$3.69-$3.89 Where/when does it end?

[deerslayer]

The good old days…

 

[papa61]

It will never end but I believe $7 plus by end of summer is what we'll see.

[Moped]

16 hours ago, BJB said:

gas is $4.09 in Kingston today  

my question, how is the normal ever day person going to afford a $70,000 electric car when they cant afford bread and milk  . and which electric vehicle will pull my horse trailer 

It think you might be very surprised at how much these trucks are capable of pulling! Also the prices are competitive with combustion engine trucks.  The Range isn't bad either.  

https://rxmechanic.com/electric-pickup-truck/

[Daniel]

On 3/8/2022 at 8:30 AM, deerslayer said:

Exactly.  Gas was $1.89 two or three years ago.  Wonder what changed. 

The number of people using gas and thus it's availability. 

[Capbyrd]

48 minutes ago, Moped said:

It think you might be very surprised at how much these trucks are capable of pulling! Also the prices are competitive with combustion engine trucks.  The Range isn't bad either.  

https://rxmechanic.com/electric-pickup-truck/

Range when towing is severely diminished.  

[Daniel]

22 hours ago, Erik88 said:

I actually don't know much about this but someone on Reddit recently asked the same question. This article is from 2018 but explains why. 

TLDR from article:

-Not all oil is the same.

-Location. We buy a lot from Canada because it makes more sense for Northern states to get it from them apparently since most of our production is along the gulf coast.

- Differences in quality.

https://www.api.org/news-policy-and-issues/blog/2018/06/14/why-the-us-must-import-and-export-oil

This. People talk about the Keystone XL like it was going to supply the US with gas.   It was to transport low grade tar sand oil for foreign use.  

[Daniel]

https://www.vice.com/en/article/jgmkb3/drill-baby-drill-is-americas-only-idea

‘Drill, Baby, Drill’ Is America’s Only Idea

 

Every decade or so, Americans freak out over soaring gas prices but never commit to changing the fundamental dynamics that make it such a problem to begin with.

Edited March 9, 2022 by Daniel

[Daniel]

https://www.caranddriver.com/news/g35562831/ev-plans-automakers-timeline/

https://www.iea.org/reports/global-ev-outlook-2021/trends-and-developments-in-electric-vehicle-markets

[Darrell]

 

36 minutes ago, Daniel said:

This. People talk about the Keystone XL like it was going to supply the US with gas.   It was to transport low grade tar sand oil for foreign use.  

From Wikipedia:

TransCanada Keystone Pipeline GP Ltd,^[14] abbreviated here as Keystone, operates four phases of the project. In 2013, the first two phases had the capacity to deliver up to 590,000 barrels (94,000 m³) per day of oil into the Midwest refineries.^[15] Phase III has capacity to deliver up to 700,000 barrels (110,000 m³) per day to the Texas refineries.^[16] By comparison, production of petroleum in the United States averaged 9.4 million barrels (1.5 million cubic meters) per day in first-half 2015, with gross exports of 500,000 barrels (79,000 m³) per day through July 2015.^[17]

The proposed Phase IV, Keystone XL (sometimes abbreviated KXL, with XL standing for "export limited"^[18]) Pipeline, would have connected the Phase I-pipeline terminals in Hardisty, Alberta, and Steele City, Nebraska, by a shorter route and a larger-diameter pipe.^[19] It would have run through Baker, Montana, where American-produced light crude oil from the Williston Basin (Bakken formation) of Montana and North Dakota would have been added^[12] to the Keystone's throughput of synthetic crude oil (syncrude) and diluted bitumen (dilbit) from the oil sands of Canada.

[gregintenn]

8 minutes ago, Darrell said:

 

From Wikipedia:

TransCanada Keystone Pipeline GP Ltd,^[14] abbreviated here as Keystone, operates four phases of the project. In 2013, the first two phases had the capacity to deliver up to 590,000 barrels (94,000 m³) per day of oil into the Midwest refineries.^[15] Phase III has capacity to deliver up to 700,000 barrels (110,000 m³) per day to the Texas refineries.^[16] By comparison, production of petroleum in the United States averaged 9.4 million barrels (1.5 million cubic meters) per day in first-half 2015, with gross exports of 500,000 barrels (79,000 m³) per day through July 2015.^[17]

The proposed Phase IV, Keystone XL (sometimes abbreviated KXL, with XL standing for "export limited"^[18]) Pipeline, would have connected the Phase I-pipeline terminals in Hardisty, Alberta, and Steele City, Nebraska, by a shorter route and a larger-diameter pipe.^[19] It would have run through Baker, Montana, where American-produced light crude oil from the Williston Basin (Bakken formation) of Montana and North Dakota would have been added^[12] to the Keystone's throughput of synthetic crude oil (syncrude) and diluted bitumen (dilbit) from the oil sands of Canada.

