Online Integrity

[Defender]

I read recently on here about someone complaining about a buy that didn’t work out.  While I do think that just someone replying asking about it doesn’t rise to the level of an agreement, there are situations where when a trade/sale is negotiated, a time, date and place  are agreed upon, that does meet the criteria I think of a gentleman’s agreement. It’s like a virtual handshake was effected. Then if the person withdraws a few hours later, due to a better offer, in my old school moral set, I think that’s dishonest or at least ungentlemanly, which, either way, seems to not mean as much these days. I’m not upset that much about the deal not proceeding, but am saddened by this happening on here, albeit from a pretty new member. Still

lwarning at my advanced age, LOL.  Anyway, no hard feelings, I just will be a little careful about looking at length of membership first.  And no, I’m not outing anyone or calling anyone out, just venting.

[Sleep profit]

Sorry this happened to you 

Edited June 16, 2023 by Sleep profit

[FUJIMO]

I was taught at an early age that my word was my bond. I live by that to this day. The interent has not changed that nor will it ever. However its my opinion some out there take advantage of the anonymity the interent provides and act accordingly. 

 

 

[gregintenn]

Most everybody on this forum seems to be pretty ethical. More so than most places in my opinion. You will still run across a squirrel every now and the on though.

My hat’s off to the moderators here who do a spectacular job ferreting these folks out in short order!

I reckon that’s why they make the big bucks.

Edited June 16, 2023 by gregintenn

[monkeylizard]

This site's iTrader feature helps me a lot. If someone has a very small amount of feedback, I check who left it. If I have to go more than about 3 degrees of separation before finding a known-reputable/longtime member leaving feedback then I don't bother, no matter how good the deal is. But we have very prolific traders here so it usually doesn't take long to find a name I know and sometimes one I've done business with directly.

[Grayfox54]

When buying I always add the phrase "pending actual inspection" when negotiating a deal. Some years ago I worked out a deal for a gun on Armslist and when we met, I found it wasn't in near as good of condition as the pictures suggested. I turned it down and the seller went absolutely ballistic! Cussed me up and down screaming "We had a deal!" Well sorry, but I saw it as his fault for misrepresenting the gun. 

OTOH If I'm selling, have worked out a deal and someone else offers more. Sorry the other guy was here first and I'll honor my word. 

[res308]

Had it happen to me on here several (many) years back. Decided I wanted an M1A a young man had posted on here. Decided I’d take it, communicated that fact to him (clearly), had the deal all worked out (I thought), and whaddaya know - surprise, surprise. Some business owner swooped right in there at the last second, after the deal was supposedly set in stone, and wooed the young feller with no telling what and I found myself flapping in the breeze. 
Never did file a complaint or leave any feedback at the time. Didn’t figure it would do any good. Sure left a burr under my saddle though and only increased my skepticism and mistrust of people. 
Thankfully I believe the VAST majority of folks on here to be honest and upright. 
Any time I have done any actual buying or trading on here, every single man I’ve dealt with has gone above and beyond. 
So don’t be discouraged. Most on here will do to ride the river with. 

[Defender]

13 minutes ago, res308 said:

Had it happen to me on here several (many) years back. Decided I wanted an M1A a young man had posted on here. Decided I’d take it, communicated that fact to him (clearly), had the deal all worked out (I thought), and whaddaya know - surprise, surprise. Some business owner swooped right in there at the last second, after the deal was supposedly set in stone, and wooed the young feller with no telling what and I found myself flapping in the breeze. 
Never did file a complaint or leave any feedback at the time. Didn’t figure it would do any good. Sure left a burr under my saddle though and only increased my skepticism and mistrust of people. 
Thankfully I believe the VAST majority of folks on here to be honest and upright. 
Any time I have done any actual buying or trading on here, every single man I’ve dealt with has gone above and beyond. 
So don’t be discouraged. Most on here will do to ride the river with. 

Yes, I agree.  I've bough a LOT of guns on here and every other transaction was perfect.  Some guys I coulda talked to for hours, others not, but all were good.  Never left bad feedback and not sure if I should here or not. I don't want to start a pissing contest, lol.

[gregintenn]

40 minutes ago, Defender said:

Yes, I agree.  I've bough a LOT of guns on here and every other transaction was perfect.  Some guys I coulda talked to for hours, others not, but all were good.  Never left bad feedback and not sure if I should here or not. I don't want to start a pissing contest, lol.

