Background Check - Felony Expunged

[kimbergirl]

Hopefully this is the correct section to ask this question. If not, feel free to remove it.

My 50 year old husband got a felony when he was 20, so 30 years ago. His felony was expunged this week and the records were deleted from criminal clerk's website this morning. Eventually, he wants to obtain his carrying license. He has no other charges anywhere.

He wants to purchase his own handgun to practice at the range and take the ccw class with it.

When he goes to purchase a gun, how long does a background check take? Also, how long should he wait before trying to purchase? We want to make sure. I think TBI does the background check, but we don't know which database they use. I know it's deleted from cjis, I think that's what it is called. 

I have my ccw and my own guns, but I keep mine in a lockbox. He could use mine, but I am sure you can see why he would be excited about getting his own. Thank you!!

[gregintenn]

A background check is usually instant. Legally, I think he could purchase a gun as soon as his record has been expunged, but as you know, this is the government you are dealing with. I wouldn't have a clue what problems you could expect or how to get them corrected. Hopefully there won't be any. I'm sure someone will be along shortly with a lot more insight and experience with this type thing.

 

Welcome to the forum! Don't be a stranger.

[kimbergirl]

6 minutes ago, gregintenn said:

A background check is usually instant. Legally, I think he could purchase a gun as soon as his record has been expunged, but as you know, this is the government you are dealing with. I wouldn't have a clue what problems you could expect or how to get them corrected. Hopefully there won't be any. I'm sure someone will be along shortly with a lot more insight and experience with this type thing.

 

Welcome to the forum! Don't be a stranger.

Thank you. That's what we are thinking. If they just check cjis, then he'd be fine. I think there is something called nics? If they check with the FBI, I doubt they'd update very fast. lol

[Omega]

Just have the paperwork handy, if/when they deny it, send them the paperwork to clear it up.

[Garufa]

It’s going to take a while for the expungement to work it’s way through the system(s)...if it ever does.  Believe it or not all LEO systems are not interconnected, far from it actually.

Expect to be denied, then appeal with the paperwork.

Edited March 8, 2019 by Garufa

[kimbergirl]

8 minutes ago, Garufa said:

It’s going to take a while for the expungement to work it’s way through the system(s)...if it ever does.  Believe it or not all LEO systems are not interconnected, far from it actually.

Expect to be denied, then appeal with the paperwork.

This is what we are afraid of. I read online that the appeal with them takes forever.

[TomInMN]

1 hour ago, kimbergirl said:

This is what we are afraid of. I read online that the appeal with them takes forever.

It might be worth a call to your local ATF field office to ask if there's any way to speed up the passing of information between government bodies in order to lower the chances of a false denial.

[kimbergirl]

48 minutes ago, TomInMN said:

It might be worth a call to your local ATF field office to ask if there's any way to speed up the passing of information between government bodies in order to lower the chances of a false denial.

Luckily, there's no rush, except he's like a teen that just turned 21 and wants to flash that id at the bar. lol

Now that he's not a felon, he could use one of my guns. I do understand his excitement, as it's been 30 years.

Would the ATF even care? I guess worse case is that he gets declined and can try again in a month or so.

I appreciate all of the feedback.

I may just ask someone at the gun store to do a quick search for us.

[Grayfox54]

I'm afraid the system is far from perfect. Maybe the info will be changed and everything will go smoothly. Most likely the first time he will get denied and have to appeal. But that's no guarantee that it will be clear sailing for any future purchases. The people responsible for these things don't always change their data base to reflect the change in your husband's status. Its entirely possible he may be delayed or denied and have to appeal on every gun purchase he ever makes. The thing is you'll never know until you try. 

He's an example: a friend of mine would get delayed on every gun purchase he ever tried to make because the initial search showed he had a police record. He was a retired Police Officer! 

Good luck. Hopefully you won't have any problems. 

