SARS-2-CoV (COVID-19)

[Erik88]

18 minutes ago, gregintenn said:

Do you have any concrete evidence you could share that masks work?

Greg, I know you well enough to know that you've already made up your mind. What evidence would you even believe? There have now been countless studies done that have shown they are effective. It's pretty simple to me. It's the same reason why doctors and surgeons wear masks when they are operating. 

https://www.ucsf.edu/news/2020/06/417906/still-confused-about-masks-heres-science-behind-how-face-masks-prevent

https://hartfordhealthcare.org/about-us/news-press/news-detail?articleid=27691&publicId=395

Other studies have been done by Duke University, the University of Washington. These are the first I found with a quick google search. 

 

[Erik88]

2 minutes ago, peejman said:

My memory of the mask use issue was they were initially afraid the public would suck up all the masks leaving none for the medical folks, so they fibbed to prevent that

Agreed. That's how I remember it as well.

[gregintenn]

14 minutes ago, Erik88 said:

Greg, I know you well enough to know that you've already made up your mind. What evidence would you even believe? There have now been countless studies done that have shown they are effective. It's pretty simple to me. It's the same reason why doctors and surgeons wear masks when they are operating. 

https://www.ucsf.edu/news/2020/06/417906/still-confused-about-masks-heres-science-behind-how-face-masks-prevent

https://hartfordhealthcare.org/about-us/news-press/news-detail?articleid=27691&publicId=395

Other studies have been done by Duke University, the University of Washington. These are the first I found with a quick google search. 

 

Thank you for responding, Erik. Link 1 is outdated and undoubtedly horse feces. Link 2 seems to be credible. It claims masks reduce transmission 30%.
 

30% does not seem very effective to me. Your mileage may vary.

[xsubsailor]

State officials in Illinois are investigating a coronavirus outbreak at a veterans’ nursing home that infected nearly 200 residents and personnel and killed 27 veterans.

Illinois Gov. J.B. Pritzker’s office and the state’s Department of Veterans' Affairs are attempting to determine what caused the outbreak at the state-run LaSalle Veterans’ Home, according to multiple reports.

https://www.foxnews.com/us/illinois-veterans-coronavirus-nursing-home-probe

[DaveTN]

My initial thoughts were that if we don’t have the professionals at the CDC to give us the information we need; that’s a big problem.

As far as Trump goes; now it's mostly the hardcore Trump haters that refuse to listen to anything, so that wouldn't have mattered anyways. Anyone that disagrees with them here; they just call them out by name and say they “know” what’s in those people’s minds.

If you remember correctly Trump tried to put Pence in charge of the COVID Task Force and have him do the briefings. But of course the MSM was having no part of that. They got Trump in there by saying he didn’t care and wasn’t doing anything. All they wanted to do was ask stupid questions and make ridiculous accusations. Like an idiot; he fell for it.

Both parties and all elected officials should be ashamed. This should have never been a political issue; but it was and Americans died because of it.

We should have a vaccine released in the next 2-3 weeks. If the elderly get it first, the death rates should start dropping around the time Biden takes office. Then two and fours years from now, we can hear about how Joe turned things around.

[E4 No More]

21 minutes ago, Erik88 said:

Greg, I know you well enough to know that you've already made up your mind. What evidence would you even believe? There have now been countless studies done that have shown they are effective. It's pretty simple to me. It's the same reason why doctors and surgeons wear masks when they are operating. 

https://www.ucsf.edu/news/2020/06/417906/still-confused-about-masks-heres-science-behind-how-face-masks-prevent

https://hartfordhealthcare.org/about-us/news-press/news-detail?articleid=27691&publicId=395

Other studies have been done by Duke University, the University of Washington. These are the first I found with a quick google search. 

 

Here's another quick Google search for you: https://www.healio.com/news/primary-care/20201118/study-covid19-risk-slightly-lower-for-mask-wearers

Notable remarks:

"Those asked to wear a mask were given 50 high-quality surgical face masks with a 98% filtration rate." 

How many people do you see wearing those around town?

"They determined that the difference between the groups was -0.03 percentage points (OR = 0.82; 95% CI, 0.54-1.23), with the findings in favor of those who wore masks."

Wow! That sure is effective! NOT! So even high-grade surgical masks do not show much of a difference from those who wear no mask at all. Why? Because most diseases are transmitted via vectors; not breathing it in.

