Would love to change some laws in TN

[DO-TN]

So, yes I moved to TN a couple years ago, yes mostly I agree that outsiders moving here bringing thier outisder political views with them is bad, espeically those from NY, CA and others.

That said, moving here from ID has been somwhat oppressive as far as gun freedoms go. The latest post about Wilson Co Fairgrounds using metal detectors is one of those opressions.

So, yes, I would love to bring some of my "outisder politics" with me and figure out a way to "infect" TN law with them.

Here we go!

1. ID has a thing called the "Supremacy Clause." Essentially, no local governemnt, city or county could pass laws or ordinaces that were more restrictive than what the state has on file. What this meant for guns is that with a state CC permit you could carry anywhere that was not federally prohibited. So for the county fairs (on county/city owned property) and similar, they could not bar you and your CCW from entering. There was none of this park BS like here. Essentialy, if you were legal to carry, you could carry everywhere (except schools, courthouses, jails, ect.). The only limit to this was drinking, you could carry into a bar but could not drink while carrying.

2. "No Weapons Allowed Signs." WTF is this nonsense in TN? ID had no such law. None! As a private business, the owner could post they did not allow weapons but as there was no state law against it, all they could ever do was ask you to leave. If you didn't, then it was trepassing. But there was none of this "get arrested" stuff that TN has on it's books becuse your wife choose the wrong resturant and you didn't notice the sign.

3. Mandatory background checks on all purchases. Huh? In ID, if you had a CC permit, you did not need background checks to purchase guns in a store or from a dealer. I know this may be hard to believe, but you picked out a gun, filled out your 4473, gave the store your money and your CC Permit to copy info from, and walked out the door with your new gun. No background check, no "gun tax" "fee" "state bribe" or whatever BS this thing in TN is. I was a little taken back by it the fist time I bought a gun in TN to say the least.

4. Shooting on Public Land. Didn't know that was a thing here till the county SO stopped by one day and told me I couldn't do that in the state forrest. Granted, there was much more public land than in TN and that may be the reason. Between FS, BLM, and state land, there was more public acerage than the entire state of TN but still, we could, and did, drive up to any hill-side, set up a bunch of targets and had a full day shooting, even camp over night and clean guns by a camp fire. At the end of the day, pack out all the garbage, clean up the site and went on our way. So long as were safe and didn't put anyone in danger, there were no restrictions on it. 

5. Open carry. Guns in racks in your back window. AK's sitting on the back seat. Rifle strapped to my back while ridding my motorcylce to and from the range never got a second glance by law enforement. Even in the cities it was never questioned or harrasable. I have the feeling if tried that in TN, much less through Nashville, Clarksville, Memphis or any other municipality I would be at the least stopped and invesitgated, more likely get a new set a braclets of trying to have some freedom.

So. Too reach the end of my rant, yes, I would love to change some TN laws to match the freedom I came from and why I have to hold my tongue everytime someone describes TN as a gun "friendly state" because I do not see it as such. Now, I moved here to get away from desert, forrest fires, Californication that was taking place, and the long drives to be in the woods that were involved.

Who else would like to see some of these laws here changed?

 

[Chucktshoes]

We actually do have state supremacy with regards to firearms laws in Tennessee. The issue with things like the metal detectors at the fairgrounds are actually a specific carve out granted in the statutes by the state.

Signs carrying the force of law is something that many of us find obnoxious and have worked for a long time to change. I would strongly suggest joining and supporting the TFA as they are doing all of the heavy lifting in the fight for that change.

The way the TICS system works is fairly obnoxious and I won’t argue with that. However, I will say that in the grand scheme of things, there are better places to spend political capital to make changes in the near and mid-term.

The lack of public land that is open and available to shoot on is something that I always make sure that I warn people of who are considering moving here from out west. Public land just simply doesn’t exist in the manner in which it does where you are from. State parks and other public lands here generally are set up for a much higher density of usage than required for the millions upon millions of open acres that you find out west. It sucks, but it is what it is.

As far as the carryi of loaded long guns, which is illegal in Tennessee unless directly connected to sporting activity, I too would like to see some change within that realm. That said, you were coming from one of the last vestiges of western culture that exist in this country, and until California started screwing everything up coming in from the West Coast, you generally had a spectrum from very urban to very not going from east to west. The cultures reflected that. The more urbanized the area, the less acceptable that sort of behavior is Not because it’s wrong, it’s just unusual in an urban setting. On that note, the greater metro Nashville area has a greater population than the entirety of the state of Idaho. It may surprise some, but even the very rule parts of Tennessee are very densely populated in comparison to much of the western states that are mostly owned by the federal government.

