Calling for Electrical Knowledge

[GlockSpock]

Backstory, I found a great deal on a color laser printer locally so I snagged it. I already have a black and white laser printer and it has a built in scanner. The color printer does not have a scanner or duplexing.

I had original plans to incorporate both of them into my home office environment. But at some point I started have a bit of a second thought regarding power usage. I know for a fact you should not plug a laser printer up to a UPS so that got me thinking along the lines of my power strip. Here is all of the hardware involved:

• Brother HL-L3210CW

• Brother DCP-L2550DW

• Anker 332 USB Power Strip

I did some research and found the following via Brother's website:

https://support.brother.com/g/b/spec.aspx?c=us&lang=en&prod=hll3210cw_us_eu_as

https://support.brother.com/g/b/spec.aspx?c=us&lang=en&prod=dcpl2550dw_us

I'm assuming that the peak draw is when the printer first starts. The peak wattage for each printer is:

1160W and 1104W.

2264W Total between the two. The printing and ready wattage amounts are much lower.

Both of these printers are plugged into the Anker Power Strip listed above which takes a single plug to the wall. I'll have to test further but there is a high likelihood that my custom PC is also on the same circuit.

As a test, I decided to flip the switch on the power strip and then turn both printers on at exactly the same time. When I did this, some lights (LED) gently flickered for a second.

Out of caution, I've got one of the printers unplugged. I'm assuming this is a 15A circuit.

What are your thoughts? Should I scrap the idea of having these both on the same circuit? Or should I simply run a longer power cord for one of the printers directly the the wall? Is the issue moreso on the power strip or the circuit? What sort of issues/danger do I have here, if any? Is it ok since they only use the peak amount for a very brief moment and then settle down to roughly 10W when in "sleep"? The chances of me printing to both of them at the same time is almost zero, although I did do that as a test just now. It seemed fine.

[LangdoniousRex]

It's more likely a 20A circuit. 15A is only supposed to be for lighting. If you only print on one printer at a time, you should be fine. 80% rules says 20 amps x 120V x .8 = 1920w is safe peak. 

[monkeylizard]

The circuit could be 15A or 20A, depending on the age of the house. Newer homes are mostly 20A on outlets, but it wasn't that long ago that 15A was the norm. The breaker for that outlet will tell you.

But I think you're overthinking it. The peak power draw on laser printers is very brief when they first power on. I wouldn't worry about it. Since you stress-tested it with powering them all on at once and printing on both at the same time and the breaker didn't trip, then your normal load will be well under the max.

As for the power strip, it may have either a 15A or 20A fuse. If it's a 15A on a 20A circuit, the fuse will blow before the breaker trips. If it's a 20A fuse on a 15A circuit, the breaker will trip first. If they're both 15A or 20A, it's a crap shoot which will go first on an overload. If there's no fuse on the strip, it's basically dumb and will take as much power as you can feed it until it melts, but a breaker should trip long before that happens.
 

[GlockSpock]

10 hours ago, monkeylizard said:

The circuit could be 15A or 20A, depending on the age of the house. Newer homes are mostly 20A on outlets, but it wasn't that long ago that 15A was the norm. The breaker for that outlet will tell you.

But I think you're overthinking it. The peak power draw on laser printers is very brief when they first power on. I wouldn't worry about it. Since you stress-tested it with powering them all on at once and printing on both at the same time and the breaker didn't trip, then your normal load will be well under the max.

As for the power strip, it may have either a 15A or 20A fuse. If it's a 15A on a 20A circuit, the fuse will blow before the breaker trips. If it's a 20A fuse on a 15A circuit, the breaker will trip first. If they're both 15A or 20A, it's a crap shoot which will go first on an overload. If there's no fuse on the strip, it's basically dumb and will take as much power as you can feed it until it melts, but a breaker should trip long before that happens.
 

Maybe so. I'd much rather overthink than under think something like this. Secondly, I wonder why "overthink" is one word and "under think" is two? Or am I overthinking that one as well?

