Has the law changed?

[DaveS]

Think of it this way....You are stopped by LEO for lets say...speeding. The officer is standing at your car window waiting for you to retreive your registration and Insurance info from your glove box. You lean over and your handgun falls onto the floor or onto the seat. LEO is most likely going to step back, shove his Glock in your face and start yelling for you to keep your hands on the steering wheel, or get out of the vehicle and onto to the ground. With society as it is today, the officers response would be appropriate for his own safety. Now, if he knew "up front" that you were armed and that happened....he may only ask you not to touch it, or even hand it to him with your off hand. I personally will let him know. No reason to disrespect the officer and he would probably appreciate your assistance. Your honesty may even get you a warning instead of a ticket! Just my .2 cents worth!

Dave

[Fallguy]

If your weapon falls to the floor just because you leaned over...you deserve to be treated like a thug....

Also I don't see not informing as a sign of disrespect anymore than I think it is being cute.

[Guest slothful1]

I guess my biggest thing is that simply volunteering the information somehow implies that being armed is something dirty or to be ashamed of or that you need some sort of defense for being legally armed.

In this very thread the expressions "own up" and "fess up" have been used to describe this notification, implying that the armed person is doing something wrong or shameful.

[Guest sling]

If your weapon falls to the floor just because you leaned over...you deserve to be treated like a thug....

Also I don't see not informing as a sign of disrespect anymore than I think it is being cute.

+1

You seriously suck at life if that happens.

[Guest JeepMonkey]

If your weapon falls to the floor just because you leaned over...you deserve to be treated like a thug....

Plaxico Burris anyone?

[Guest bughunter]

Since your DL and your HCP number is one in the same, it is best to tell them up front. I would not feel right knowing the LEO is back there running my DL only to find I carry and for some reason did NOT tell him/her about it.

[TGO David]

In this very thread the expressions "own up" and "fess up" have been used to describe this notification, implying that the armed person is doing something wrong or shameful.

This dissection of semantics is beyond silly. Considering that not many people on a web forum give that much thought to the words they choose when expressing a thought, you are choosing to read an incredible amount of assumed implication into the things written here.

The proper terminology would be that some of us prefer to INFORM the officer of our HCP and carry status. I am neither ashamed of my armed status nor am I doing something wrong by carrying. I just prefer to get that part of the discovery process out of the way so that the officer can do his job without any surprises that might be unpleasant to him.

I swear, sometimes I think we'd all just as soon argue about what color the sky is.

[Punisher84]

I swear, sometimes I think we'd all just as soon argue about what color the sky is.

I disagree.

[Fallguy]

Well I thought about posting this yesterday, but decided this thread had been quite but since it has become active again.

I decided to get out and ride the motorcycle yesterday afternoon. Didn't really have any route in mind...so I just turned south to start. Well I hadn't even gone a mile and a half and I guess I was thinking too much about what route I wanted to take instead of how fast I was going. Met a LEO saw go into the center lane...so I knew what was next. Pulled over just a bit up the road. Got off the bike. Asked me where I was headed, told him just out. Just normal conversation. He asked me for me license and insurance. Now..I was armed, had my Glock 32 in my right front pocket. If you were a sheep, you'd probably never know, but it wasn't invisible either. I moved a few months ago and I did the change of address online but my actual license still has my old address on it, so I gave him the printout from the state's website with the new address on it. On that printout it says to the officer he may want to check the DL to make sure the information is correct. So he takes my DL and Insurance paper to the car. Now we have already interacted a 2-3 minutes at this point. I thought for a quick second as whether to tell him I was armed or not, but I didn't see any reason to, even though I knew he was about to run my DL and I had just posted that even though this was my choice I hadn't had to make the choice lately, so I figured I would stick by my position on the mater. Well after a few more minutes he comes back, gives me my DL and insurance card back. Tells me he has cited me for speeding, gives me the info on how to take care of it or the court date. I sign it and we both go on our way.

Now...let me give a little bit more info (I know too long already)

I was riding a motorcycle,

I had a non-DOT beanie helmet on,

I have a corrective lenses restriction on my DL but I was not wearing my prescription glasses,

I had to have paper backup of change of address for my DL.

