A most Excellent Article about the Rich Prepping

[Moped]

Interesting Read! 

https://www.theguardian.com/news/2022/sep/04/super-rich-prepper-bunkers-apocalypse-survival-richest-rushkoff

 

[Grayfox54]

Very interesting indeed. I like the part where the super rich are worried that their own paid security will turn against them.  Yep, I think these guys are going to in for quite a shock if the S ever does HTF. All their money and planning is going to backfire on them big time. 

[Moped]

1 hour ago, Grayfox54 said:

Very interesting indeed. I like the part where the super rich are worried that their own paid security will turn against them.  Yep, I think these guys are going to in for quite a shock if the S ever does HTF. All their money and planning is going to backfire on them big time. 

I think your right and I think they know it. Obviously they are concerned.

[Links2k]

Prepping is a good idea for anyone, but in the long run it’s futile unless you’re going to take to the ocean. Long term, supplies and ammo will dwindle giving invaders more opportunity to overrun your compound and take what little you have left. There aren’t going to be any winners in a global collapse. 

[Moped]

7 hours ago, Links2k said:

Prepping is a good idea for anyone, but in the long run it’s futile unless you’re going to take to the ocean. Long term, supplies and ammo will dwindle giving invaders more opportunity to overrun your compound and take what little you have left. There aren’t going to be any winners in a global collapse. 

Amen. I feel it’s much better to be in a group or community, if possible. Individuals or even small families are going to rip for being overran.

These Tech Oligarchs should be worried about their hired guns. They’ll have no loyalty if the balloon goes up, except possibly to each other.

 

Edited September 8, 2022 by Moped

[Rob112o]

That was interesting. 

[OldIronFan]

There are just so many scenarios that a single "plan" will never be feasible or sufficient. Just a quick survey of all of the doomsday movies or TV shows will highlight that fact. 

An off grid sustainable property or community is virtually worthless in the face of an extinction level event such as a meteor strike with the subsequent atmospheric effects even if the strike was many thousands of miles away. They are also fairly useless in the face of any significant nuclear war without extremely robust and costly hardened shelters.  

In the face of all out civil war, world war, and societal collapse virtually any shelter, off grid property, or sustainable community is going to be overrun by marauders eventually unless you have the means to create something completely isolated and unknown to the outside world. Even then you could never leave it for fear of being discovered. The likelihood of being able to remain unfound, secure, and supplied is slim in my opinion long term. 

Extremes in our climate, either due to naturally occurring cycles/shifts of the planet or the effects of mankind on the planet, are a real threat. The increased intensity and frequency of significant storms, heat, drought, wildfires hurricanes, tornados, flooding, and sea level rise could easily make large chunks of the planet temporarily or permanently unlivable. They would impact resources like power, potable water, and food for a not insignificant portion of the population. This strain on resources will push the displaced into smaller and smaller less affected areas concentrating the population. You can try to predict where the zones that will be safest from such natural elements or events might be but it would be impossible to predict with certainty so your planed and prepped bug out location may be worthless in the end. 

When it comes to biological events or a significant global pandemic with no cure or vaccine in sight and with high mortality initial isolation may be the best bet but if the event is significant enough it will eventually lead to societal collapse. If COVID taught us anything it is that a massive portion of our population is not even remotely prepared to handle short to medium term isolation. Most people have such limited supplies even a week isolated at home would stretch their resources. It also taught us how quickly our emergency response systems and medical facilities can become overburdened. I foresee again that any shelter, sustainable property or community would, over the long haul, not be able to remain isolated or keep something like a virus out, maintain its resources, or remain secure from potential marauders. 