I looked at the manual for the power strip and found this:

Electrical Rating: 125V～ 60Hz 15A 1875W

To be safe, I may buy a power cable and run one of the printers directly to the same outlet. That would spread the load out and away from the power strip. That should be fine? I think I'd be more in danger of overheating a relatively cheap power strip and melting or causing a fire rather than overloading a circuit without it tripping? If the power strip is 15A and the circuit is 20A I could overload the power strip without ever tripping a breaker, right?

[Alleycat72]

You could always have an electrician put a 30A plug in with appropriate wiring and dedicated breaker.

[GlockSpock]

3 minutes ago, Alleycat72 said:

You could always have an electrician put a 30A plug in with appropriate wiring and dedicated breaker.

That would completely undo the "really good deal" I got.

In all seriousness, I'd much rather just get rid of one of the printers than to upgrade wiring.

[MacGyver]

This seems to be a lot of work.

I’d check the breaker to make sure it’s 20a.

I might take a faceplate off the outlet to make sure my wiring is right sized - especially if the house is older.

Then if I was really worried about it - I’d get a power strip with a 15a breaker on board and plug them both into that so that it blows first.

Then, I’d think through the volume of stuff I’m printing and spend some time pondering my life choices.  

[LangdoniousRex]

If you really want to get pedantic, you could run each printer through its paces using a Kill A Watt to measure real world output of the devices to put your mind at ease.

Kill A Watt

[TripleGGG]

I prefer to daisy chain power strips together until you see smoke then remove one item that way it is thoroughly tested. 

In all honesty I've never had an issue with multiple printers plugged into a single outlet or power strip. I currently have 3 printers, 2 laser (1 color) and 1 ink jet into 1 power strip. Been that way for 3 years and used heavily with zero issues. Now if it was a big commercial grade printer that is different. 

[GlockSpock]

17 hours ago, LangdoniousRex said:

It's more likely a 20A circuit. 15A is only supposed to be for lighting. If you only print on one printer at a time, you should be fine. 80% rules says 20 amps x 120V x .8 = 1920w is safe peak. 

The main thing that I know is that 1160W + 1104W > 1920W.

My main concern simply being I figured they'd both peak when they both gain power, essentially meaning that after a power outage they'd both power at the same time.

3 hours ago, LangdoniousRex said:

If you really want to get pedantic, you could run each printer through its paces using a Kill A Watt to measure real world output of the devices to put your mind at ease.

Kill A Watt

Honestly at some point I'll probably do exactly that, if for no other reason than curiosity.

But realistically, I ask myself the following question, and someone please correct me if I'm wrong.

What's the worst that could happen?

Tripped breaker? No issue.

Fire? Big issue. That said, what causes fire? Heat. What causes electrical heat? In this case, I'm assuming overloaded wires for an extended time. Even if the theoretical peak is too high, as soon as the printers "calm down", they use 75W and 43W each. In sleep, they use 8W and 4W. Even if while printing they each use 390W and 420W, so combined roughly equivalent to that of a PSU for a high end PC.

[GlockSpock]

4 hours ago, MacGyver said:

This seems to be a lot of work.

I’d check the breaker to make sure it’s 20a.

I might take a faceplate off the outlet to make sure my wiring is right sized - especially if the house is older.

Then if I was really worried about it - I’d get a power strip with a 15a breaker on board and plug them both into that so that it blows first.

Then, I’d think through the volume of stuff I’m printing and spend some time pondering my life choices.  

Lol.

I have had a B+W laser printer that supports duplexing and an automatic document feeder for the scanner for a while. I got a free color laser printer yesterday that does not scan and does not duplex. I bet I print about 100 pages a year, most of them labels to ship stuff to TGO people. I figured it'd be nice to have the option of printing some color documents occasionally and couldn't say no.

The "real" answer to my predicament is someday I'm going to just replace both devices with a color duplexing unit that has an ADF. But until then, it looks like I'll be fine.

[LangdoniousRex]

5 minutes ago, GlockSpock said:

Fire? Big issue....

You are way overthinking this. Assuming your home is wired correctly (i.e. correct gauge for specific load rating on said circuit), the breaker will trip when overloaded. Plain and simple. 

