Brass life.

[Handsome Rob]

Not "how many firings" this time. 

I have some one fired brass that I just necked up from 8 to 9x57. Thing is, the one time it was fired (according to some deep dive historical headstamp research) was probably before 1920. Most of it dates to 1900-1920

All but 1 necked up perfectly (one neck actually ripped off. Never had that happen before, probably should've annealed first) & they seem like they should be fine, but I'm wondering if anyone knows: does brass get brittle with age? Some of these cases were so patinated they looked more like bronze, than brass. Can I anneal the entire case, to be sure? 

The load I have worked up is light & should be super low pressure (44,000CUP estimate) but I'm worried about the possibility of head separation due to the brass becoming brittle. Is that a thing? 

When I necked up some .308 brass for my .358 I had a bunch of split necks. Obviously, jumping up by a whole millimeter (0.039) isn't quite as much of a stretch compared to 0.05 but would I be better served by neck annealing anyway? 

Edited September 30, 2021 by Handsome Rob

[Grunt67]

Rob, I don't know,  just a guess, but brass dating that far back, it's anybody's guess how the brass was new. Speaking of mfg methods, etc.

As for getting brittle with age, never read anything about that. Kinda doubt it,  but JMHO

[Alleycat72]

You can't anneal the entire case. Bad thing would happen. Only the neck. Your best bet is annealing the neck and getting an expander that's tapered or around 8.5 mm. It'll be a 2 step process, but you'll split less.

[Alleycat72]

Or if you just want 20

https://www.buffaloarms.com/9x57-mauser-cases-9x57mauser.html

[leroy]

It needs neck anealing Brother.  Google a bit and ya will find the " put the case in water " and tip it over method. The necks of the cases are work hardened from the neck being stretched. Ya will most likely need ta trim em too. 

leroy. 

[Mowgli Terry]

A unique event: Years ago I was getting all my 35 Whelen brass together. The new RCBS tapered expander ball had been installed in the RCBS dies. There we some brass that had not been resized. I did have several of these cased fail. The fractures  were at the base of the neck extended some into the shoulder. Imperial neck lube had been used. Case lube was Imperial wax. The cases were formed from 30-06 brass. Age unknown.

I had fire formed 300 Weatherby from RP brass. I had this brass for more than thirty years. Brass was clean factory primed cases for reloading. No problems.

Edited October 1, 2021 by Mowgli Terry

[Sunfish]

Rob is your rifle a 9x57 or a 9.3 x57.  I have opened up 8x57 for the 9.3x57 with no problems. Most of the brass that I have used is Remington 8x57. I will tell you that anytime you open up brass your OAL will be less. Annealed Military brass is probably thicker than commercial brass is to begin with and since these guns are all bolt action I wouldn't worry a whole lot about it. I would fire a light load in it to form it to the chamber and then neck size it from then on. I have had a lot of success with AA2520 in the 57 mm case. If you would like I have a few Norma 9.3 x57 cases that are new that I could be traded out of maybe. Let me know.     Sunfish   

[Mowgli Terry]

I had made  9,3x57 cases by using my Hornady dies with late model tapered expander ball.  I went ahead and full length resized the 8x57 PPU brass, I did not want to inherit problems from whatever firearm the brass was fired originally.  I found four sources of loading data. Three were from "Handloader" magazine and one from Norma. Let me know if I can help.

Back in the dark ages I have made 9x57 cases using an Lyman "M" die. Nary a problem then or now. Annealing the 9.3 cases is on the agenda.

Edited October 2, 2021 by Mowgli Terry

[Handsome Rob]

On 10/1/2021 at 6:28 PM, Sunfish said:

Rob is your rifle a 9x57 or a 9.3 x57.  I have opened up 8x57 for the 9.3x57 with no problems. Most of the brass that I have used is Remington 8x57. I will tell you that anytime you open up brass your OAL will be less. Annealed Military brass is probably thicker than commercial brass is to begin with and since these guns are all bolt action I wouldn't worry a whole lot about it. I would fire a light load in it to form it to the chamber and then neck size it from then on. I have had a lot of success with AA2520 in the 57 mm case. If you would like I have a few Norma 9.3 x57 cases that are new that I could be traded out of maybe. Let me know.     Sunfish   

 

Thanks, it's a 9x57. I've not experienced any case splitting during shooting I it, I was just wondering, more than anything, if brass degraded with age. Some of this stuff is literally WW1 Era. It sized up just fine (other than the one....) & I've since annealed it before loading. 

I've got a few old, factory 9x57 brass, some factory loads (that I REALLY don't want to shoot) & all the rest of my brass is either 9.3 necked down, or 8mm necked up. I'm loading 46gn of 4064 (fixed irons, so I had to load to the sight. 

The problems I had with the .358 were all down to me not annealing the brass & then running super hot loads, right off the bat. I've not had an issue since I started being more diligent & less enthusiastic!

[srszczer]

When did they phase out mercuric primers? That's what I'd be worried about most with components that old.

[No_0ne]

On 10/17/2021 at 12:12 AM, srszczer said:

When did they phase out mercuric primers? That's what I'd be worried about most with components that old.

The first non-corrosive primers were made in the 20's, but didn't become very popular until the mid-50's when many of the world's military organizations began switching over ...