or other confined location, they are supposedly "safer" in that a miss wont end up in the neighbor's bedroom. On the other hand, for street carry this might be a tactical disadvantage. I use the Extreme Shock only in the gun that's in my bed-side safe. For street carry, or virtually anything else, I use whatever is around. I'm a fan of Federal Hydra-shok, but in all honesty, I think hits on target (accuracy) is more important than the round you have in the chamber. If your gun likes it, its dependable, and you shoot well with it, that's what should be in your magazines. Just my humble opinion, and open to much debate.

-Len

[Marswolf]

For any of you who haven't seen it, http://www.theboxotruth.com/ has a lot of real-world information.

Oh yeah:

.40 - Rangers

9mm - Hydras

.380 - one Hydra in the pipe and the rest FMJs

[shaftbass]

.380 - one Hydra in the pipe and the rest FMJs

Why?

--Typing this part to meet the 10 character post minimum--

[Marswolf]

Why?

The 380 Auto has relatively light bullets with less mass compared to say 9mm and velocity is a couple of hundred fps less than the 9mm.

The first round is potentially a "warning". But I really think you need the additional penetration of a FMJ in the .380.

That is definitely true in the 32 Auto. I have a nice video around here somewhere that shows the results of an execution style killing using a .32. The first round to the side of the head did not penetrate the cranial vault. The second round, through the eye, did.

In most cases, I wouldn't wait to see if the first round stopped them, but it gives me that potentially less lethal option. It's a matter of situational awareness and sizing up your opponent, his actions and your options after that first shot.

[molonlabetn]

From what I can see, the 90gr Federal HS has adequete penetration and expansion: http://www.brassfetcher.com/90%20grain%20Federal%20Personal%20Defense%20Hydra-Shok.html

80gr Cor-Bon didn't do very well at all: http://www.brassfetcher.com/380DPX.html

Some XTP and Gold-Dot handloads were in-between: http://www.brassfetcher.com/Various%20.380ACP%20handloads.html

Seems to me that a 90+gr JHP is the way to go, for proper penetration

The FMJ probably assures reliability... A lighter bullet of that type would likely enhance energy and reduce chances of over-penetration.

[Guest pherman926]

I load with Remington 185gr golden saber in my 45s and Corbon 115gr +p in my 9mm.

[Marswolf]

For 9mm, I should have said Hydras in an urban setting (IWB) and FMJ in the field.

Oh yeah, about gelatin testing. I'm not one of those who poo-poos the testing technique. It does seem to produce good comparative data. However, you can't count on only hitting soft tissue. Have to factor that in.

[Guest whiskeypapa]

I shoot Cor-Bon 230gr in my Kimber Compact.

It works for me

[Guest salb3039]

As soon as they get here, it will be Speer Gold Dot 124g +p. I have the Remington JHP from Wally in there now

[Guest jackdog]

Federal hydro shock in the .40 glocks

Spear gold dots in kel terc 380.

Shot a number of boxes in each caliber federals and the glocks are a great match and the speer gold dots have never failed in the keltec. What ever you decide on get 4 or5 boxes and shoot them up. Yes this is a little pricey. but not near as expensive as having a mis feed or a dead round when your life is on the line.

Jackdog.

[Guest Voodoo_1]

Speer Gold Dot - 124 Gr. +p GDHP in 9mm

[saintsfanbrian]

Federal Hydra Shocks in all of my carry weapons.

[Guest CapnBald]

Federal Hydra shocks in my.357. Win. Silvertips in my 10MM but I plan on trying some Double Tap 10MM soon.

[Guest roadrider]

Federal Premium HST in 124 grain 9mm Luger - HST Bullets feature a hollow point cavity precisely engineered for each caliber and load. A pre-formed core allows large bullet expansion even through the toughest barriers. Its scored jacket allows for a controlled opening yet stops expansion at twice the bullet diameter. the bullet also features a radiused nose for reliable feeding. According to Federal.

[Guest LegalRaptor]

Remington Golden Sabre 124 gr, .40 S&W

[Guest LegalRaptor]

In my Glock 19: Extreme Shock R2LP Air Freedom.

These are an excellent round for HOME defense due to their design. Check 'em out at: http://www.extremeshockusa.com/

-Len

I checked out the link. I can see a prosecutor putting this up on a big blow-up for a jury in a defensive shooting case :

ExtremeShock™ Explosive Entry tactical defense rounds represent the ultimate refinement in lethal bullet technology. The compressed Tungsten-NyTrilium™ Composite fragments upon impact, leaving a wound channel of catastrophic proportions.

It sounds good to us, but what would the average juror who is afraid of guns think of this kind of hype? Just a thought for discussion.

[Marswolf]

I like the Extreme Shock ammo because if you shoot them in the chest, it makes their head explode.

