SARS-2-CoV (COVID-19)

[DaveTN]

Anyone can wait as long as they like to make sure its safe, 3 years, 5 years, 10 years, whatever they like. But waiting any longer is unrealistic for me.  I doubt that anyone is going to make anyone get it. Unless of course you want to get on an airplane or go other places that decide for you to enter their facilities you need to be vaccinated.

But I don’t want to wait that long; I don’t really want to wait another week. I want this to be over. Do I think it’s without risk? Nope, but I am more than willing to take that risk, and that has nothing to do with anything the government, Trump, Biden, or Fauci is doing or has done.

[Omega]

1 hour ago, Erik88 said:

Last month you made a comment that you didn't like the condescending way some people respond. Lately, you have become one of the worst for doing that exact thing. You are very antagonistic in a lot of your responses. 

 

 

 

Thank you, wasn't sure I was coming across properly.  Seems there are many that are willing to lose their liberties for a little perceived safety, if you are one of them, then so be it, but don't for one second think I will follow suit.  The numbers for this entire thing just don't make sense, and the fact that those who get the vaccine can still spread the virus makes all this reaction even worse.  

Look, currently, there is a less than 1% mortality rate for the china virus, the vaccine is 90%+ effective, so why the talk about passports and such?  Seems they are trying to get the population ready for more restrictions for something that doesn't warrant such extreme reaction.  So you tell me why, you tell me how any of this makes any sense, how so many are buying into all this.

 

Even though they say the numbers are true, they say it is a lie SMH

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/factcheck/2020/05/05/covid-19-fact-check-coronavirus-mortality-rate-misleading/3019503001/

Quote

Our ruling: Partly false

It is true that the overall rate may be 1% or lower, when factoring in those infected by the coronavirus who were never tested. But definitive statements about the mortality rate are misleading to the point of falsehood. We rule the claim that COVID-19 has a survival rate of 98.5% to be PARTLY FALSE, based on our research.

While they tout the 90% + efficacy rate, they still say that those vaccinated can still spread it, and, may still be sick, though not as bad.  But isn't that the case already?  So we are trying to vaccinate 70% (at least) to protect the 1%, which may get it and die anyway?

https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/medical/how-to-interpret-the-efficacy-rates-of-coronavirus-vaccines/ar-BB1bjwJx

Quote

It's possible that coronavirus vaccines may not provide people with full-on sterilizing immunity, meaning that vaccinated people could, possibly, still get the virus to replicate in their bodies, and pass it along to others, asymptomatically, even after vaccination, while appearing and feeling perfectly healthy. 

 

[Omega]

...
 

Edited December 28, 2020 by Omega
Double post

[hipower]

59 minutes ago, DaveTN said:

Anyone can wait as long as they like to make sure its safe, 3 years, 5 years, 10 years, whatever they like. But waiting any longer is unrealistic for me.  I doubt that anyone is going to make anyone get it. Unless of course you want to get on an airplane or go other places that decide for you to enter their facilities you need to be vaccinated.

But I don’t want to wait that long; I don’t really want to wait another week. I want this to be over. Do I think it’s without risk? Nope, but I am more than willing to take that risk, and that has nothing to do with anything the government, Trump, Biden, or Fauci is doing or has done.

Dave, I see your point, but in my ample gut, I disagree with you. I think the Airline industry is jut the tip of the iceberg. Business's can and probably will, restrict access to entry. That's already being mentioned. Even hear comments of forced mask wearing to go outside. I can see someone saying I'd need a "proof" to do that coming.

That borders on worry for me. I may, probably won't, take a vaccine injection. Medical and personal views enter into my decision. I'll observe all "protocols" required of me. I have so far, and don't see an alternative to it.

But being told/forced to take an injection against my will. No. I can stay at home and have everything delivered. At least until I'm told it's too unsafe for a delivery person to walk to thru my yard to my door. You know, breathing the same air Is I might have.

I have some family about 80 miles to the east. They literally have not gone outside their home since last January. Husband, Wife, and husband's Mother.

They have had food delivered ever since. Require delivery person to have mask on, set packages on the porch, from the ground, not to step on or touch it. This man, my cousin to the specific, goes out and sprays EVERYTHING with a disinfectant before bringing it inside.

Once inside, the same procedure for each package before opening or storing it.

No one, I repeat, No One, family or otherwise is allowed in the home.

They do have phone service, and calls can and are being made to them.

Paranoid? Maybe. Being diligent in safety, ever overzealous. Maybe.

But it is his/their choice. 

Not completely sure I agree. But their lives. Their choice.

[ReeferMac]

Well said HiPower.

I think thats the over arching issue for most (certainly myself). Mandatory vs. choice.

The grey area comes with more 'normal' activities like travel, shopping, etc. I suppose we could all mail order flowbee's off amazon, but once you start restricting things, it becomes a slippery slope.

