Purchase in GA?

[ohnoitskamryn]

Another question I'm confused on...My wife's dad purchased a gun in GA at a dealer, we were there with him, he filled out all of the paperwork for transfer/background check  etc. Anyway, he gave it to us and we are in TN, is this handgun legal for us? 

[RED333]

This could be looked at as a straw purchase .

[DaveTN]

He is a resident of GA, you are a resident of TN, it is a handgun. He can loan it to you, but to transfer ownership; it must go through a transfer at an FFL.

[GlockSpock]

Yeah, two thoughts.

The chances of it causing an issue? Not very high.

The cost of going to a local (in TN) FFL and performing a transfer? $30.00 +=$10.00.

The peace of mind knowing that there is no legal issue at all? 100% priceless.

 

[ohnoitskamryn]

So I just need to go to a dealer in TN and pay for an official transfer correct?

[ohnoitskamryn]

But again, we were in GA at the time, her dad is a resident of GA and the dealer definitely knew he was buying this for my wife. She even picked it out. I believe on the application he checked the box that asked if the gun was being transferred to someone else as well. They took her ID as well. Just wondering if I still need to go through any hoops in TN

[ohnoitskamryn]

31 minutes ago, GlockSpock said:

Yeah, two thoughts.

The chances of it causing an issue? Not very high.

The cost of going to a local (in TN) FFL and performing a transfer? $30.00 +=$10.00.

The peace of mind knowing that there is no legal issue at all? 100% priceless.

 

Also, would we both have to be present for that? He lives like 7 hours away and that would be very difficult to get him up here. I'm just trying to make sure I am 100% legal carrying a gun from my father in law that was purchased by him in another state. 

[DaveTN]

12 minutes ago, ohnoitskamryn said:

But again, we were in GA at the time, her dad is a resident of GA and the dealer definitely knew he was buying this for my wife. She even picked it out. I believe on the application he checked the box that asked if the gun was being transferred to someone else as well. They took her ID as well. Just wondering if I still need to go through any hoops in TN

The only way that handgun was legally transferred to her, was if she handed the guy a GA ID. 

The facts don't add up here. You need to either talk to an attorney or go ask your local gun dealer if he will do a transfer. 

Until that gun is legally transferred; its legal for him to loan it to his daughter. As long as no money changed hands.

[ohnoitskamryn]

1 minute ago, DaveTN said:

The only way that handgun was legally transferred to her, was if she handed the guy a GA ID. 

The facts don't add up here. You need to either talk to an attorney or go ask your local gun dealer if he will do a transfer. 

Until that gun is legally transferred; its legal for him to loan it to his daughter. As long as no money changed hands.

No money changed hands at all. He purchased a gun as a gift for her, and we went and picked it out with him. He purchased from the dealer and then when they boxed it up etc he gave it to her. However, we live in TN and are going to get our carry permits. So I just want to know if any further action is required for her to legally carry this gun that was purchased by her father in law in another state. 

[DaveTN]

9 minutes ago, ohnoitskamryn said:

No money changed hands at all. He purchased a gun as a gift for her, and we went and picked it out with him. He purchased from the dealer and then when they boxed it up etc he gave it to her. However, we live in TN and are going to get our carry permits. So I just want to know if any further action is required for her to legally carry this gun that was purchased by her father in law in another state. 

Yes, I would say further action is required to be legal. However, you need to find out from an attorney if you can gift a handgun to a family member in another state. My opinion, which is worth exactly what you are paying for it, is that the gun dealer violated the law.

I could be wrong though; it has happened before. But I’m not aware of a way handgun ownership can be transferred either by selling or gifting between non-licensees in different states, without a transfer through an FFL in the new owners state.

This is a case where you probably shouldn’t go by what you read on an internet forum. Other than the call an attorney part.

[TomInMN]

It's legal for one person to purchase a firearm as a gift for another person.

It's not legal for a non-FFL resident of one state to transfer (sell or gift, et al) ANY firearm to a resident of another state. (Unless it's as part of an estate settlement. It sounds like that's not the case here.)

Perhaps the dealer was operating under the assumption that your father-in-law was planning to travel to TN to complete the transfer of the handgun there. Even an FFL holder can only transfer a handgun to a resident of the state in which that FFL holder is licensed.

ETA: And @DaveTN is spot on: don't take our word for it, go pay a lawyer for 15 minutes of their time.

Edited January 2, 2020 by TomInMN
Additional thoughts.

[chances R]

similar situation which I posed to an ATF agent.  TN resident/father gifting his firearms to an adult daughter in another state.  He said legal, no paperwork.  

[ohnoitskamryn]

1 minute ago, chances R said:

similar situation which I posed to an ATF agent.  TN resident/father gifting his firearms to an adult daughter in another state.  He said legal, no paperwork.  

Thats basically it. Georgia resident father gifted the gun to adult daughter who lives in TN. We now have the gun here in TN. So this is legal?

