2A Sanctuary State?

[Capbyrd]

42 minutes ago, mikegideon said:

It's already a war. Just not a gunfight. 

What I mean is that local law enforcement from the state level down will never physically stop a federal law enforcement official in this state.  That would be war between the levels of government and the state would lose every time.   Sanctuary laws are feel good laws.   That's it. 

 

[mikegideon]

11 minutes ago, Capbyrd said:

What I mean is that local law enforcement from the state level down will never physically stop a federal law enforcement official in this state.  That would be war between the levels of government and the state would lose every time.   Sanctuary laws are feel good laws.   That's it. 

 

And what I meant was that if the locals refuse to assist, it really limits how many doors they can kick. So, the laws do have some meaning (just not necessarily what they say). "Consent of the governed" is a real deal. The feds have enough resources as long as the PEOPLE are behind them. 

A federal AWB these days will be impossible to enforce. I won't comply unless they come and take them. How many cops you got?

[partypilot1]

8 hours ago, Capbyrd said:

What I mean is that local law enforcement from the state level down will never physically stop a federal law enforcement official in this state.  That would be war between the levels of government and the state would lose every time.   Sanctuary laws are feel good laws.   That's it. 

 

It has before and it will again. When the people of the state become villainized by the federal government then they turn to the state for protection. Similar states align and cause the fed to stand their ground or let it go. Lincoln didn’t let it go. The 2A can, very likely, be the catalyst.

 

[Capbyrd]

11 hours ago, partypilot1 said:

It has before and it will again. When the people of the state become villainized by the federal government then they turn to the state for protection. Similar states align and cause the fed to stand their ground or let it go. Lincoln didn’t let it go. The 2A can, very likely, be the catalyst.

 

You should do stand up.  

[brat]

https://fox17.com/news/local/state-rep-sponsors-bill-that-would-make-tn-a-sanctuary-for-2nd-amendment

Apparently it's in the works. Don't know how many sponsors. Your calls need to go to your STATE representatives. Doubt any good will come from Blackburn or Hagerty at the federal level other than letting their state level contacts know their position. They are too busy with comrade buydin et al. 

As far a bucking the feds, the feds will only blackmail the state by withholding federal dollars. If the feds can't get local help, doubt they'll try the door to door stuff.

[ACfixer]

21 hours ago, Capbyrd said:

What I mean is that local law enforcement from the state level down will never physically stop a federal law enforcement official in this state.  That would be war between the levels of government and the state would lose every time.   Sanctuary laws are feel good laws.   That's it. 

 

 

Not necessarily. It makes it well known to the feds that we are in an area that does NOT approve or want gun control. That makes us a hard target instead of an easy one.

Look, I came from California, home of MILLIONS of illegal aliens living off the government tit. Totally flaunts fed law and the feds did nothing about it. The times the feds raided tuna factories and almond fields they got the cold shoulder and zero help from the local LEO agencies. The state filed lawsuits against the feds and tied it up in court. Also look at the pot thing. Totally illegal by fed law, but CA (and other states) allow it to flourish and the feds do nothing about it.

I'm not saying that local LEO's would physically be able to stop the feds from doing whatever, but the feds don't have the resources to go door to door and prosecute everyone with an AR or an ammo can full of P-mags. If Tennessee refuses to prosecute, then who will?

[Erik88]

21 hours ago, mikegideon said:

And what I meant was that if the locals refuse to assist,

I'm not convinced local law enforcement will choose to ignore new gun laws. It's going to vary a lot by city.  I just got an email from FPC saying they won a lawsuit over right to carry in PA in which they had to go up against a Sherriff there. 

"In late November, Allegheny County Sheriff William P. Mullen, the County of Allegheny, and the Allegheny County Sheriff’s Office (ACSO) closed their Firearms Division, which accepts, processes, and issues licenses to carry firearms, completely preventing anyone not licensed from exercising their Second Amendment rights outside their home. FPC Law, FPC’s legal action arm, took immediate action to prepare and file the lawsuit, which challenged the de facto ban."

[mikegideon]

26 minutes ago, Erik88 said:

I'm not convinced local law enforcement will choose to ignore new gun laws. It's going to vary a lot by city.  I just got an email from FPC saying they won a lawsuit over right to carry in PA in which they had to go up against a Sherriff there. 

I agree. But they would be compelled to if the state laws were in place. Some cops are natural born tyrants.

[Grayfox54]

I got this from TFA this evening. Mr. Harris has a very interesting take on this issue. 