Personally I have no illusions that I would survive long term in a significant event, long term meaning multi year here. My tiered plan has always been to have enough supplies including food on hand to survive in my home for at least 30~60 days at a relatively normal comfort level. Have a means to evacuate by vehicle with enough supplies separate from the household supplies to last another 30 days with a slightly reduced comfort level (roughing it / MRE / camp food / camp equipment). Finally that proverbial bug out/bush craft /survival phase where I have the supplies I can carry in a pack to survive a couple weeks. All of that includes the tools for personal protection, basic first aide/medical, hunting, and gathering for longer term survival but this would honestly be a stretch. The reality is, at my age and health level, I would probably not make it past a year in the face of any real threat. I would likely succumb it illness, injury, or a hostile threat. If whatever befalls our world lasts longer than a year or two I am probably not going to be around to rebuild things, and that is ok. Honestly I would probably not really want to suffer, claw, and scrape along in misery just to prolong my life a bit longer. It would not be much of a life at that point and I have had a pretty good one so far. I simply don't need to be the last man standing. 

The far more likely scenario is much less extreme than all of the above and that is significant political and societal issues causing more isolated conflict and resource strain. I think in that more likely scenario it will not be about how much you have prepped or how many supplies you have stored but how you can adapt that will determine your future. If the market and dollar collapses and society is in turmoil but not truly collapsed (think great depression) how will you handle having no financial means? Can you adapt to a lower standard of living. Can you adapt to self sufficiency and things like a barter system. This may be where the self sustaining/off grid properties and communities would actually be a smart idea. No illusion of doomsday survival but establishing self reliance with a reduced dependence on modern infrastructure, food distribution, and municipal/government resources. This is where the linked article really hits the mark. The ultra rich preppers are not only potentially contributing to that most likely of scenarios with their manipulation of markets, acquisition of extreme wealth, and driving the population toward dependence on their technology they are going about "prepping" the wrong way in my opinion. Sure the author may be a self proclaimed Marxist but they do make a few solid points and astute observations. 

[Grayfox54]

The plan that always bothers me is the city dweller who buys a small, isolated cabin in the woods somewhere with plans to bug out to there if the S ever does HTF.  Odds are that by the time they get there, they'll find the place already occupied by people who have no intention of giving it up. Either that or the place will already have been robbed of everything. 

If you want that survival cabin deep in the woods, you need to make it your permanent home. 

As for myself, I'm old and not in the best of condition. I'll put up a fight and last as long as I can. But I realize that my odds of being a long term survivor ain't very good. 

[A.J. Holst]

Reminded of the show Doomsday Preppers.

Like others commented, by the time you realize you need to evac your million dollar penthouse to your million dollar shelter, your odds of escaping the city are pretty slim. 

[Whisper]

22 minutes ago, A.J. Holst said:

Like others commented, by the time you realize you need to evac your million dollar penthouse to your million dollar shelter, your odds of escaping the city are pretty slim. 

I just read a science fiction novel in which something similar happened -- super-rich guy in NYC has built an underground fortress in Montana, he evacs family from NYC and has hard time getting to Montana due to societal collapse, riots, roving gangs of scum, etc.  They finally make it Montana only to discover that the contractor who built most of the fortress has seized it for himself and his friends. That's probably the way it would play out.

[Moped]

17 hours ago, Whisper said:

I just read a science fiction novel in which something similar happened -- super-rich guy in NYC has built an underground fortress in Montana, he evacs family from NYC and has hard time getting to Montana due to societal collapse, riots, roving gangs of scum, etc.  They finally make it Montana only to discover that the contractor who built most of the fortress has seized it for himself and his friends. That's probably the way it would play out.

What was the book? That story sounds vaguely familiar.

[crc4]

On 10/6/2022 at 2:07 PM, Moped said:

What was the book? That story sounds vaguely familiar.

 

On 10/5/2022 at 8:13 PM, Whisper said:

 he evacs family from NYC and has hard time getting to Montana due to societal collapse, riots, roving gangs of scum, etc.  

That sounds like most big cities already. NY, LA, Portland, Chicago, etc.

[TennesseeCamper]

You know the best laid plans and all that. 
“No battle plan survives first contact”. 
I agree most of those rich dudes either won’t make it to their elaborate retreats or they will find themselves locked out. 
    It does make for a good article. I have read similar stories. Apparently quite a few of the super rich hunkered down in New Zealand to ride out the pandemic.  

[hipower]

Well Crap! You guys sure bring a fella down!