 But you can’t believe anything you see on Wikipedia!

[Luckyforward]

At the time it was ended, only 8% of the pipeline had been completed.  

https://www.reuters.com/article/factcheck-keystonepipelinexl-builtandpai/fact-check-though-keystone-xl-pipeline-had-secured-most-of-its-funding-it-was-only-8-constructed-idUSL1N2LA2SQ

[Chucktshoes]

Everyone loves to frame this as an either/or situation. That’s the wrong way to go about it. It’s an all of the above situation. We should absolutely be encouraging ramping up fossil fuel production for the short term. At the same time we need to be building nuclear plants and securing raw material rights around the world along with investing in technology improvements for battery production. These aren’t solutions that will fix anything over the next month year or even 10. This is about long-term energy independence. The problem is that the people making these decisions have no desire nor incentive to think past the next election cycle.  A pox on all of them.

 

TLDR:if you are against immediate increased fossil fuel production, eff you. If you’re against fullbore investment in electric and renewables, eff you too. Both camps are more interested in scoring wins or their own personal vendetta is actually accomplishing anything of merit.

Edited March 9, 2022 by Chucktshoes

[Grayfox54]

The big issue with electric cars always has and always will be the batteries. Cost, size. weight. run time, available recharging and disposal. Until these things are corrected, electric cars just ain't practical. 

Meantime, we're stuck with the high cost of gas and there really ain't much we can do about it. 

[Chucktshoes]

6 minutes ago, Grayfox54 said:

The big issue with electric cars always has and always will be the batteries. Cost, size. weight. run time, available recharging and disposal. Until these things are corrected, electric cars just ain't practical. 

Meantime, we're stuck with the high cost of gas and there really ain't much we can do about it. 

This is the infrastructure that I’m talking about as needing investment. 

[Grayfox54]

[gregintenn]

10 minutes ago, Grayfox54 said:

That’s what I’ve been screaming for a while now. I’ve yet to get a coherent answer.

[Chucktshoes]

1 minute ago, gregintenn said:

That’s what I’ve been screaming for a while now. I’ve yet to get a coherent answer.

Nuclear. 

[gregintenn]

5 minutes ago, Chucktshoes said:

Nuclear. 

Have you seen it happening?

[Omega]

7 minutes ago, Chucktshoes said:

Nuclear. 

I still see people driving alone with a mask on, you think they will overcome the fear of nuke power plants to get behind building one near them?

[Chucktshoes]

9 minutes ago, gregintenn said:

Have you seen it happening?

 

5 minutes ago, Omega said:

I still see people driving alone with a mask on, you think they will overcome the fear of nuke power plants to get behind building one near them?

Reference the part where I said folks who have the ability to do something aren’t interested in doing anything of merit. 

[Daniel]

54 minutes ago, Grayfox54 said:

The big issue with electric cars always has and always will be the batteries. Cost, size. weight. run time, available recharging and disposal. Until these things are corrected, electric cars just ain't practical. 

Meantime, we're stuck with the high cost of gas and there really ain't much we can do about it. 

Car engines didnt start like they are today.  They had to be adopted first. 


Someone earlier mentioned oils use in plastics etc.  Oil will still have a need to be drilled it just shouldnt be burned.

[deerslayer]

3 hours ago, Daniel said:

The number of people using gas and thus it's availability. 

So demand decreased.  

[gregintenn]

29 minutes ago, Daniel said:

Car engines didnt start like they are today.  They had to be adopted first. 


Someone earlier mentioned oils use in plastics etc.  Oil will still have a need to be drilled it just shouldnt be burned.

How are we going to charge them?

[Darrell]

1 hour ago, Chucktshoes said:

Nuclear. 

Nuclear power plants can supply the power, but the left hates nuclear as much as coal. And of course there's more to it than just generating power, it must make it to your home, too. I'm counting on dilithium crystals.

[gregintenn]

3 minutes ago, Darrell said:

Nuclear power plants can supply the power, but the left hates nuclear as much as coal. And of course there's more to it than just generating power, it must make it to your home, too. I'm counting on dilithium crystals.

I cannot confirm this, but have been told that if everything went perfectly, it would take more than 50 years just to get the proper permits to begin construction of a nuclear plant.