[bersaguy]

14 minutes ago, Grayfox54 said:

I'm afraid the system is far from perfect. Maybe the info will be changed and everything will go smoothly. Most likely the first time he will get denied and have to appeal. But that's no guarantee that it will be clear sailing for any future purchases. The people responsible for these things don't always change their data base to reflect the change in your husband's status. Its entirely possible he may be delayed or denied and have to appeal on every gun purchase he ever makes. The thing is you'll never know until you try. 

He's an example: a friend of mine would get delayed on every gun purchase he ever tried to make because the initial search showed he had a police record. He was a retired Police Officer! 

Good luck. Hopefully you won't have any problems. 

LOL @ Fox ! he did have a police record. It just didn't make a distinction what kind of record it was. He probably could have made a few phone calls to correct it but since he was totally never denied a purchase he did bother..........JMHO 

a friend of mine would get delayed on every gun purchase he ever tried to make because the initial search showed he had a police record. He was a retired Police Officer! 

[DaveTN]

I think it depends on what the felony was. If it involved violence or drugs he may be out of luck. A few years ago a guy from (Alabama?) sued because he got a pardon from the Governor of that state and couldn’t buy a gun in Tennessee.

Expungements don’t “purge” everything and TBI may be a problem if anything shows up.

[Will]

Your not going to get correct answer here. I have been asked this same question

by a couple people I have worked with and found a legal mess in this case. I

have sent them to John Harris,Nashville Firearms Attorney.  The questions l had run into are

Can an ex felon ever purchase or possess a gun in Tn with expungement or pardon?

Can they be in home or auto if someone else has a firearm.

The info on Felon is probably stuck in the pipeline and is this person going to

be charged with trying to purchase a firearm.

I have lost touch with folks I refered to attorney and do not know if the pursued it.

All I can say is contact a attorney that deals in this matter.

I have bee told Florida just started allowing it on a case by case basis.

 

Good Luck and let us know outcome.

[kimbergirl]

6 hours ago, DaveTN said:

I think it depends on what the felony was. If it involved violence or drugs he may be out of luck. A few years ago a guy from (Alabama?) sued because he got a pardon from the Governor of that state and couldn’t buy a gun in Tennessee.

Expungements don’t “purge” everything and TBI may be a problem if anything shows up.

It was a white collar crime. No drugs or violence.

[Defender]

Methinks he's in for a hard row to hoe with this.  I recommend he NOT try to buy a gun yet, until he's 100% positive it is legal.  Expungement doesnt necessarily do it.  He could be charged with  a crime for trying.  This document may help, or not:  https://www.tn.gov/content/dam/tn/attorneygeneral/documents/ops/2015/op15-75.pdf

Will's recommendation, above, to get a lawyer, is sound advice, and GET ONE THAT KNOWS THIS STUFF, NOT JUST ANY LAWYER.

[blueis300]

I didnt have a felony but something minor on my record that shouldnt have been there. I got copies from the court house and faxed them in to show proof and got my ccw pretty quick.

[kimbergirl]

Our attorney confirmed that his felony has been completely expunged, and locally there are no records of it. He said it will take about 120 days until it makes it from the state level to federal. Just in case anyone else needs to know in the future. Of course your milage may vary. Thanks

[Defender]

Cool!  Please keep us updated on how this turns out.  Good luck.

[kimbergirl]

Just a small update. He did register to vote and that went through with no issues. I know guns are a different issue, and a different criminal history database. 

[kimbergirl]

Just in case anyone needs to know.

When you have a record expunged in Tennessee, the state MAILS the orders to TBI and they have up to 60 days to remove it. The mailing process is slow, as we found out. My husband called them on Wednesday to ask how long and was told that if the state had FAXED it, it would have been removed in hours. He told them he had a copy of the orders and could he fax and was told yes. He faxed them at 4:15pm with a cover sheet with his name and phone number.

Then on Thursday morning he got a call at 8:15am and was informed that they got the fax and removed it. He asked about the FBI and was told they removed it the same day the state does!

