What are these pistols?

[FireMedic]

My pastor recently inherited several firearms after the death of a family member. Knowing I am a gun guy he reached out and asked me to help him. I have had pretty good luck going through the collection and identifying most of the pieces in the collection. But I have two pistols that I cannot identify. I was hoping someone here could help me figure out what exactly they are so I can help the pastor figure out if he wants to keep or sell them. One has neither a serial number or caliber marked on them just the S&W logo, the other has a serial number (62505) but again no caliber. I will attach pictures below. I called Smith and Wesson and the representative on the phone said my best bet is to contact the S&W historical society because he "can't see what a serial number that old would belong to." Any help would be appreciated.

First two pictures are 62505. Second two pictures are the pistol with no serial number.

 

 

 

 

Edited February 18, 2023 by FireMedic
error in description

[FireMedic]

I guess I should note these eject as you break the pistol to load, not exactly a hand eject as its controlled by that break over action itself. Cylinder and front sight as well as everything in front of those breaks forward and rotates on the pin you can see in the picture on the bottom leading edge.

Edited February 17, 2023 by FireMedic

[Chucktshoes]

Looks like some variation of a Scofield. 

[FireMedic]

8 minutes ago, Chucktshoes said:

Looks like some variation of a Scofield. 

So I ran with your scofield thought, again, just comparing cosmetics but it appears it may not be a scofield but rather a 2nd model (scofield was 3rd model). Evidently 2,000 model 2's were made with the spur trigger. Those were supposedly chambered in 38 S&W so I may have to find one of those to see if they fit the cylinder. Appreciate it. 

The handles between the two are slightly different so if anyone has any other thoughts on what it could possible be I would love to hear suggestions.

 

[Garufa]

26 minutes ago, Chucktshoes said:

Looks like some variation of a Scofield. 

Not a Schofield. Those are big .45 caliber beasts.

I’ll pull out the Standard Catalog shortly..

[Garufa]

The first one appears to be a .38 Single Action 2nd Model (Model 2, 2nd Issue).  Manufactured between 1877-1891 with a serial number range of 1-108255.

The other might be a .32 Single Action (Mode 1-1/2 centerfire).  Those were made between 1878-1892 but it should have a serial number.  Are there any markings on top of the barrel?  Patent dates and whatnot?

Edited February 17, 2023 by Garufa

[Chucktshoes]

16 minutes ago, Garufa said:

Not a Schofield. Those are big .45 caliber beasts.

I’ll pull out the Standard Catalog shortly..

I figured somebody actually knew. I was just hoping to provide a place to start looking.

[hipower]

Between Garufa. Grayfox, Smith and a few others; it would be hard not to get a pistol or rifle, identified around here!

[Grayfox54]

Both are Smith & Wesson .32 Single Actions AKA the Model One-and-a-half.  Caliber should be .32 S&W Centerfire.  Both would have been made between 1878- 1892. The one without the serial number is the older one. Both are in excellent condition for their age. Tip-ups aren't exactly my area of expertise, but I'm guessing both will bring a considerable amount. 

I strongly suggest that you post these at http://smith-wessonforum.com/forum.php in the Antiques forum. The experts there can give you much more info including current value. 

[DJTC45]

As a couple have stated those are Smith&Wesson mod1 top break Revolvers. Those are in really good condition, go over to the Smith&Wesson Forum that is linked and those guy's can really help you out with information on them.

[FireMedic]

I appreciate all the help. I have created an account with the smith and wesson forum and I am awaiting activation from the mods before I can post over there. I will try to keep this thread in mind for the curious among you who are looking for a more info. 

[FireMedic]

16 hours ago, Garufa said:

The first one appears to be a .38 Single Action 2nd Model (Model 2, 2nd Issue).  Manufactured between 1877-1891 with a serial number range of 1-108255.

The other might be a .32 Single Action (Mode 1-1/2 centerfire).  Those were made between 1878-1892 but it should have a serial number.  Are there any markings on top of the barrel?  Patent dates and whatnot?

So I do not have the guns in front of me to double check.  As far as I could tell there was zero markings on the second gun other than the S&W logo on it. I can try to swing by his house again once my copy of the standard catalog arrives today or monday. 

[Snaveba]

Please do pass along what you find out. And more photos of you can. Cool old pistols. 

[DJTC45]

1 hour ago, FireMedic said:

So I do not have the guns in front of me to double check.  As far as I could tell there was zero markings on the second gun other than the S&W logo on it. I can try to swing by his house again once my copy of the standard catalog arrives today or monday. 

That's a great book to have, did you get the latest copy. The 4th Edition.

[DocHawk]

Greyfox said:

Both are Smith & Wesson .32 Single Actions AKA the Model One-and-a-half

-----

No, definitely incorrect. Top is probably a Model 2 .38 owing to the humpback, bottom a Model 1-1/2.

Edited February 18, 2023 by DocHawk

[FireMedic]

7 hours ago, DJTC45 said:

That's a great book to have, did you get the latest copy. The 4th Edition.

I did get the fourth edition. Whenever Amazon delivers it to my door I will be heading over to the pastors house to give the guns another look over

 

[Grayfox54]

7 hours ago, DocHawk said:

Greyfox said:

Both are Smith & Wesson .32 Single Actions AKA the Model One-and-a-half

-----

No, definitely incorrect. Top is probably a Model 2 .38 owing to the humpback, bottom a Model 1-1/2.

I'll take your word for it. As I said top breaks ain't really my thing. 

[Garufa]

42 minutes ago, FireMedic said:

I did get the fourth edition. Whenever Amazon delivers it to my door I will be drooling like a kid with the old Sears Christmas Wish Book.

FTFY.  That book fill your mind with all kinds of ideas if you’re into S&W’s.  

[DocHawk]

3 hours ago, Grayfox54 said:

As I said top breaks ain't really my thing. 

Certainly there must be *some* kind of break top you find interesting?

 

[FireMedic]

So, I looked over my new handy dandy Standard Catalog and have deduced that one of the guns is a 1877 Model One and a half 32 caliber centerfire with a 3" barrel. The second is a (date pending) Model 2 38S&W with a 3 1/4" barrel. Both have the original grips and all and are in great condition especially considering these things are 140+ years old. I will be discussing with my preacher what he wants to do sale wise but in the meantime I greatly appreciate everyone's help in ascertaining what exactly I was dealing with. 

[JustEd]

On 2/18/2023 at 10:09 PM, DocHawk said:

Certainly there must be *some* kind of break top you find interesting?

 

At least 38 special in size.  Possibly a S&W 40

[gregintenn]

Although the top breaks are neat pieces of history, they do not command the collector interest the newer hand ejector models do. There are folks out there who collect these, however. In fact, I don’t happen to have any in my collection. If he decides to sell and doesn’t want to deal with shipping, listing them in the classified section here wouldn’t be a bad plan.

What is on the side plate in the third picture?

Edited February 20, 2023 by gregintenn

[Grayfox54]

36 minutes ago, gregintenn said:

What is on the side plate in the third picture?

The nickle finish is cracking. Considering its age, that ain't bad at all. I've seen much newer guns that looked a lot worse. 

[gregintenn]

1 hour ago, Grayfox54 said:

The nickle finish is cracking. Considering its age, that ain't bad at all. I've seen much newer guns that looked a lot worse. 

I don’t suppose I’ve ever seen nickel plating crack. Shows how much attention I pay.

[FireMedic]

error

Edited February 21, 2023 by FireMedic
didn't include quote