All possible "red flags"

And after running my license.........nothing adverse happened.

He didn't get out the patrol car and order me to the ground at gun point,

He didn't stick his gun in my ear,

He didn't asked if I was armed...so naturally he didn't ask why I didn't inform him.

Now...also just to be clear...in Milan, TN you are going to get a ticket if you are stopped...so there was no chance of showing my HCP and hoping that would get me any favors.

Now whether to inform or not is still a choice I think each person has to make for themselves based on the situation at hand, but....if you don't, it's not a guarantee that bad things will happen despite what some may think.

[Punisher84]

Well I thought about posting this yesterday, but decided this thread had been quite but since it has become active again.

I decided to get out and ride the motorcycle yesterday afternoon. Didn't really have any route in mind...so I just turned south to start. Well I hadn't even gone a mile and a half and I guess I was thinking too much about what route I wanted to take instead of how fast I was going. Met a LEO saw go into the center lane...so I knew what was next. Pulled over just a bit up the road. Got off the bike. Asked me where I was headed, told him just out. Just normal conversation. He asked me for me license and insurance. Now..I was armed, had my Glock 32 in my right front pocket. If you were a sheep, you'd probably never know, but it wasn't invisible either. I moved a few months ago and I did the change of address online but my actual license still has my old address on it, so I gave him the printout from the state's website with the new address on it. On that printout it says to the officer he may want to check the DL to make sure the information is correct. So he takes my DL and Insurance paper to the car. Now we have already interacted a 2-3 minutes at this point. I thought for a quick second as whether to tell him I was armed or not, but I didn't see any reason to, even though I knew he was about to run my DL and I had just posted that even though this was my choice I hadn't had to make the choice lately, so I figured I would stick by my position on the mater. Well after a few more minutes he comes back, gives me my DL and insurance card back. Tells me he has cited me for speeding, gives me the info on how to take care of it or the court date. I sign it and we both go on our way.

Now...let me give a little bit more info (I know too long already)

I was riding a motorcycle,

I had a non-DOT beanie helmet on,

I have a corrective lenses restriction on my DL but I was not wearing my prescription glasses,

I had to have paper backup of change of address for my DL.

All possible "red flags"

And after running my license.........nothing adverse happened.

He didn't get out the patrol car and order me to the ground at gun point,

He didn't stick his gun in my ear,

He didn't asked if I was armed...so naturally he didn't ask why I didn't inform him.

Now...also just to be clear...in Milan, TN you are going to get a ticket if you are stopped...so there was no chance of showing my HCP and hoping that would get me any favors.

Now whether to inform or not is still a choice I think each person has to make for themselves based on the situation at hand, but....if you don't, it's not a guarantee that bad things will happen despite what some may think.

Good post! Yesterday was awesome bike weather!

[Fallguy]

Good post! Yesterday was awesome bike weather!

Yep...one reason I went ahead with my 100+mile ride, even after the rough start...lol

One good thing is, I talked with a friend of mine that is friends with an officer in Milan. Told him I haven't had a ticket in 15-20 years. He said I should come to court and it would probably be dismissed...I hope so at least.

[Punisher84]

Yep...one reason I went ahead with my 100+mile ride, even after the rough start...lol

One good thing is, I talked with a friend of mine that is friends with an officer in Milan. Told him I haven't had a ticket in 15-20 years. He said I should come to court and it would probably be dismissed...I hope so at least.

That'd be nice of them lol I never get anything dismissed so I just try not to break the law in any shape form or fashion.

[Guest archerdr1]

they will trust you a whole lot more if you tell them. I had a couple of Red Bank Officers say to me "I figure that if you were going to try to use it on me you wouldn't tell me that you had it."

[DaveTN]

I’m going to tell them.

Not because I think they need to know, but because I know for a fact that the more friendly conversation we have, the closer I am to driving off with a warning instead of a ticket.