 

So, I’m not trying to shut you down or tell you you were wrong. Just provide a little context from the perspective of somebody who has spent significant amounts of time out west as well as being from this area. You do bring up things that absolutely could be better. I strongly recommend supporting the Tennessee Firearms Association’s work if you would like to see progress made on those fronts. 

[gregintenn]

May I inquire as to your reason for leaving Idaho?

[Whisper]

As Chucktshoes has hinted at in a most diplomatic fashion, most of these issues you've identified are already well known to us here, and are things we've been trying to improve for years.  (Except for the lack of BLM land -- there's none in Tennessee.)  The TFA has helped a lot on most of the political issues you mention.  Lend a hand, especially if you plan to stay here with us.

Cheers,

Whisper

[DO-TN]

49 minutes ago, gregintenn said:

May I inquire as to your reason for leaving Idaho?

Sure,

Retirement. 52 years old, 18 years of Federal Service (Army and Civilian) and counting. Seeking out a place to enjoy my pension and retirement in the next few years.

No family left any longer (family had sold off the mountain properties and what not over the years). For the wife (from ranchland of Oregon) and I (mountains of Idaho), parents had passed, extended family not really close.

Army burned me of deserts. All of Southern Idaho is desert.

Snow. Got too old to really want to deal with snow and months of sub-zero temperatures. Playing in the snow (snowmobiles) required a 3-hour drive from the Boise valley.

Crime. MS13 moved in with the Californians and brought daily gang shootings (red vs. blue) at the convience stores, drug deals over my back fence and local LE had no clue how or desire to deal with it. Home invasions, car thefts, heavy (why we live in Stewart County now) also, I feel safer driving in Nashville now than I did in the Boise Metro area.

Water. Lakes there are crap, at least the lowland ones. Wanted to live near more natural water and natural green(refernce the desert comment above).

Longer warm weather. We like riding motorcycles and more summer activities than winter.

Had an Army buddy settle here from his time at Ft. Campbell. We visited a few times and Stewart County reminds me alot of the small county I grew up in.

Property value (Don't hate me over this one becuase I know it is an evil we helped perpetuate.) We sold our urban, suburb, 1200 sq ft house on 1/8 acre that we still owed on and had enough left over to pay cash for 2 acres, 1800 sq ft, build a shop, pay off the cars, pay cash for a new bike, used boat, and stuff a bunch of money in the bank.

So that's it.

 

Edited August 7, 2022 by DO-TN

[RED333]

2 hours ago, DO-TN said:

Sure,

Retirement. 52 years old, 18 years of Federal Service (Army and Civilian) and counting. Seeking out a place to enjoy my pension and retirement in the next few years.

No family left any longer (family had sold off the mountain properties and what not over the years). For the wife (from ranchland of Oregon) and I (mountains of Idaho), parents had passed, extended family not really close.

Army burned me of deserts. All of Southern Idaho is desert.

Snow. Got too old to really want to deal with snow and months of sub-zero temperatures. Playing in the snow (snowmobiles) required a 3-hour drive from the Boise valley.

Crime. MS13 moved in with the Californians and brought daily gang shootings (red vs. blue) at the convience stores, drug deals over my back fence and local LE had no clue how or desire to deal with it. Home invasions, car thefts, heavy (why we live in Stewart County now) also, I feel safer driving in Nashville now than I did in the Boise Metro area.

Water. Lakes there are crap, at least the lowland ones. Wanted to live near more natural water and natural green(refernce the desert comment above).

Longer warm weather. We like riding motorcycles and more summer activities than winter.

Had an Army buddy settle here from his time at Ft. Campbell. We visited a few times and Stewart County reminds me alot of the small county I grew up in.

Property value (Don't hate me over this one becuase I know it is an evil we helped perpetuate.) We sold our urban, suburb, 1200 sq ft house on 1/8 acre that we still owed on and had enough left over to pay cash for 2 acres, 1800 sq ft, build a shop, pay off the cars, pay cash for a new bike, used boat, and stuff a bunch of money in the bank.

