ATF issues Cease & Desist to Q over Honey Badger "pistol"

[Magiccarpetrides]

34 minutes ago, Trekbike said:

Don't disagree on that statement, but he is definitely less hostile towards 2A than Biden's plan he has posted on his website.   Link below.   

https://joebiden.com/gunsafety/

 

 

"Joe Biden also knows how to make progress on reducing gun violence using executive action. After the tragedy at Sandy Hook Elementary School in 2012, President Obama tasked Vice President Biden with developing both legislative proposals and executive actions to make our communities safer. As a result of this effort, the Obama-Biden Administration took more than two dozen actions, including narrowing the so-called “gun show loophole,” increasing the number of records in the background check system, and expanding funding for mental health services."

 

Nothing Biden/Obama did during that period was as infringing as what Trump did with one executive action.  Honestly the gunshow loophole was something I was definitely for as anyone who has visited gun shows knows how bad they were for that.    Trump only cares about Trump (like most politicians) and to think he is going to do anything for us is silly.  Hell our Diety Reagan was even worse but no one wants to remember he's the reason we can no longer obtain fully automatic weapons without spending $$$

[Omega]

1 hour ago, Magiccarpetrides said:

"Joe Biden also knows how to make progress on reducing gun violence using executive action. After the tragedy at Sandy Hook Elementary School in 2012, President Obama tasked Vice President Biden with developing both legislative proposals and executive actions to make our communities safer. As a result of this effort, the Obama-Biden Administration took more than two dozen actions, including narrowing the so-called “gun show loophole,” increasing the number of records in the background check system, and expanding funding for mental health services."

 

Nothing Biden/Obama did during that period was as infringing as what Trump did with one executive action.  Honestly the gunshow loophole was something I was definitely for as anyone who has visited gun shows knows how bad they were for that.    Trump only cares about Trump (like most politicians) and to think he is going to do anything for us is silly.  Hell our Diety Reagan was even worse but no one wants to remember he's the reason we can no longer obtain fully automatic weapons without spending $$$

Please explain the gun show loophole?  All FFLs are required to do a BG check at a show or their establishment, private sellers are not, if at a gunshow or not.  So are you saying you support having BG checks for private sales?

[Magiccarpetrides]

2 minutes ago, Omega said:

Please explain the gun show loophole?  All FFLs are required to do a BG check at a show or their establishment, private sellers are not, if at a gunshow or not.  So are you saying you support having BG checks for private sales?

Back in the day there were a lot more "private sellers" that were selling volumes of firearms and not running background checks....im talking about the guys with tables of 50+ guns but "its my private collection"...we all know and have seen them...there's not as many of those roaches these days.  I have no use for people that willingly don't pay tax and skirt the law not caring who they sell to.

[Alleycat72]

3 minutes ago, Magiccarpetrides said:

Back in the day there were a lot more "private sellers" that were selling volumes of firearms and not running background checks....im talking about the guys with tables of 50+ guns but "its my private collection"...we all know and have seen them...there's not as many of those roaches these days.  I have no use for people that willingly don't pay tax and skirt the law not caring who they sell to.

"I hate Trump for banning bump stocks"

"We need laws banning people from selling guns"

You're so confusing.  How about not infringing on people's rights regardless of who is doing it. 

 

[Magiccarpetrides]

28 minutes ago, alleycat72 said:

"I hate Trump for banning bump stocks"

"We need laws banning people from selling guns"

You're so confusing.  How about not infringing on people's rights regardless of who is doing it. 

 

I never said I hated Trump...I think he's no role model but what politician is?  We need laws keeping people from selling guns to criminals...yes yes we do...sorry if that wasn't blindingly obvious...that's the whole gun show loophole everyone has talked about oh the past 10 years...it wasn't "mr joe legal buying from his buddy".  Criminals lost their rights when they committed their crimes.  People that have orders of protections against them shouldn't be allowed to purchase til cleared of their accusation...the mentally unstable definitely don't need to own sharp objects that go "pow"....but hey its America we are all free to disagree thank God.

