What would it take….

[gregintenn]

….to construct a facility to produce primers for public sale?

Could it be made to be a profitable business?

Edited January 18, 2022 by gregintenn

[Darrell]

You wouldn't think it would be all that hard. Primers are simple devices, just a couple pieces of pressed metal with some chemical compound. But the licensing, hazmat etc. might be a nightmare. 

Great question, though, and something I'll bet has been considered by people who could make it happen. 

This is a brief explanation:

A primer cap is a stamping made from rolled copper-alloy sheet. The sheet is fed into a small stamping press where a multiple die set produces more than a dozen caps on each stroke. The caps are often nickel-plated. Primer caps are made in different diameters for different applications. 

In manufacture, the primer caps are filled with primer mix using a method called "rubbing." This process begins with a thin steel plate containing several hundred holes. The plates are placed on shaker tables and primer caps broadcast over their surface. The shaking motion causes a cap to fall into each hole. Next, the plate is sent into the primer "rubbing room," a heavily built and spotlessly clean room where plates sit on a metal table and wet priming compound is hand-rubbed over the surface to fill each cap.

Edited January 18, 2022 by Darrell

[gregintenn]

I’m seriously wondering if we could form a group here who could get it off the ground. The market is definitely there.

[Erik88]

Someone is bored in retirement... 

[bobsguns]

I asked a buddy of mine that very same thing. 

He said it would be an EPA/OSHA nightmare of unimaginable proportions. He has a strong background in mfgr, specifically at an aluminum plant in Waverly decades ago. 

He thought between the ventilation, drainage of the floor, filtration systems, etc, it'd be millions of dollars before the actual mfg equipment got purchased. That includes the bldg as well, of course.

Then there's the limits of getting the actual primer chemicals to make them. There's a reason almost all primer plants are outside the US these days. 

[Beltfed]

Talk about a can of worms!  Look on YouTube for a short film on making primers.  The cost will be very high, the over site by Uncle Sam will be high, the dangers of the primmer compound will be high.  Then try to get insurance.

Not to nag, but you should have stocked up.

[gregintenn]

I'm well stocked. I just see a market that isn't very well serviced. That's where money is made.

The process doesn't look much more complicated than producing something like bottle caps. The safety issues and govt regulations look to me to be the biggest hurdles.

I don't see all that much equipment needed other than some basic presses and tooling and such. Not unlike any other assembly line type factory would have.

Edited January 18, 2022 by gregintenn

[gregintenn]

1 hour ago, Erik88 said:

Someone is bored in retirement... 

Yep. The Harley doesn't do so well in snow.

[MP5_Rizzo]

Making a small fortune by manufacturing primers is real easy.  First thing you do is start out with a large fortune!

Seriously though between all the initial investments and governmental regs. unless you've got some intel on raw materials that nobody else has figured out then you may be on to something.

[derf]

I know two FedEx pilots who were about to invest millions to produce every component to construct AR15’s. I owned a gun shop at the time and advised them to be very careful as this market was so volatile. Up one day and down the next. Well they didn’t take the risk and it payed off. Turns out a few months later Obama backed off some of his crap and everyone had AR’s and they were cheap. They would have lost their butts. Please be patient. I’m 65 and seen the gun world go up and down too many times. 

[deerslayer]

7 hours ago, gregintenn said:

….to construct a facility to produce primers for public sale?

Could it be made to be a profitable business?

I'm sure it could be done.  The problem would be that the proprietors would probably soon decide to sell to ammo manufacturers, and then Johnny Public is right back where he started.  

Edited January 19, 2022 by deerslayer

[No_0ne]

On 1/18/2022 at 12:03 PM, Darrell said:

Next, the plate is sent into the primer "rubbing room," a heavily built and spotlessly clean room where plates sit on a metal table and wet priming compound is hand-rubbed over the surface to fill each cap.

Pay really close attention to this statement.  I've seen a video of the process and it's almost medieval the way it's done almost entirely by hand.  Couple that with the fact that dealing with priming compounds is extremely dangerous, which is why they're handled wet and in explosion proofed rooms and you have a hiring, regulatory and and insurance nightmare.  If adding capacity was cheap and easy to do, the ammo manufacturers would have already done it several times over, if for nothing else than meeting their own needs.  I doubt you would ever obtain the necessary permits to open a new plant, similar facilities that once manufactured flares and other explosive components have been hounded out of business in many communities, including some right here in Tennessee (to be fair, many of these had truly atrocious safety records, some were well known for routine explosions).  Finally, the entire gun, ammo and component business is excessively cyclical, it's "boom or bust" most of the time, which is one of the reasons why companies are hesitant to add more capacity.  There's no guarantee that once this extra capacity (and expense) comes online that it won't be left idling once we enter another of the "bust" periods.  We're currently in one of the periodic "boom" cycles, but as the old-timers always said, 'this too shall pass" at some point ...