"Bundgaard said that previous observational studies have shown that masking is effective, but the studies are challenging to interpret due to the limitations of observational data."

Where masks are useful is to decrease the amount of virus spread about by INFECTED people. Notice that I said decrease and not elimination. It is not eliminated because the masks leak.

[Erik88]

5 minutes ago, DaveTN said:

As far as Trump goes; now it's mostly the hardcore Trump haters that refuse to listen to anything,

Example? 

5 minutes ago, DaveTN said:

Anyone that disagrees with them here; they just call them out by name and say they “know” what’s in those people’s minds.

Again, example? 

[jgradyc]

I subscribe to ConsumerLab. It's a service that independently checks supplements to make sure they contain what they're supposed to contain. Anyway, they recently did a study of masks. It's behind a pay wall, but their #1 rated mask was the KN95 mask by WWDOLL. I just ordered 25 today. (That's their smallest package.)  I normally wear a surgical mask, but I'm stepping up to a higher quality mask as we move into what is normally flu season. I say "normally" because so far this flu season has been almost nonexistent. Cases of the flu are way down according to the CDC Flu Tracker. Here's the link to the mask. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08L34LN8P?pf_rd_r=CFSEX9PAYY2RZHC9F4DA&pf_rd_p=40eb7df6-3345-4945-93b1-96c5bd9a116d

[peejman]

6 hours ago, E4 No More said:

Where masks are useful is to decrease the amount of virus spread about by INFECTED people. Notice that I said decrease and not elimination. It is not eliminated because the masks leak.

I dont think any reasonable person expects 100% effectiveness from a mask. I also don't think any reasonable person would doubt that they do not reduce the rate of transmission. Particularly in our world of poor manners where lots of folks don't cover their mouths when they sneezed or cough, pick their noses and teeth, and touch lots of things they shouldn't. 

[hipower]

5 hours ago, jgradyc said:

I subscribe to ConsumerLab. It's a service that independently checks supplements to make sure they contain what they're supposed to contain. Anyway, they recently did a study of masks. It's behind a pay wall, but their #1 rated mask was the KN95 mask by WWDOLL. I just ordered 25 today. (That's their smallest package.)  I normally wear a surgical mask, but I'm stepping up to a higher quality mask as we move into what is normally flu season. I say "normally" because so far this flu season has been almost nonexistent. Cases of the flu are way down according to the CDC Flu Tracker. Here's the link to the mask. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08L34LN8P?pf_rd_r=CFSEX9PAYY2RZHC9F4DA&pf_rd_p=40eb7df6-3345-4945-93b1-96c5bd9a116d

OK...I ordered a package to try. Not happy with the fit of the standard disposable masks I've seen and used. Let you know how I feel about them.           

[Omega]

I tend to believe the tests they did BEFORE the China Virus, and before this became so political. As I have said before, I wear a mask when I absolutely have to, if workers or a bunch of customers don't have one on or wearing them incorrectly, I don't bother.  As to the vaccine, nope, I've decided to take my chances. At this point, I have so many doubts about this whole mess, that it doesn't matter to me who says what, I will keep doing it the I have been this entire time.  If I get it, officially, I will deal with it, or not, so be it.

[Oh Shoot]

New TN Covid death count record yesterday: 92

- OS

[Grayfox54]

Despite pleas from just about everybody with any authority at all,  millions of Americans are traveling this holiday weekend. I sincerely hope that in a week or two we are not  forced back into another full lockdown. 

[Oh Shoot]

46 minutes ago, Grayfox54 said:

Despite pleas from just about everybody with any authority at all,  millions of Americans are traveling this holiday weekend. I sincerely hope that in a week or two we are not  forced back into another full lockdown. 

With the uber right denying most all the vectors for spread that medical science has mentioned (churches, schools,  universities, restaurants, bars, planes,  stores, extended family, Trump rallies, motorcycle mega rallies, you name it), it seems this may be valid.

Or maybe it's just divine intervention, since none of those associations could possibly be a real cause, eh?

- OS

[Omega]

1 hour ago, Oh Shoot said:

With the uber right denying most all the vectors for spread that medical science has mentioned (churches, schools,  universities, restaurants, bars, planes,  stores, extended family, Trump rallies, motorcycle mega rallies, you name it), it seems this may be valid.

Or maybe it's just divine intervention, since none of those associations could possibly be a real cause, eh?