[Alleycat72]

3 hours ago, Magiccarpetrides said:

I never said I hated Trump...I think he's no role model but what politician is?  We need laws keeping people from selling guns to criminals...yes yes we do...sorry if that wasn't blindingly obvious...that's the whole gun show loophole everyone has talked about oh the past 10 years...it wasn't "mr joe legal buying from his buddy".  Criminals lost their rights when they committed their crimes.  People that have orders of protections against them shouldn't be allowed to purchase til cleared of their accusation...the mentally unstable definitely don't need to own sharp objects that go "pow"....but hey its America we are all free to disagree thank God.

If they are so dangerous that they can't own a gun why are they free to walk the streets? If they have payed their debt to society, why are they restricted? If they have a restraining order against them, what if they are innocent? What if someone red flags you because they can? If they are so dangerous then lock them up or end them. 

[Magiccarpetrides]

2 hours ago, alleycat72 said:

If they are so dangerous that they can't own a gun why are they free to walk the streets? If they have payed their debt to society, why are they restricted? If they have a restraining order against them, what if they are innocent? What if someone red flags you because they can? If they are so dangerous then lock them up or end them. 

Bahaha seriously.  Your right the rapist and child molester spent their time in jail no harm in letting them now own a firearm again.  My schizophrenic grandmother I’m sure it would have hastened her death as well shame she couldn’t own one either.  Obviously we see the world in very different ways.  I wish I saw it so black and white as you do. 

[Omega]

5 hours ago, Magiccarpetrides said:

I never said I hated Trump...I think he's no role model but what politician is?  We need laws keeping people from selling guns to criminals...yes yes we do...sorry if that wasn't blindingly obvious...that's the whole gun show loophole everyone has talked about oh the past 10 years...it wasn't "mr joe legal buying from his buddy".  Criminals lost their rights when they committed their crimes.  People that have orders of protections against them shouldn't be allowed to purchase til cleared of their accusation...the mentally unstable definitely don't need to own sharp objects that go "pow"....but hey its America we are all free to disagree thank God.

Ok, I agree with you, but it is already illegal for them to possess guns.  The only people that new laws affect, are those already following the law, simple as that.  What we need is stiffer penalties for those that break existing laws, not more laws that criminals will ignore.

[Magiccarpetrides]

4 hours ago, Omega said:

Ok, I agree with you, but it is already illegal for them to possess guns.  The only people that new laws affect, are those already following the law, simple as that.  What we need is stiffer penalties for those that break existing laws, not more laws that criminals will ignore.

The gun show loophole law was simply better enforcement of the existing laws..not a new law.  I’m not advocating any new laws here either just pointing out that I had a lot less problems with all their posturing during the Obama years that actually affected us law abiding citizens 0% then the one executive action Trump took 

[Alleycat72]

6 hours ago, Magiccarpetrides said:

Bahaha seriously.  Your right the rapist and child molester spent their time in jail no harm in letting them now own a firearm again.  My schizophrenic grandmother I’m sure it would have hastened her death as well shame she couldn’t own one either.  Obviously we see the world in very different ways.  I wish I saw it so black and white as you do. 

If they are truly a rapist or child molester than they shouldn't be A: breathing or B: out. The problem solves itself.

[DaveTN]

There was never a gun show loophole. They just call it that because it sounds better than calling it what it really is; a ban on private sales. Anyone that holds an FFL is required by federal law to do a background check, no matter where they are selling. If someone is moving a bunch of guns; its up to the BATF to do their job and charge them. It’s not rocket science and it would be pretty easy to do. We all know people that are doing that, and if they ever start enforcing it; those people will be subject to arrest.