When all is read here, it's quite obvious that our literary aroused plans are not going to work but for a very short time. 200 years ago, people would have had the skills to survive. Today...not very likely that the 300 million plus individual can sustain themselves for long. Might just happen the the influx of non-citizens could be better prepared to survive than us. 

Poorly developed countries with a population of agriarians will have the best survival rates just because of a non-reliance on technology and food supply chains. Basically it's a grow it yourself or starve situation. This will definitely be a time when being a Luddite just might leave you better off.

But for a very small percentage of us, the best hope just might be for a good last meal and few pills. Sort of like the ending scenes in Soylent Green. Go to sleep remembering the best times.

As I've jokingly said before; the honest truth is that in a true EOTWAWKI scenerio...I might get a couple of mags off before the end. Or at least time enough to get off 2 rounds for us.

Edited February 9, 2023 by hipower

[Darrell]

I used to work for the Navy in close proximity to warships, including ballistic missile subs, and special weapons. I always told my wife that in the event of a nuclear war, I hope we were both standing under the first burst.  I'm fairly certain that I would not want to survive that kind of cataclysm.

I noticed something interesting about the Japanese during the Fukajima disaster, though. There were a lot of victims of that situation, but unlike Americans would have been, they were very orderly. When relief supplies arrived the Japanese queued up and waited their turns. Perhaps their society has a better chance of surviving a huge disaster than does ours.

 

[peejman]

1 hour ago, Darrell said:

I used to work for the Navy in close proximity to warships, including ballistic missile subs, and special weapons. I always told my wife that in the event of a nuclear war, I hope we were both standing under the first burst.  I'm fairly certain that I would not want to survive that kind of cataclysm.

I noticed something interesting about the Japanese during the Fukajima disaster, though. There were a lot of victims of that situation, but unlike Americans would have been, they were very orderly. When relief supplies arrived the Japanese queued up and waited their turns. Perhaps their society has a better chance of surviving a huge disaster than does ours.

 

I grew up in the shadow of a nuclear power plant. Assuming that would be a prime target, we were comfortable with the idea of a bright light and nothing more. 

Humility is one of the things I think Eastern culture does far better than Western culture. 

[Grayfox54]

If it comes to all out nuclear war, I'm screwed. Memphis, along with all the bridges across the Mississippi river, has been on everybody's primary target list since the 1950s. We'll go in the first wave. 

I might be far enough away to survive the initial blast only to die slowly from radiation poisoning.  I think I'd eat a bullet rather than go through that. 

[gregintenn]

This prepping subject always tickles me. You know who was a prepped? Your grandma and grandpa! They had tools. They had food preserved and stored. They had a spare bundle of roofing shingles and a ladder. They had gas for the chainsaw. They had basic first aid medicine in the cabinet. They had a well or spring. These folks could survive most anything they faced.

All these folks who sit at a computer all day and think they are going to somehow wander out in the woods and survive a nuclear war or civil uprising are going to be quickly surprised when the lights go out.

[Alleycat72]

Sorry guys, I'm going to eat the neighbors in the event of a total collapse. Those guys always seem to be doing well in every book I've read and move I've watched.  LOL  

[billmeek]

8 hours ago, Grayfox54 said:

I might be far enough away to survive the initial blast only to die slowly from radiation poisoning.  I think I'd eat a bullet rather than go through that. 

You might want to hold off on that bullet for a bit.  This man survived both atomic bombs on Japan:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tsutomu_Yamaguchi

[et45]

When I was younger I looked forward to a Road Warrior/Mad Max kind of world.Today I realize I will only last until my Celebrex runs out unless I die sooner.

[pms]

As has been stated multiple time and in numerous ways. No plan survives first contact with the enemy. The most likely to  survive will be one's with the useful skill sets, have formed groups that are not too large for the amount of supplies that can be scavenged while being able to change tactics and mobilize on the fly. Ultimately , as resources become more difficult to find, it will the the best at adapting that will rule the day. As a great man once said:

“It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one more responsive to change.”

– Charles Darwin