Just look at the list of essential services... everybody just declares themselves special.

"Some animals are more equal than others." to quote somebody who said something more eloquent than me about it.

Edited December 28, 2020 by ReeferMac

[DaveTN]

40 minutes ago, hipower said:

Dave, I see your point, but in my ample gut, I disagree with you.

I don’t see what we are in disagreement about?? I’m not suggesting you be forced to take the vaccine. I’m just saying I would like to have it tomorrow; the sooner the better. I believe the risk to me and my family is much higher without it than with it. My parents are 88 & 90 years old and in assisted living. I won’t go be in the same room with them. For one, I can’t, and also I don’t want to be the person that kills my parents. I went to Illinois to help move their stuff with my sister. But I refused to go to their house until they left. It’s not about me; its about them. They had been tested prior to entering the assisted living facility and were negative.

Will I get on an airplane that allows you to fly without the vaccine? Absolutely not; I’ll drive before I’ll do that. So the airlines will need to make decisions about that. Will I go into a store where you go? Sure, because I don’t have to breath the same recycled air you are breathing and can disinfect myself when I get back in my truck, and if I’ve had the vaccine my chances of dying by being exposed to you will be a lot less.

I’m not asking that anyone be forced to take the vaccine.

[Moped]

On 12/19/2020 at 9:51 PM, Moped said:

Knox County hit a new one day high today, 724 new cases. Since My last report here, there have been another 1,652 new cases and deaths rose to 258. That’s 24 more deaths. This is from the Thanksgiving holiday. 
 

Stats take from the daily report by the Knox County Health Department.

New cases for Knox County have flattened out over the last couple days, but deaths continue to rise.  New cases in the last 9 days have gone up 3,193, while deaths went from 258 to 306, for a total of 48 deaths.

Stat's taken from the daily report by the Knox County Health Department.

Now back to our normal arguments! 

[Darrell]

I just read an article on Breitbart that says that California has the worst Covid breakout in the US, and yet they have some of the tightest restrictions. I have some family there and the rules in California are FAR tighter than they are here. I think that the population is a lot more prone to participate in social distancing, restricted gatherings, and mask-wearing than they are here, too. There's something going on that we're not being told. I tend to believe that the epidemiologists have information that they deem the unwashed masses unready to hear.  

I'll take the vaccine as soon as it becomes available. I take the flue vaccine every year, and I don't see this as much different. 

I note that the new cases and deaths in Cumberland county appear to be edging downward. I  hope that trend holds.

[peejman]

3 hours ago, Omega said:

While they tout the 90% + efficacy rate, they still say that those vaccinated can still spread it, and, may still be sick, though not as bad.  But isn't that the case already? 

 

1 hour ago, DaveTN said:

Will I get on an airplane that allows you to fly without the vaccine? Absolutely not; I’ll drive before I’ll do that

 

Vaccines do nothing to prevent the spread of a virus. All they do is prevent you from developing symptoms.  The anti-vax crowd has repeatedly proven that viruses like measles, whooping cough, and polio are still around. 

[Links2k]

16 hours ago, Daniel said:

Like maybe... a passport?  The faux outrage is ridiculous.

Indeed. Meanwhile we’re standing in line to get a star on our driver’s licenses. 

[DaveTN]

8 minutes ago, peejman said:

Vaccines do nothing to prevent the spread of a virus. All they do is prevent you from developing symptoms.

That's all I ask. 

[Links2k]

5 hours ago, Moped said:

Actually, not this time.  I see this as an over reach, as well. Up until now, I've been on the side of "reason" with mask wearing and vaccinations.  But I'm not for requiring everyone to carry papers to prove or disprove they've had the vaccination, simply be cause that leads to "papers" for other things.  I will not be blindly led.  I will make my own decisions, thank you.

You won’t need papers. Your chip will be inside the vaccine courtesy of Bill Gates. It’s too difficult to keep up with papers. Or you may just require a barcode on your phone like a airline boarding pass. 

[Daniel]

7 hours ago, deerslayer said:

Since when do you need a passport to enter a stadium, a concert, or a movie theater?  

Not what I read it was for.  

[GlockSpock]

Just now, Daniel said:

Not what I read it was for.  

I have seen the idea floated. I think it was Ticketmaster or similar talked about it a few months ago. 

[Daniel]

5 hours ago, FUJIMO said:

HUGE difference in the proven cocktail given to children for polio, mumps, measles, rubella, etc and something using new technology being spun out by the talking heads we've seen all year that change their minds like socks.

Welcome to the Scientific Method.