[GlockSpock]

42 minutes ago, LangdoniousRex said:

You are way overthinking this. Assuming your home is wired correctly (i.e. correct gauge for specific load rating on said circuit), the breaker will trip when overloaded. Plain and simple. 

Well. Has a power strip ever caused a fire? I mean, I'm not saying that my instance would result in this but I'm pretty sure that the majority of people whom have had their house burn down from a power strip probably figured that it'd be ok. Electricity isn't my expertise, but I very much do respect it.

I think to play it completely safe I'll buy a simple power cord that's a bit longer and plug the extra printer up to the wall for now. That should eliminate any concern of overloading the power strip.

[monkeylizard]

3 hours ago, GlockSpock said:

Fire? Big issue. That said, what causes fire? Heat. What causes electrical heat? In this case, I'm assuming overloaded wires for an extended time. Even if the theoretical peak is too high, as soon as the printers "calm down", they use 75W and 43W each. In sleep, they use 8W and 4W. Even if while printing they each use 390W and 420W, so combined roughly equivalent to that of a PSU for a high end PC.

Correct. You'd need to draw too much current on undersized wiring to generate the heat to start a fire. The printers don't pull enough juice for long enough to be an issue.

[peejman]

Relax. Don't run them both at the same time.  Use the power strip as an intermediate breaker, but understand they're not infinitely resetable, meaning it'll pop with less and less current if tripped frequently. 

There's a big current spike when the printer starts (<1s duration) then it drops to a steady state.  If your house wiring is good (no poor contacts that arc and get really hot), it'll be fine. 

[Frog4aday]

3 hours ago, GlockSpock said:

Well. Has a power strip ever caused a fire? I mean, I'm not saying that my instance would result in this but I'm pretty sure that the majority of people whom have had their house burn down from a power strip probably figured that it'd be ok. Electricity isn't my expertise, but I very much do respect it.

I think to play it completely safe I'll buy a simple power cord that's a bit longer and plug the extra printer up to the wall for now. That should eliminate any concern of overloading the power strip.

You are NOT overthinking this at all. You are being very wise. To answer your question, YES A POWER STRIP HAS CAUSED A FIRE. I know this because that is what the fire department determined burned down my son's apartment and killed his cat. (They told him it ran away when they busted his door down because they didn't have the heart to tell him the truth.)

I'm sure electricians reading this are saying, "that shouldn't happen" but the apartments were old, had been thru who knows how many remodels, and the powerstrip was cheap AmaWalmartzon garbage.

He had his X-Box & Playstation plugged into the power strip. Not sure what else. Not sure what brand the powerstrip was but can tell you it was whatever Chinese thing was on sale at Amazon at the time we bought it. Made us re-evaluate the powerstrips we have around the house. We found one of our powerstrips fried (blackened at the plug, and dead) in the detached shop. Scary. Glad it was just sitting on the concrete floor and not near anything flammable. Only thing plugged into it was a Battery Tender. Go figure.

Looking at the rest of our powerstrips, if they didn't say UL Registered, we tossed them. We are much more diligent buying actual name brand powerstrips with circuit breaker protection now. Could not imagine the heartbreak of losing our home & animals because we used the cheapest powerstrip on eBay to save a few bucks. False economy. Electricity is no joke to us now. Apparently that schitt can burn your house down :o(

@GlockSpock - you are smart to think about and question the safety of your situation. And the electrical-knowing people responding; thank you for sharing your professional insight and info. It's helpful.

Edited August 9 by Frog4aday

[gregintenn]

Wires getting hot are caused by loose connections and a continual high electrical draw for an extended period of time. I’m no electrical expert, and certainly not a printer expert, but I don’t think a printer would continuously draw a lot of current. I’d guess that if your power strip breaker doesn’t trip, you’ll be fine. You’d be scared to death to see what all is plugged into one at my wife’s desk. It has been that way for years, and we’ve had no problem.

[Jeb48]

I also have a B&W laser duplex Brothers and a color printer.  2+ years ago I decided to unplug the color printer till I needed it because I didn't use it much.  Still haven't needed to plug it in.  Just plug in the color when you need it and unplug it when you're done or put it on a switchable plug strip.

Edited August 12 by Jeb48