I would encourage you to leave a negative feedback. Not to be a pekkerhead, but to let everyone else know what they’ll be dealing with. That’s how this type stuff gets weeded out.

[hipower]

I do agree with Defender and the moral code of the deal online being a "Gentleman's Agreement." I'm pretty sure we all adhere to that form of dealing with people here and in "real" life as my wife says. (Once accused me of living in a sort of virtual reality because of all the time I've spent here.)

I've been a prolific buyer. Far to much in fact. Tried to be direct in communications about pricing and meeting locations. I have, in fact, asked to be released from that buying obligation I think 2, maybe three times here. Explained the situation fully and offered to complete the buy if the seller wasn't satisified with my explanation and request. Never had an unhappy incident with anyone here because of it.

In almost 13(?) years here, I must say there have been 2 cases where the seller has made a deal with me and then refused to meet or complete the sale. One in particular was extremely bad. Details aren't necessary, but if you want the story, PM me and I'll tell you. Anyway the situation was resolved. I never got the item, and due to really bad things happening in the background, the seller was banned.

I will say I enjoyed that part. But my point is that there are cases that may happen with buyers and sellers that result in a non-sale after the initial aggrement is made. They are rare, but it does happen. But this should occur with an honest apology to the  offended/hurt party and all be resolved like Gentlemen.

Most, probably 99%+ here can be called this. It's one of the reasons I've stayed here and bought so much.

[TGO David]

20 hours ago, Defender said:

I read recently on here about someone complaining about a buy that didn’t work out.

I suspect that I know which thread you're talking about.  What was seen publicly was only the tip of the proverbial iceberg and the guy who started that thread had seriously lofty expectations, beyond the norm, of his fellow TGO members.  He had a very flawed sense of entitlement, and no one was going to satisfy him without taking extreme measures.

It has been rare for us to experience people backing out of a sale without good reason to do so.  It has happened, but it is rare.

Don't let the extreme minority sour your opinion of anything.  No matter what lake or pond you fish in, your lure is going to float past a few turds beneath the waves.

I made that saying up.  It still needs some work.   

 

[jeff43]

I had a guy a couple of weeks back on GOC  sell a handgun out from under me , had said someone gave him more money for it than what he was asking.

Never had any bad dealings on here, all good guys. 
I did have a guy the other day that contacted me out of state about a WTB ad I have that was a scammer.

Some shady people on GOC, most will not answer your calls or text

[No_0ne]

13 minutes ago, TGO David said:

No matter what lake or pond you fish in, your lure is going to float past a few turds beneath the waves.

I made that saying up.  It still needs some work.   

I don't think it's quite ready for the next edition of Bartletts Quotations yet ...

[TGO David]

2 hours ago, No_0ne said:

I don't think it's quite ready for the next edition of Bartletts Quotations yet ...

I'll keep trying to polish it. 

[BigK]

23 hours ago, Defender said:

...there are situations where when a trade/sale is negotiated, a time, date and place  are agreed upon, that does meet the criteria I think of a gentleman’s agreement. It’s like a virtual handshake was effected. Then if the person withdraws a few hours later, due to a better offer, in my old school moral set, I think that’s dishonest or at least ungentlemanly, which, either way, seems to not mean as much these days...

yeah, that's definitely not how civilized folks do business

[Garufa]

A man is only as good as his word.  Online or in person.  If one makes an agreement for a transaction then does not follow through, they are basically ####.

[CaneyRiverDog]

yeah a man is only as good as his word. If you leave a negative feedback telling the truth they'll just give one in return. 

[Scotty]

I purchased a coveted item on a resale that drew high interest. I responded within 13 mins, the only person who beat me was a very, very well established member that had the trade offer in hand just not exactly what the person was looking for. 
 

I really appreciated and respected the fact that the gentleman messaged me with a timeline and that it was mine. Invited me and mine into his home, and told me “if you wanted to sell this without XYZ, you could sell this for the same price”.  He explained he turned down multiple higher offers. We’re talking multiple, much higher offers than I would pay at the time. Misses and I made a day out of it to pick it up. To this day it’s one of my favorites and when anyone comes over to shoot they all get a grin and feel the same.  That was one of my earliest deals here and I really appreciated the gentleman agreement. I’ll always do the same moving forward. 
 