[hipower]

7 hours ago, DaveTN said:

I don’t see what we are in disagreement about?? I’m not suggesting you be forced to take the vaccine. I’m just saying I would like to have it tomorrow; the sooner the better. I believe the risk to me and my family is much higher without it than with it. My parents are 88 & 90 years old and in assisted living. I won’t go be in the same room with them. For one, I can’t, and also I don’t want to be the person that kills my parents. I went to Illinois to help move their stuff with my sister. But I refused to go to their house until they left. It’s not about me; its about them. They had been tested prior to entering the assisted living facility and were negative.

Will I get on an airplane that allows you to fly without the vaccine? Absolutely not; I’ll drive before I’ll do that. So the airlines will need to make decisions about that. Will I go into a store where you go? Sure, because I don’t have to breath the same recycled air you are breathing and can disinfect myself when I get back in my truck, and if I’ve had the vaccine my chances of dying by being exposed to you will be a lot less.

I’m not asking that anyone be forced to take the vaccine.

My apologies to you Dave. I must have misread, or more likely, misunderstood your commentary this morning. 

Wouldn't be the first time for me.

[deerslayer]

3 hours ago, Daniel said:

Not what I read it was for.  

I guess you skipped the first two paragraphs of the article...

Now that coronavirus vaccines are starting to roll out in the US and abroad, many people may be dreaming of the day when they can travel, shop and go to the movies again. But in order to do those activities, you may eventually need something in addition to the vaccine: a vaccine passport application.

Several companies and technology groups have begun developing smartphone apps or systems for individuals to upload details of their Covid-19 tests and vaccinations, creating digital credentials that could be shown in order to enter concert venues, stadiums, movie theaters, offices, or even countries.

[Oh Shoot]

TN average daily Covid deaths  (end of month summary later)

Nov  (previous high month)     41.9
Dec 1-7   (407)         58.1
Dec 8-14   (532)       76.0
Dec 15-21  (595)      85.0
Dec 22-28  (452)      64.5

1,986 deaths this month, with 3 days to go

- OS

 

(edited, mis-added a column, damn database quits showing daily date after first week or so every month, easy to get lost)

Edited December 29, 2020 by Oh Shoot
oopsie, misadded a colum

[Daniel]

2 hours ago, deerslayer said:

I guess you skipped the first two paragraphs of the article...

Now that coronavirus vaccines are starting to roll out in the US and abroad, many people may be dreaming of the day when they can travel, shop and go to the movies again. But in order to do those activities, you may eventually need something in addition to the vaccine: a vaccine passport application.

Several companies and technology groups have begun developing smartphone apps or systems for individuals to upload details of their Covid-19 tests and vaccinations, creating digital credentials that could be shown in order to enter concert venues, stadiums, movie theaters, offices, or even countries.

Gotcha.  My mistake. 

[deerslayer]

15 hours ago, Daniel said:

Gotcha.  My mistake. 

So is the “faux outrage” still ridiculous?  Is it not ridiculous that requiring people to “show their papers”  to see a movie is now being discussed?

[DaveTN]

33 minutes ago, deerslayer said:

So is the “faux outrage” still ridiculous?  Is it not ridiculous that requiring people to “show their papers”  to see a movie is now being discussed?

It is if the government is doing it. But I think businesses should be allowed to be open if the choose to be...right now. For the next year, possibly several years, they are going to have choices to make that impact their businesses. Many will be gone regardless of the choices they make. Don’t you think they should be free to make the choices they see fit?

They should get to make determinations on who comes in, and the citizens get to make the determination if they want to go in.

There is already talk (probably more than that by now) of an app for your phone that shows if you have been vaccinated.

[Oh Shoot]

nm, wrong thread

Edited December 29, 2020 by Oh Shoot

[deerslayer]

1 hour ago, DaveTN said:

It is if the government is doing it. But I think businesses should be allowed to be open if the choose to be...right now. For the next year, possibly several years, they are going to have choices to make that impact their businesses. Many will be gone regardless of the choices they make. Don’t you think they should be free to make the choices they see fit?

They should get to make determinations on who comes in, and the citizens get to make the determination if they want to go in.

There is already talk (probably more than that by now) of an app for your phone that shows if you have been vaccinated.

It’s not clear if we are talking about .gov or business owners.  Probably both.  I’m all for property rights, but should hospitals (most of which are privately owned) be able to choose to turn away car wreck or gunshot victims who don’t have proof of a vaccination?

[DaveTN]

4 minutes ago, deerslayer said:

I’m all for property rights, but should hospitals (most of which are privately owned) be able to choose to turn away car wreck or gunshot victims who don’t have proof of a vaccination?

No

[Oh Shoot]

2 hours ago, deerslayer said:

... but should hospitals (most of which are privately owned) be able to choose to turn away car wreck or gunshot victims who don’t have proof of a vaccination?

A bit far fetched, IMNSHO.

Ironically though, we're spottily seeing something akin to that, in that overrun hospitals are having to turn away lots of less dire patient situations they'd normally admit.

- OS