[TomInMN]

2 minutes ago, ohnoitskamryn said:

Thats basically it. Georgia resident father gifted the gun to adult daughter who lives in TN. We now have the gun here in TN. So this is legal?

https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/whom-may-unlicensed-person-transfer-firearms-under-gca

[ohnoitskamryn]

3 minutes ago, TomInMN said:

https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/whom-may-unlicensed-person-transfer-firearms-under-gca

Okay, so seems like it has to be transferred to official be hers and "legal" other than a "temporary loan" of the gun. So, what do I do? Does my father in law have to be up here in TN and get it transferred here locally? Can we do this without him and just go to an FFL and get it transferred? Or do we have to give the gun back to him in GA, have him ship it to a TN FFL?

[TomInMN]

7 minutes ago, ohnoitskamryn said:

Okay, so seems like it has to be transferred to official be hers and "legal" other than a "temporary loan" of the gun. So, what do I do? Does my father in law have to be up here in TN and get it transferred here locally? Can we do this without him and just go to an FFL and get it transferred? Or do we have to give the gun back to him in GA, have him ship it to a TN FFL?

If you don't want to call a lawyer on this, at least call the local FFL where you'd want to do the transfer and ask them what they need from you in order to be willing to step in and help you out.

[GlockSpock]

46 minutes ago, TomInMN said:

It's legal for one person to purchase a firearm as a gift for another person.

It's not legal for a non-FFL resident of one state to transfer (sell or gift, et al) ANY firearm to a resident of another state. (Unless it's as part of an estate settlement. It sounds like that's not the case here.)

Perhaps the dealer was operating under the assumption that your father-in-law was planning to travel to TN to complete the transfer of the handgun there. Even an FFL holder can only transfer a handgun to a resident of the state in which that FFL holder is licensed.

ETA: And @DaveTN is spot on: don't take our word for it, go pay a lawyer for 15 minutes of their time.

I'd say a $30.00 transfer is cheaper than a lawyer.

[ohnoitskamryn]

1 minute ago, GlockSpock said:

I'd say a $30.00 transfer is cheaper than a lawyer.

agreed and that is what i plan on doing. Do you know if her dad has to be present here? since we are in different states? 

 

 

[peejman]

4 minutes ago, ohnoitskamryn said:

agreed and that is what i plan on doing. Do you know if her dad has to be present here? since we are in different states? 

 

 

Call TDOS and ask..... "An out-of-state relative wants to gift me a handgun, how do we do that?"  

I suspect you can do it at a TN FFL, but both parties must be present. 

[TomInMN]

9 minutes ago, GlockSpock said:

I'd say a $30.00 transfer is cheaper than a lawyer.

I agree. One isn't necessarily a replacement for the other though.

A lawyer can answer the questions being asked with a bit more accountability than we have. Not to say the answers will be any different, but "acted in the advice of counsel" had a bit more legitimacy than "because the internet said so".

[GlockSpock]

9 minutes ago, ohnoitskamryn said:

agreed and that is what i plan on doing. Do you know if her dad has to be present here? since we are in different states? 

 

 

I imagine it'd depend on the FFL. Some FFL's will accept a firearm (shipped to them) and then transfer it to someone. In that scenario, he could have shipped it to an FFL near you.

I'd honestly find the closest FFL that you like, call them and simply tell them you'd like to have a firearm transferred from your FIL out of state.

[ohnoitskamryn]

Sounds like currently its legal as long as its still a "gift" and not officially transferred. But getting it into her name will still have to go through the FFL. Which means I will have to give the gun back to the father in law in Georgia, and have him ship it to TN....OR have him in TN and we both go together. What a royal pain in the ass

[TomInMN]

10 minutes ago, ohnoitskamryn said:

Sounds like currently its legal as long as its still a "gift" and not officially transferred. But getting it into her name will still have to go through the FFL. Which means I will have to give the gun back to the father in law in Georgia, and have him ship it to TN....OR have him in TN and we both go together. What a royal pain in the ass

It's not "gift" vs "officially transferred", it's loaned/ rented (temporary) vs any type of permanent transfer of the firearm.

Call a local FFL and talk to them about it. It doesn't have to be much more complicated than transferring the title on a car, but you do have to know what the law requires you to do.

[ohnoitskamryn]

Thanks for all of the info yall. 

[DaveTN]

55 minutes ago, ohnoitskamryn said:

Sounds like currently its legal as long as its still a "gift" and not officially transferred. But getting it into her name will still have to go through the FFL. Which means I will have to give the gun back to the father in law in Georgia, and have him ship it to TN....OR have him in TN and we both go together. What a royal pain in the ass

No. It is legal as long as it is loaned; you can't "gift" a handgun to a resident of another state without a transfer. Call your local dealer, tell him this story. See if he will do the transfer. He should not need the Father in Law here; but it is up to him, what he wants or if he wants to do it. 

It sounds to me like, based on your description, Federal law was violated in GA at the time of the purchase; but I'm not positive about that. As I understand the law the transfer should have stopped as soon as your wife presented a TN ID.