But like anything else the BATF touches, its screwed up. They don’t want to put a number on it. Not much happens until one of the guns is used in a crime; then they could have problems. Things like the BATF approval of bump stocks and braces do not have the weight of law. The BATF explains that on their web site. That has the danger of leading people to believe they can’t be charged. Nothing could be farther from the truth.

IMO Trump is not anti gun; I think that’s obvious. I just don’t think he’s a gun guy. But his son is, and he has the Presidents ear. And if you want to call him anti-gun because of that; so be it. But anyone paying attention has to agree that he is no where near what we are getting ready to see if Biden/Harris is elected. I do believe Trump will support the 2nd amendment to the extent he can. Machine guns should be legal, but that won’t happen.

As far as the bump stock thing goes. The BATF shouldn’t have the authority to approve a device that turns a semi-auto gun into a machine gun. You can argue the letter of the law vs. the intent of the law all you like; but that’s up to either congress, to change the law, or the courts to interpret the law. Stephen Paddock proved to the world that a bump stock turns a semi-auto rifle into a machine gun. 60 people died and 411 were injured. Trump didn’t sign an executive order banning bump stocks. He issued a memorandum to the Attorney General instructing the BATF to do their job. The BATF changed the ruling.

[Omega]

43 minutes ago, DaveTN said:

There was never a gun show loophole. They just call it that because it sounds better than calling it what it really is; a ban on private sales. Anyone that holds an FFL is required by federal law to do a background check, no matter where they are selling. If someone is moving a bunch of guns; its up to the BATF to do their job and charge them. It’s not rocket science and it would be pretty easy to do. We all know people that are doing that, and if they ever start enforcing it; those people will be subject to arrest.

But like anything else the BATF touches, its screwed up. They don’t want to put a number on it. Not much happens until one of the guns is used in a crime; then they could have problems. Things like the BATF approval of bump stocks and braces do not have the weight of law. The BATF explains that on their web site. That has the danger of leading people to believe they can’t be charged. Nothing could be farther from the truth.

IMO Trump is not anti gun; I think that’s obvious. I just don’t think he’s a gun guy. But his son is, and he has the Presidents ear. And if you want to call him anti-gun because of that; so be it. But anyone paying attention has to agree that he is no where near what we are getting ready to see if Biden/Harris is elected. I do believe Trump will support the 2nd amendment to the extent he can. Machine guns should be legal, but that won’t happen.

As far as the bump stock thing goes. The BATF shouldn’t have the authority to approve a device that turns a semi-auto gun into a machine gun. You can argue the letter of the law vs. the intent of the law all you like; but that’s up to either congress, to change the law, or the courts to interpret the law. Stephen Paddock proved to the world that a bump stock turns a semi-auto rifle into a machine gun. 60 people died and 411 were injured. Trump didn’t sign an executive order banning bump stocks. He issued a memorandum to the Attorney General instructing the BATF to do their job. The BATF changed the ruling.

Disagree with your assertion that the bump stock turns an AR into a machine gun, by that interpretation so does a stick, shoestring, or belt loop.  Call it a loophole if you wish, but unless congress changes the definition of a machine gun, none of these devices make it one. 

[DaveTN]

13 minutes ago, Omega said:

Disagree with your assertion that the bump stock turns an AR into a machine gun, by that interpretation so does a stick, shoestring, or belt loop.  Call it a loophole if you wish, but unless congress changes the definition of a machine gun, none of these devices make it one. 

My point was that you can certainly make that argument if you like; it’s a valid argument. But my opinion doesn’t matter, your opinion doesn’t matter, and a prosecutor, Judge or Jury is not bound by a ATF decision. As I’ve said many times before, if our 2nd amendment rights are partly based on us having the ability to protect ourselves from an out of control government; machine guns would need to be legal.

[Magiccarpetrides]

4 hours ago, alleycat72 said:

If they are truly a rapist or child molester than they shouldn't be A: breathing or B: out. The problem solves itself.

If only it were that simple