I’ve also been on the other end where I said “I’ll take it, pm sent” but couldn’t make it work with my work schedule to make it out until 5 days after and the person told me they were going to go with someone who was available then. They needed cash in hand. I completely understood. 
 

Always appreciated that deal mentioned above and I’ve had nothing but good things to say about the people I’ve met here. They haven’t all been exceptional but majority has and they’ve all been good people. Even had random people reach out to me offering something obscure that they didn’t need anymore for free and then turn down anything I offered to give them as trade. 
 

All that aside, if someone wasted my time on a meet or bails last minute I’d leave negative feedback to warn the next person.
 

Overall super pleased with the TGO community. Glad I finally joined after years of stalking  

*(Left the people mentioned above anonymous, you know who you are). 

[gregintenn]

2 hours ago, CaneyRiverDog said:

yeah a man is only as good as his word. If you leave a negative feedback telling the truth they'll just give one in return. 

If someone leaves a negative feedback that is not factual, I think the moderators would want to hear about it.

[Kimber451911]

I try my best to call/text all other active folks that I’m connected to via a forum etc.. when I run into a bad one. Thankfully they are very few and far between, but still are a reality. 

[DJTC45]

Well it finally happened to me. Had everything worked out with a new member who agreed to purchase my Dillon 750XL that I have listed. I emailed, then texted, and finally we had a phone conversation about it and set up a meet for me to deliver it to were they worked at and make the deal. Like a fool I tore it all down and boxed it up along with about $200 worth of extras that I was going to thow in to get them started. Got a text message from them saying they talked to a friend and they told them the 750XL wasn't a good press because it aouto indexes. I'm really disappointed in this, I've only had one bad transaction on here and that was like 8yrs ago. Just goes to show you that trying to be nice and help someone out doesn't always work out. This day in age there is no Integrity in people anymore, I've never backed out of a deal here even if what I was purchasing wasn't quite up to the description. Oh well, Live and Learn.

[Protongunner]

48 minutes ago, DJTC45 said:

Well it finally happened to me. Had everything worked out with a new member who agreed to purchase my Dillon 750XL that I have listed. I emailed, then texted, and finally we had a phone conversation about it and set up a meet for me to deliver it to were they worked at and make the deal. Like a fool I tore it all down and boxed it up along with about $200 worth of extras that I was going to thow in to get them started. Got a text message from them saying they talked to a friend and they told them the 750XL wasn't a good press because it aouto indexes. I'm really disappointed in this, I've only had one bad transaction on here and that was like 8yrs ago. Just goes to show you that trying to be nice and help someone out doesn't always work out. This day in age there is no Integrity in people anymore, I've never backed out of a deal here even if what I was purchasing wasn't quite up to the description. Oh well, Live and Learn.

Too often that saying of "no good deed goes upunished" holds true

[gregintenn]

2 hours ago, DJTC45 said:

Well it finally happened to me. Had everything worked out with a new member who agreed to purchase my Dillon 750XL that I have listed. I emailed, then texted, and finally we had a phone conversation about it and set up a meet for me to deliver it to were they worked at and make the deal. Like a fool I tore it all down and boxed it up along with about $200 worth of extras that I was going to thow in to get them started. Got a text message from them saying they talked to a friend and they told them the 750XL wasn't a good press because it aouto indexes. I'm really disappointed in this, I've only had one bad transaction on here and that was like 8yrs ago. Just goes to show you that trying to be nice and help someone out doesn't always work out. This day in age there is no Integrity in people anymore, I've never backed out of a deal here even if what I was purchasing wasn't quite up to the description. Oh well, Live and Learn.

That sucks. With very limited exceptions, I require the buyer come to me.

[TGO David]

33 minutes ago, gregintenn said:

That sucks. With very limited exceptions, I require the buyer come to me.

Yep, for sure.  I'll meet someone within about 20 minutes of where I live but I'm not driving any further than that if I am the seller. 

 

[res308]

On a good note, on more than one occasion seller/buyer/ trader has gone out of their way to come to me. One feller in particular on here, and I wish I could remember his name, drove from way the heck away and met me in Dickson. Seems like I was buying a 1911 from him or maybe trading for it. That’s been years ago and I think I remember offering to drive farther towards his location but he wouldn’t hear of it. Said he drives all over to do this stuff and enjoys it. Just another good example of the true caliber of people on here.
There are bad apples everywhere and they do cause a lot of inconvenience and justified anger, but rest assured they are absolutely not a true representation of the majority here.