February 19, 2021   Follow TFA on MeWe – we are discontinuing updates to Facebook and Twitter Share this update from the TFA Website News Posts   You likely keep hearing the phrase that Tennessee should become a "sanctuary state" particularly now that Biden-Harris are President and the Democrats control Congress.  There is a strong argument that Tennessee should not aspire to be a "sanctuary state" but that it should have higher aspirations and purposes. First, the 2nd Amendment and 10th Amendment are express prohibitions on federal (and now state) infringement of the right of citizens to keep, bear, possess, use, own, carry, practice with, etc., any kind of "arms" that a soldier would want or need or that would be useful in a military or militia engagement.    Second, and in contrast, Article 1, Section 8 of the Constitution expressly authorizes Congress to regulation immigration and naturalization.   The original terminology "sanctuary" state or more often city arose, if I recall, from progressive, Democrat, socialists areas where people decided that they would hide, shelter, aid and abet criminals who were illegal aliens. As such, these individuals and governments that aided them were trying to block enforcement of laws, regulations and/or order in an area where the Constitution expressly gives Congress authority. Indeed, those"sanctuary"advocates should have been criminally prosecution for obstruction or facilitation but the federal government did not do so - a separate soap box talk.   In contrast to the immigration issue, the Constitution expressly prohibits federal infringement relative to "arms".  Therefore, a state or local government refusing to enforce or aid in the enforcement of such federal laws, regulations or orders is not a criminal "sanctuary" act. NO!   It is to the contrary the express duty of such states and local government to raise the shields of the 2nd and 10th Amendments to block unconstitutional and ultra vires federal laws, regulations and orders over issues where the Constitution itself prohibits federal authority or action   Consequently, it is constitutionally inaccurate to characterize 2nd and 10th Amendment based bills as "sanctuary" bills. They are not. They are not acts to frustrate the legitimate constitutional exercise of federal power. They are acts by Sovereign States to shield their citizens from unconstitutional federal activity.   We must stop using the term "sanctuary" in any context to reference the citizens' fundamental right to arms and the constitutional prohibition against government infringement of that right.   John Harris Executive Director johnharris@tennesseefirearms.com   Joining and supporting TFA is an investment in the fight to restore our constitutional rights and to fight against politicians who are willing to sell their votes and your rights to whichever business interest gives them the most money! TFA Website: www.tennesseefirearms.com TFA PAC: www.tfalac.org MeWe - https://mewe.com/join/tennessee_firearms_association

[Erik88]

On 2/18/2021 at 11:40 AM, Erik88 said:

I'm not convinced local law enforcement will choose to ignore new gun laws. It's going to vary a lot by city.  I just got an email from FPC saying they won a lawsuit over right to carry in PA in which they had to go up against a Sherriff there. 

"In late November, Allegheny County Sheriff William P. Mullen, the County of Allegheny, and the Allegheny County Sheriff’s Office (ACSO) closed their Firearms Division, which accepts, processes, and issues licenses to carry firearms, completely preventing anyone not licensed from exercising their Second Amendment rights outside their home. FPC Law, FPC’s legal action arm, took immediate action to prepare and file the lawsuit, which challenged the de facto ban."

 

On 2/18/2021 at 12:10 PM, mikegideon said:

I agree. But they would be compelled to if the state laws were in place. Some cops are natural born tyrants.

Speaking of local law enforcement meddling in gun laws.

 

Edited February 26, 2021 by Erik88

[mikegideon]

52 minutes ago, Erik88 said:

 

Speaking of local law enforcement meddling in gun laws.

 

Yeah. I don't get it. Kentucky went to constitutional carry and nobody even noticed. 

[leroy]

6 hours ago, mikegideon said:

Yeah. I don't get it. Kentucky went to constitutional carry and nobody even noticed. 

Mike...

A bit of perspective here might help.   Tennessee wuz a notorious " sheriff's discression to issue " state.  Most did it by the " Honorary Deputy " thing when I wuz younger.  It held on for a long time here.  I think that is part of the howl now...  " Polititians losing control of the citizenry "...

Remember, Tennessee never had a post Reconstruction Military Governor, but they had a bunch of trash that punished the population like one... The sorriest of em all wuz " Parson " Brownlow... As I remember, he is responsible for the mod to the 2A statement in the Tennessee Constitution " regulating the wearing of arms"...

Rememberin leroy...

Edited February 27, 2021 by leroy

[mikegideon]

2 hours ago, leroy said:

Mike...

A bit of perspective here might help.   Tennessee wuz a notorious " sheriff's discression to issue " state.  Most did it by the " Honorary Deputy " thing when I wuz younger.  It held on for a long time here.  I think that is part of the howl now...  " Polititians losing control of the citizenry "...

Remember, Tennessee never had a post Reconstruction Military Governor, but they had a bunch of trash that punished the population like one... The sorriest of em all wuz " Parson " Brownlow... As I remember, he is responsible for the mod to the 2A statement in the Tennessee Constitution " regulating the wearing of arms"...