- OS

Why aren't BLM and ANTIFA dropping like flies?, oh yea, only uber right gatherings are super spreader events, rioters are immune. 

[Oh Shoot]

30 minutes ago, Omega said:

Why aren't BLM and ANTIFA dropping like flies?, oh yea, only uber right gatherings are super spreader events, rioters are immune. 

They almost certainly did contribute some. Trump's indoor events were especially ripe pickings though.

- OS

[deerslayer]

33 minutes ago, Oh Shoot said:

They almost certainly did contribute some. Trump's indoor events were especially ripe pickings though.

- OS

Interesting that you omitted them from your list, though.  

[Oh Shoot]

38 minutes ago, deerslayer said:

Interesting that you omitted them from your list, though.  

That would be under the "you name it".

I also omitted the hotbed of spread from Trump's White House itself. Likely, couple hundred folks or more when you add up all the aides, pols, secret service guys, family members, etc. All directly related to his scoffing approach to this "flu".

I imagine that Carson and Christie weren't exactly adoring DJT from intensive care, nor Cain.

Of course, what we don't know about are all the other folks these spread to. That's how it works.

- OS

Edited November 27, 2020 by Oh Shoot

[deerslayer]

 

You described normal activities that people do during their daily lives, but omitted the criminal activity that is anything but normal but is becoming a lot more common.    

Hiding in a basement and worrying about the virus 24/7 has to be a stressful hobby.  

Edited November 27, 2020 by deerslayer

[ReeferMac]

9 hours ago, Omega said:

Why aren't BLM and ANTIFA dropping like flies?

Truth.

Politics aside.... truly, take a deep breath and remove any political bias or right-left leaning you may have:

Why aren't the homeless people dropping dead in the streets?

If this virus is as deadly as some outlets suggest, if transmissivity is as easy as those same parties suggest, then this should have ravaged those populations in all the affected major cities (which is all of them) to the point they are non-existent. Seniors in nursing homes with hourly medical checks ARE dying in large numbers (and buckets of co-morbidities, but I'd digress). But a population of drug addled mentally challenged drifters with no diet, shelter, nor medical care appear totally unaffected. This population exists to varying degrees all over the world, but certainly the US. This isn't a red-city/blue-city issue, its in big ones in the heartland and little ones on the coasts. These people are not quaranteening, social distancing, or wearing masks. They share cigarettes, food and drink, and drugs (i.e. mouth contact!)  with nary an infectious disease concern! Aerosol droplets of the virus can travel 30 meters and live for 72 hours on steel surfaces we're told. ...but the homeless panhandlers are immune?

C'mon man....

Use your brain. There IS a reason half the 'stuff' about this situation doesn't add up. You think Newsome would dine out maskless if there was a real threat to his wellbeing? Guv of NJ  was spotted with his whole fam (wife + kids) dining with friends (i.e. not same household) at a restaurant with no mask. Sound like someone who Fears for his life? Asshat had just issued lockdown orders... for the rest of the state.

Wake

The

F

Up

 

Its not about your health, it never was! None of it is. Thats WHY it doesn't add up! You're being fed lies, and your brain knows it, thats that 'funny feeling' you can't seem to shake. Its called "cognitive dissonance" (look it up!) If this viral pandemic was half of what TPTB claim it is YOU wouldn't be going shopping at Walmart, you'd be scared as $*&t hunkered down in your basement.

Instead you're arguing and fighting with friends and neighbors about politically constructed straw-man arguments... almost as if it was a distraction that was planned that way or something? Not like there is massive evidence of Election theft going on the distract you from.

 

But lets listen to 2 factory workers on faceplant debate the efficiacy of N95 vs woven weave masks citing no medical studies whatsoever.  Look, heres a celebrity with big cans and sportsball star on tee vee for you to parrot.

 

We are so screwed....

[jgradyc]

9 minutes ago, ReeferMac said:

Its called "cognitive dissonance" (look it up!)...

We are so screwed....

I didn't want to copy your entire post, but I agree. Logical fallacies are so fascinating. One that is killing Americans every day is confirmation bias by our public health officials. They absolutely refuse to consider any "evidence" that isn't the subject of double-blind FDA-approved clinical trials. 62 clinical trials are underway on vitamin D right now, but public health officials refuse to even mention it as a possible preventive and therapeutic because of their preconceived bias against vitamin supplementation. Is vitamin D3 a miracle cure? No. But the data is so far is compelling enough for me to take it and recommend it to everyone I see. 