Edited January 19, 2022 by No_0ne

[papa61]

On 1/18/2022 at 1:47 PM, gregintenn said:

Yep. The Harley doesn't do so well in snow.

try a set of these

[gregintenn]

I think I’ll pass.

[papa61]

23 minutes ago, gregintenn said:

I think I’ll pass.

release your inner daredevil!

my son washed my bike for me one day. did a great job, right down to armor-all on the tires. after prying the seat out of my butt I had a good laugh.

[RED333]

16 hours ago, papa61 said:

try a set of these

When my brother and myself were teens we cut up some old peddle bike chain and some coat hangers, made bike chains. we could pull wheelies on ice and show.  Was a blast till the things came apart and smacked our legs, coat hanger wrapped around the axles.

[bobsguns]

2 hours ago, RED333 said:

When my brother and myself were teens we cut up some old peddle bike chain and some coat hangers, made bike chains. we could pull wheelies on ice and show.  Was a blast till the things came apart and smacked our legs, coat hanger wrapped around the axles.

All that is something kids today will never know. Sad.

[aknifemaker]

We used to go ice racing on Lake George in upstate NY, they had a portion of the lake plowed into an oval it was a blast!!

[gregintenn]

I'm trying to get you guys a reliable supply of primers set up, and you all just want to make fun of my motorcycle!Bunch of ingrates.

[Dirtshooter]

Greg I hate to bust your bubble, but primers are about like .22 ammo, there probably never has been much profit. I think the only reason they sell us any primers is they have such a glut, more than they need to make us ready to shoot ammo. This thought has run across my mind before, but think about it all the folks that shoot and reload somebody would have already done it. As said in previous posts, you have to jump thru 14,003 hoops before you could even get a box of 100 primers produced. However if you figure out a way, I bet we could make enough money to buy worms to fish with!!

[gregintenn]

1 hour ago, Dirtshooter said:

Greg I hate to bust your bubble, but primers are about like .22 ammo, there probably never has been much profit. I think the only reason they sell us any primers is they have such a glut, more than they need to make us ready to shoot ammo. This thought has run across my mind before, but think about it all the folks that shoot and reload somebody would have already done it. As said in previous posts, you have to jump thru 14,003 hoops before you could even get a box of 100 primers produced. However if you figure out a way, I bet we could make enough money to buy worms to fish with!!

So you’re saying there’s a chance.

[Dirtshooter]

1 minute ago, gregintenn said:

So you’re saying there’s a chance.

Yea about the same chance as me winning the lottery and I may have bought 2 tickets all of last year!! But keep your hopes up and don't let my post get ya down!!

[Darrell]

On 1/19/2022 at 2:55 PM, papa61 said:

my son washed my bike for me one day. did a great job, right down to armor-all on the tires

My wife thought the seat of my race bike would look a lot better with Armorall. Or maybe she was looking for insurance money.....

[Omega]

1 hour ago, gregintenn said:

I'm trying to get you guys a reliable supply of primers set up, and you all just want to make fun of my motorcycle!Bunch of ingrates.

Dang @gregintenn, didn't know you were that connected.

Ammunition plant to open near Texarkana

Quote

HOOKS, Texas -- Expansion Industries, an ammunition manufacturing company whose corporate offices are based out of Carrollton, Texas, is preparing to open a manufacturing facility here.

They have begun preparation work on the East Campus of TexAmericas Center, purchasing the main G Line of the former Lone Star Army Ammunition plant, and have begun preparing the site for operations.

Recently, they also have begun a recruiting drive, advertising an on-site job fair they have coming up Jan. 29. They plan on employing more than 400 by 2023 and have plans beyond that.

The facility will specialize in the production of primers, a key component in ammunition manufacturing, for the small arms industry.

 

[gregintenn]

1 hour ago, Omega said:

Dang @gregintenn, didn't know you were that connected.

Ammunition plant to open near Texarkana

 

Well, I tried to get you guys in on the ground floor, but the cat is out of the bag now.