We wasn't sure, so he decided to wait 24 hours. Friday morning, he went to Academy Sports, picked out a Glock g43x and submitted the paperwork for the nics check. 15 minutes later he legally purchased his first handgun and skipped off out of the store grinning from ear to ear!

Once in the truck, he scheduled his ccw class for this morning. Needless to say, after having a felony since he was 20 years old, 30 years later and he is no longer a felon.

Thank you all for your interest and feedback. I hope this helps anyone in the same situation. The attorney we used is Daniel Horwitz in Nashville. Highly recommended.

 

[Chucktshoes]

Congratulations! That is awesome to hear. 

[TomInMN]

Thank you for the update. I'm glad it worked out for you all!

[gregintenn]

2 hours ago, kimbergirl said:

Just in case anyone needs to know.

When you have a record expunged in Tennessee, the state MAILS the orders to TBI and they have up to 60 days to remove it. The mailing process is slow, as we found out. My husband called them on Wednesday to ask how long and was told that if the state had FAXED it, it would have been removed in hours. He told them he had a copy of the orders and could he fax and was told yes. He faxed them at 4:15pm with a cover sheet with his name and phone number.

Then on Thursday morning he got a call at 8:15am and was informed that they got the fax and removed it. He asked about the FBI and was told they removed it the same day the state does!

We wasn't sure, so he decided to wait 24 hours. Friday morning, he went to Academy Sports, picked out a Glock g43x and submitted the paperwork for the nics check. 15 minutes later he legally purchased his first handgun and skipped off out of the store grinning from ear to ear!

Once in the truck, he scheduled his ccw class for this morning. Needless to say, after having a felony since he was 20 years old, 30 years later and he is no longer a felon.

Thank you all for your interest and feedback. I hope this helps anyone in the same situation. The attorney we used is Daniel Horwitz in Nashville. Highly recommended.

 

Good deal! I'm glad to hear it worked out.

[gregintenn]

On 3/8/2019 at 2:04 PM, DaveTN said:

I think it depends on what the felony was. If it involved violence or drugs he may be out of luck. A few years ago a guy from (Alabama?) sued because he got a pardon from the Governor of that state and couldn’t buy a gun in Tennessee.

Expungements don’t “purge” everything and TBI may be a problem if anything shows up.

Perhaps I am unclear on the meaning of "expungement". I always thought this was precisely the reason for one. I am by no means a legal scholar, however.

[DaveTN]

49 minutes ago, gregintenn said:

Perhaps I am unclear on the meaning of "expungement". I always thought this was precisely the reason for one. I am by no means a legal scholar, however.

That is the reason for doing it. But the laws and procedures vary by state and sometimes even by County. Some places purge the records from “their” system. Some places simply “seal” them. So it depends on who is doing the background check and why. Most places that have a big concern about it don’t ask if you have been convicted of a crime, they ask if you have ever been arrested, then ask you to list them and give the disposition.

I was arrested in Illinois for having a gun in my car. The case was dismissed; I wasn’t convicted. I never had a problem until years later when I came to Tennessee. TBI told me an arrest was showing but said they couldn’t tell me what it was. The ATF told me what it was and how to get it removed. I jumped through the hoops and got it done. But they told me to hang onto the documentation as it could show up again.

An expungement will work for some stuff, but is not a guarantee something won’t show up.

Edited March 23, 2019 by DaveTN

[asu174]

TBI will find a way to deny.  I had a misdemeanor disorderly conduct “fighting” in 2007 in a small town in AZ.  TBI wouldn’t approve me until I spent months figuring out the reason and then more time tracking down the paperwork.  

The reason?  It was clearly listed as a bar fight with no injuries BUT no victim was listed, who would have been the bouncer. Their reason for denial was that without a victim, it “could” have been domestic violence.  Burden of proof was on me to find paperwork with the bouncer’s name and that he wasn’t related to me.  

Private party sales are your option until the NRA sells you up the river on universal background checks.