So that's it.

 

Cant argue with any of these reasons, welcome to TN.

[Snaveba]

Yep, Weclome. 
 

I am in Nashvegas. Once my daughter is off to college in a year, my wife and I are considering selling the house in Nashville (it had appreciated greatly over the last 23 years, we bought at the right time),  and moving further out to get more house/land. 

[300winmag]

The gun laws used to be even worse in TN for people with carry permits up until about ten years ago.  You could not even legally carry inside any decent restaurant because they all sell alcohol.   

TN is one of the few states that has a mid level misdemeanor weapons offense for people WITH permits for violating a 'no guns' signs.  

Most of the states surrounding TN also have legal college carry for people with permits.   TN does not generally have legal college carry with a permit, unless you are an employee at the college you are carrying at.  It is legal to carry in K-12 schools with a permit in a couple of the surrounding states.

[StephenB]

TN code 39-17-1359 that enforces properly posted signs drives me nuts.  I will never understand this.  Anyone who is going to do something bad will not be stopped by a sign with specific sized letters.  The way I see it is a business owner should be allowed to post a sign and if they see me carrying they can ask me to leave or I will be trespassed - I would happily leave with no issues.  It creates "soft spots" if nothing else.  Law abiding citizens are the only ones who will even think about honoring a sign and those are the people who are not the threat.  I have emailed lawmakers in the state and hope one day they will realize how dumb it is.  Even if they made the sign only apply to permitless carriers at least it would be a small step forward, even though I believe it should not apply to anyone.

[monkeylizard]

As mentioned above, join the TFA. That's one of the best ways to try to get good work done on our behalf on TN Capitol Hill.

[StephenB]

On 9/13/2022 at 11:06 PM, monkeylizard said:

As mentioned above, join the TFA. That's one of the best ways to try to get good work done on our behalf on TN Capitol Hill.

I had not heard about the TFA until recently.  It looks like they don't keep the site up very well, but they do have an active Facebook presence so I assume they are still an active organization.  Do they publish information for what they are trying to get changed (like 39-17-1359)?

[Defender]

They don't spend much on websites, etc, concentrating more on pushing for legislation.  They do, however, send out regular emails outlining what they are doing.

[monkeylizard]

John Harris is too busy knocking on doors at the Capitol building to always keep the site up to date. Trust us. He's working hard for all of us.

[Worriedman]

As the season gets going to prepare for session once more, I will be visiting more often to inform on bills TFA is advocating for.

We actually had a good primary season, and look forward to adding a number of solid House members.

Our year should be much better with the Bruen ruling.

As usual though, the House will be far more accommodating to restoring rights taken by previous iterations of the General Assembly, the Senate not so much.

Senate Judiciary will be chaired by either Gardenhire or Lundberg and either will be a death knell for 2A bills.  Bell killed the good stuff to gain his new seat at the TWRA table in return, and we are left with no help at all in the Senate Judiciary.

Edited October 18, 2022 by Worriedman

[PitMyShants!]

Little bit late to the thread but I'm a big fan of a lot of these. TFA membership coming right up.

[300winmag]

The enhanced carry permit needs to actually be enhanced so that you can legally carry in more places.  The 'no guns' signs weapons crime should not apply to the enhanced carry permit.  That should only be a trespass issue if someone does not leave when asked just as it is in most states.  Full college carry should also be legalized for enhanced permits.  College employees can already carry with enhanced permits in TN plus most of the states bordering TN already have legal college carry for people with carry permits.

[Worriedman]

On 12/1/2022 at 9:59 AM, 300winmag said:

The enhanced carry permit needs to actually be enhanced so that you can legally carry in more places.  The 'no guns' signs weapons crime should not apply to the enhanced carry permit.  That should only be a trespass issue if someone does not leave when asked just as it is in most states.  Full college carry should also be legalized for enhanced permits.  College employees can already carry with enhanced permits in TN plus most of the states bordering TN already have legal college carry for people with carry permits.

We tried to run this bill last year, the Rep. from Crockett County (Chris Hurt) had the bill, but the Chairman of the House Civil Justice sub refused to let him run the bill for vote, they told the sponsor he could present it only if he agreed to take it off notice as soon as he did, I asked him to run it and ask for a recorded vote, he refused.

Got to play b all with Leadership you understand.