Rememberin leroy...

I'm so sick of politicians making us jump through hoops for the sake of THEIR power. Assholes!

[leroy]

Just now, mikegideon said:

I'm so sick of politicians making us jump through hoops for the sake of THEIR power. Assholes!

Amen Brother.  !!!

[Grayfox54]

Leroy, I remember those days as well. To get my first handgun permit (1992) I had to write a letter to the Sheriff explaining why I wanted a  permit, take a class, be bonded and even then it was only good in my county.  Getting it was left totally up to the Sheriff's desecration. Fortunately at the time, our Sheriff was pretty open minded about armed citizens. However, in many counties a handgun permit was impossible to get because the Sheriff was against it and rejected all applications.

As for the Tennessee Sheriff's Association, these guys are politicians, not law men. Never expect them to side with the citizens or for that matter, their own rank and file officers. They're all about the power game.  

[Worriedman]

On 2/4/2021 at 4:15 PM, Grayfox54 said:

We all know what's coming from Washington. Many Counties in TN have already passed 2A Sanctuary resolutions. However, I'd like to get a movement going to have the entire state of Tennessee declared a 2nd Amendment Sanctuary. I think that with a little nudging from the citizens that this could be done. It won't stop the feds, but it will send a message that we want no part of their BS. I sent e-mails to my State Senator and Representative today. I strongly urge everyone here to do so and encourage all your friends to join in too. The time to speak up is now. 

Do any of those resolutions have any force of law?
What are the punishments for violations?  Who will prosecute if there are any?

[m16ty]

On 2/17/2021 at 7:48 AM, Capbyrd said:

The state will never go to war with the federal government.  

 

Well, TN and several other southern states have done it in the past. 

[Capbyrd]

On 3/5/2021 at 8:45 PM, m16ty said:

Well, TN and several other southern states have done it in the past. 

That’s cool.  It won’t happen again. 

[m16ty]

10 hours ago, Capbyrd said:

That’s cool.  It won’t happen again. 

You might be surprised. 
So I guess we are just supposed to suck it up and take whatever the Feds throw at us?

[Capbyrd]

8 hours ago, m16ty said:

You might be surprised. 
So I guess we are just supposed to suck it up and take whatever the Feds throw at us?

TN receives about 40 percent of it's general revenue from the federal government.  If you think that the folks in Nashville are willing to give up 40 percent of the state's income over gun legislation, I think you don't understand politics.  

What are WE supposed to do?  WE are supposed to handle this at the polls.   And if that doesn't work, then WE go to war.   But dreaming that the state might, well that's just dreaming.  

[bigun]

2 minutes ago, Capbyrd said:

TN receives about 40 percent of it's general revenue from the federal government.  If you think that the folks in Nashville are willing to give up 40 percent of the state's income over gun legislation, I think you don't understand politics.  

What are WE supposed to do?  WE are supposed to handle this at the polls.   And if that doesn't work, then WE go to war.   But dreaming that the state might, well that's just dreaming.  

And the federal government get's 100% of it's funding from us.

[Darrell]

27 minutes ago, Capbyrd said:

What are WE supposed to do?  WE are supposed to handle this at the polls.

Bingo!  It surprised me that there were a few (not many) members here who seemed to be unconcerned about 2A rights during the past election. I'm not a single issue voter, but the 2A issue is one of my top concerns. Right now the sharks smell blood in the water, and they're circling in preparation for taking the biggest bites they can manage. Democrats see NOW as the best opportunity in many years to pass a wide range of gun restrictions. And we're seeing party-line votes in the Senate that leave me without much confidence that conservatives can withstand the onslaught.

The terrible shame, in my view, is that there probably are some things that can be done to make it less attractive for a criminal to obtain a firearm. But we've passed the point that any compromise on the part of gun-owners simply becomes the new standard and that the anti-gunners begin again from that point. NO compromise will ever be enough for the gun-ban crowd, many of whom are entirely uninformed, and therefore I am no longer willing to support ANY compromise at all.

[Erik88]

1 hour ago, bigun said:

And the federal government get's 100% of it's funding from us.

Yeah but they get a lot more from the liberal states than us. 

[m16ty]

If the democrats get their way, by either making DC or Puerto Rico a state, automatically registering everybody to vote, and make mail in voting commonplace, your vote in TN will be worthless on a national level. We are getting to a point that our only hope is to have the State stand up to the Feds.

I agree that to have the State go against the Federal Government is a steep hill to climb. The feds have taken over state’s rights by taking hold of the purse strings. It’s something we should at least consider though.

[Quavodus]

I got a bad feeling your vote ain't gonna mean squat from now on.