[Erik88]

55 minutes ago, ReeferMac said:

C'mon man....

Use your brain. There IS a reason half the 'stuff' about this situation doesn't add up. Y

All year we've been told by certain groups that the virus will vanish once the election is over. The election is over and that hasn't happened. Maybe we should move the goal post and say it will now vanish when Trump is out of office?  If we are in fact being lied to, what is the motive? 

You started with this....

58 minutes ago, ReeferMac said:

Politics aside.... truly, take a deep breath and remove any political bias or right-left leaning you may have:

Then went to this...

58 minutes ago, ReeferMac said:

Not like there is massive evidence of Election theft going on the distract you from.

 

[Darrell]

ReeferMac made some great points, whether or not you agree with everything he wrote. The big takeaway for me is that I no longer believe what MSM and the politicians tell me. I always took it with a grain of salt, but now it's much worse. ReeferMac mentions a couple of governors who issued directives and then ignored them. We saw Pelosi ignoring the rules to get her hair done, and Feinstein has been photographed in the capital maskless. Those events and similar tell me that the politicians are probably a lot less concerned about this virus than they let on. The Supreme Court just ruled that governments have been treating some gatherings, like church and synagogue, differently than others, like acupuncture businesses.  And on the other hand there's Herman Cain and President Trump himself was hospitalized with the virus.

Having said that, I'm certainly not about to ignore the obvious dangers. I'm doing what I can to minimize my exposure without overly disrupting my life. As soon as a vaccine is available, I'll take it, just as I've taken the flu vaccine for the past 40 years or so. 

[hipower]

16 hours ago, Omega said:

Why aren't BLM and ANTIFA dropping like flies?, oh yea, only uber right gatherings are super spreader events, rioters are immune. 

 

6 hours ago, ReeferMac said:

Truth.

Politics aside.... truly, take a deep breath and remove any political bias or right-left leaning you may have:

Why aren't the homeless people dropping dead in the streets?

If this virus is as deadly as some outlets suggest, if transmissivity is as easy as those same parties suggest, then this should have ravaged those populations in all the affected major cities (which is all of them) to the point they are non-existent. Seniors in nursing homes with hourly medical checks ARE dying in large numbers (and buckets of co-morbidities, but I'd digress). But a population of drug addled mentally challenged drifters with no diet, shelter, nor medical care appear totally unaffected. This population exists to varying degrees all over the world, but certainly the US. This isn't a red-city/blue-city issue, its in big ones in the heartland and little ones on the coasts. These people are not quaranteening, social distancing, or wearing masks. They share cigarettes, food and drink, and drugs (i.e. mouth contact!)  with nary an infectious disease concern! Aerosol droplets of the virus can travel 30 meters and live for 72 hours on steel surfaces we're told. ...but the homeless panhandlers are immune?

C'mon man....

Use your brain. There IS a reason half the 'stuff' about this situation doesn't add up. You think Newsome would dine out maskless if there was a real threat to his wellbeing? Guv of NJ  was spotted with his whole fam (wife + kids) dining with friends (i.e. not same household) at a restaurant with no mask. Sound like someone who Fears for his life? Asshat had just issued lockdown orders... for the rest of the state.

Wake

The

F

Up

 

Its not about your health, it never was! None of it is. Thats WHY it doesn't add up! You're being fed lies, and your brain knows it, thats that 'funny feeling' you can't seem to shake. Its called "cognitive dissonance" (look it up!) If this viral pandemic was half of what TPTB claim it is YOU wouldn't be going shopping at Walmart, you'd be scared as $*&t hunkered down in your basement.

Instead you're arguing and fighting with friends and neighbors about politically constructed straw-man arguments... almost as if it was a distraction that was planned that way or something? Not like there is massive evidence of Election theft going on the distract you from.

 

But lets listen to 2 factory workers on faceplant debate the efficiacy of N95 vs woven weave masks citing no medical studies whatsoever.  Look, heres a celebrity with big cans and sportsball star on tee vee for you to parrot.

 

We are so screwed....

IMHO...These are the 2 BEST comments in this entire thread. They sum up the events as I, and I suspect many more, do around this forum and the country see them. 

Edited November 27, 2020 by hipower

[AuEagle]

Blount County Mayor Shares Comparison of Mask and No-Mask Counties in Tennessee - Tennessee Star