[Guest db99wj]

Through conversations with multiple LEO's on this subject, I am informing. Understand Fallguy's position and respect that but my decision is different than his. I have informed twice and got tickets twice... (speeding and tail light)

[Guest archerdr1]

Think of it this way....You are stopped by LEO for lets say...speeding. The officer is standing at your car window waiting for you to retreive your registration and Insurance info from your glove box. You lean over and your handgun falls onto the floor or onto the seat. LEO is most likely going to step back, shove his Glock in your face and start yelling for you to keep your hands on the steering wheel, or get out of the vehicle and onto to the ground. With society as it is today, the officers response would be appropriate for his own safety. Now, if he knew "up front" that you were armed and that happened....he may only ask you not to touch it, or even hand it to him with your off hand. I personally will let him know. No reason to disrespect the officer and he would probably appreciate your assistance. Your honesty may even get you a warning instead of a ticket! Just my .2 cents worth!

Dave

this would also be why I keep my insurance card and registration in the visor mirror (I don't understand why they put that mirror there in the first place, so I might as well keep it there to keep my wife from checking her makeup). I just grab it as I am pulling over and have it and my dl and HCP sticking out the window when he gets there. Makes for a much faster end to the whole thing.

[Fallguy]

Through conversations with multiple LEO's on this subject, I am informing. Understand Fallguy's position and respect that but my decision is different than his. I have informed twice and got tickets twice... (speeding and tail light)

...and I really have no problem with anyone informing, if that is what they want to do. I also admit there is a slight chance it could result in a favorable outcome on the reason for the stop.

It is only when someone says there will be dire consequences if you don't or worse yet feel a LEOs "unfavorable" reaction is justified if you don't is when I tend to disagree.

[Guest db99wj]

...and I really have no problem with anyone informing, if that is what they want to do. I also admit there is a slight chance it could result in a favorable outcome on the reason for the stop.

It is only when someone says there will be dire consequences if you don't or worse yet feel a LEOs "unfavorable" reaction is justified if you don't is when I tend to disagree.

I agree....

[DaveTN]

I have informed twice and got tickets twice... (speeding and tail light)

What the he11?? A taillight violation is something we use to pull people over for when we wanted to look in their cars; no one gets a ticket for it. Man you must have really pizzed that cop off.

Just kidding man, just kidding

[Guest db99wj]

What the he11?? A taillight violation is something we use to pull people over for when we wanted to look in their cars; no one gets a ticket for it. Man you must have really pizzed that cop off.

Just kidding man, just kidding

That's what I was wondering, my kids were in the Jeep with me, and it was during the day. The interaction was fine, I was polite, she was polite, she said, Hangun permit..ok (to herself but loud enough I could hear it), wrote the ticket, talked about how cars are made up of sub par components (Jeeps tailights are not designed very well imo) today, and she talked about how big a piece of crap her Tahoe was. She said be careful, and promptly took off after another tail light out person.

My deal got thrown out, no costs or anything, other than showing proof of the replacement of the light.

[DaveTN]

she was polite,

Must have been that time of the month.

You know… near the end of the month when they really need tickets.

[Guest db99wj]

Must have been that time of the month.

You know… near the end of the month when they really need tickets.

I laughed out loud with that one, even snorted!

[cadillacdude1975]

and for the 34645724572457245rd time, in tennessee, it is not a ccw or ccp or chl. it is a HCP or handgun carry permit.

[Smith]

What the he11?? A taillight violation is something we use to pull people over for when we wanted to look in their cars; no one gets a ticket for it. Man you must have really pizzed that cop off.

Just kidding man, just kidding

I got pulled over for that about a year ago. I'm in a mini-van with my wife and 3 kids. He must of thought they were mules! j/k He ran my stuff and let me go. I think he was bored.

[mdlave]

Hmm. I'm of the school of thought that if the officer wants to know, they'll ask, and I'm then happy to comply. I've gotten pulled twice over the past two weeks, armed both times.

1st time: I wasn't aware that a brake light had gone out. I handed my DL when asked. He ran it, told me to get the light taken care of and have a nice day. He didn't request my HCP, registration or insurance.....

2nd time: The officer pulled me over and gruffly suggested I'd just made an unsafe right hand turn. I told him I didn't understand, as I stopped completely, and made sure it was clear before turning. It was a very busy intersection, but nothing unsafe occured. He ran my DL, and told me to be more careful next time, but no request for HCP, registration, or insurance....

In the first case, I think the officer was just being helpful. In the second, I think the officer was just fishing.

However, neither asked for an HCP or gave any citation.