JUST KIDDING.

The stuff is made about an hour drive from me by Mullins Ammunition. I talked to the owner several years ago and he was supposed to send me some to test. Then he found out that I was going to do real testing, with Gelatin and all, and he backed out.

As Len says, the stuff actually is good as a safety type round. But the hype turns off a lot of potential buyers.

[molonlabetn]

I checked out the link. I can see a prosecutor putting this up on a big blow-up for a jury in a defensive shooting case :

ExtremeShock™ Explosive Entry tactical defense rounds represent the ultimate refinement in lethal bullet technology. The compressed Tungsten-NyTrilium™ Composite fragments upon impact, leaving a wound channel of catastrophic proportions.

It sounds good to us, but what would the average juror who is afraid of guns think if this kind of hype? Just a thought for discussion.

Good Point...

The only defensible intention when using a firearm, per my understanding, is to STOP the attacker... not to respond with maximum lethality... Even though it would be, in fact, lethal force either way.

Obviously a poor choice of words by the ammo company's advertising dept.

That's about a ridiculous as if they advertised:

"Extreme Shock is so powerful, that, every time a cartridge is discharged a rift is created in the space-time continuum whereby the bullet simultaneously kills the same criminal in an infinite number of parallel universes. Also, the shock-wave created by the bullet causes dozens of unborn islamic-terrorists to be aborted!"

[Marswolf]

It doesn't do that?

[Marswolf]

I made the crack above about the bullet making your head explode when it hits your chest. That wasn't just a random remark, although it isn't Extreme Shock that makes that claim, it's a company called RBCD distributed by Le Mas. These BMT (Blended-Metal-Technology) rounds are only sold to LE and military.

"Meteor" Round

"Blended-Metal-Technology" Bullets Live Up To Hard-Hitting Claims

John G. Roos

Imagine a small-arms bullet powerful enough to punch through armor plate and "bulletproof" glass at typical pistol- and rifle-shot distances, yet smart enough to release its energy the instant it encounters soft tissue. Yes, a bullet that makes light work of armor plate but won't exit a human body.

Now imagine a variant of the same bullet: this one will deliver a devastating strike against an adversary standing 25 feet away, yet it would generally be non-lethal to an innocent bystander 50 feet from the weapon's muzzle.

Outlandish? That's how these claims sounded when Stan Bulmer asked if AFJI would be interested in testing RBCD's new "Blended Metal Technology" (BMT) ammunition during our recent annual "Small-arms Shoot-out" (see feature article).

Bulmer, a former Marine Corps aviator and avid sports shooter, is a full-time pilot with Federal Express. As for his avocation, he carries a card identifying himself as vice president for domestic sales (law enforcement & military) for Le Mas Ltd., of Little Rock, AR. Le Mas stands for Law Enforcement and Military Ammunition Sales, and is the exclusive distributor for RBCD ammo.

Realizing he had piqued my interest, Bulmer said the BMT ammo is the world's first frangible (disintegrating) armor-piercing ammunition. It's "smart," he continued, since it's "programmed" to retain its penetrating mass until it strikes a soft medium, such as tissue. At that point, the ammo disintegrates with violent force, leaving hundreds of minute particles embedded throughout the impact area.

Tests of the unique ammunition have demonstrated that when a BMT round strikes soft tissue in a chest cavity, the resulting hydrostatic shock is so severe it destroys brain tissue mass, Bulmer said. [emphasis mine] As a result, a heart or lung shot against a large animal, such as a deer (and, presumably, a human), consistently causes the animal to drop the instant it's struck. (After receiving a fatal shot to the chest from standard ammunition types, a deer's reflexes often propel the animal a short distance after being struck.)

Among the other claims Bulmer made for his BMT ammo was that it would not deflect off glass, such as an automobile windshield, at greater than a 15-degree angle. And strikes against metal or concrete at angles greater than 15 degrees, he added, don't result in ricochets; instead, the BMT ammo's frangible characteristics create a stream of non-lethal, localized fragments.

I've had some short emails with Stan Bulmer when I was trying to obtain some of these rounds for testing. . You'll never meet a bigger bullsh*tter.. He wanted everything to be in a phone call rather than in writing. I declined to do a phone talk with him (even though in Tennessee only one party to a call has to know they are being taped). Unfortunately, Blackwater always gives the guy a stage during their shootout.

You've probably seen the videos of these rounds "sensing" the temperature of the target and blowing up beef roasts while penetrating "cold" bullet-resistant glass.

BTW, the "Blended-Metal-Technology" bullets have no "Blended-Metal". Ammolab obtained some and cut them open. They are pure lead tipped with a nylon ball follower. I wonder where they hid the temperature sensor????