Another shooting (Parkland High School)

[DaveTN]

In a gun free zone…. 17 dead.

http://www.foxnews.com/

 

Edited February 28, 2018 by CZ9MM

[Garufa]

Reports are the deranged kid used an AR.

[DaveTN]

6 minutes ago, Garufa said:

Reports are the deranged kid used an AR.

Yes, they say he had a gas mask, smoke grenades (undetermined if he used them), an AR15 and a bunch of mags. He pulled the fire alarm and opened fire when they ran out. He was captured about a mile away and is alive and in custody.

I keep hearing “When will we learn?” Yes, when will we learn? He was in a target rich environment and he was the only one with a gun. The only way to stop an active shooter is with another active shooter.

Also, the kids knew he was trouble.

[AuEagle]

Supposedly 19 yr old ex-student. Flagged as threat?

miamiherald:http://www.miamiherald.com/news/local/community/broward/article200126034.html

Yes Dave, one gun in the hands of a good guy could have saved so many lives present & past....

Prayers for survivors & the families of all affected.

Edited February 15, 2018 by AuEagle

[Erik88]

Pretty tastelss headline by Fox. "BLOODBATH".

As far as the gun free zone. It's a high school. Other than putting an officer in every school I'm really not sure what the solution would be. Even that isn't a guarantee. There was an officer at Pulse Nightclub too..

 

 

[Ronald_55]

I saw vid and the person in cuffs looked like an adult. I see it says 19yo now. Guess everyone looks young at my age. 

[TripleGGG]

So sad.  Words just aren't enough.  I only ask how did he "walk" away in handcuffs? Should have been a bodybag.

[n0rlf]

10 minutes ago, TripleGGG said:

So sad.  Words just aren't enough.  I only ask how did he "walk" away in handcuffs? Should have been a bodybag.

How it ended is not as important in that it did in fact end. Now after they pick his brain for a week they can take him out back and let the families have at him. 

[DaveTN]

It’s Florida; as soon as they have what they need they will fry him or stick a needle in him.

[Chucktshoes]

These sorts of mass shootings are a relatively recent phenomenon and even though a semi-auto ban most likely would have a downward effect on casualty numbers, it would still be a miniscule amount of the total annual number of gun deaths. I also can’t support any sort of action that penalizes the whole for the actions of the individual. The guns aren’t the problem though. They don’t cause the shootings to happen. Semi-auto and even full auto guns were much more accessible in years past and we didn’t have these types of shootings. Our society is sick and that sickness is causing our children to have these types of psychotic breaks. I can see the problem, but I don’t know how to fix it. What’s the solution? How do we heal something so fundamentally broken? 

[n0rlf]

Think of our politicians. They spend a lot of time and money talking but no real time doing. 

They are part of the problem not the solution. Once that is understood it is easier to Garner there is no answer forthcoming from "them". 

[Erik88]

16 minutes ago, Chucktshoes said:

These sorts of mass shootings are a relatively recent phenomenon and even though a semi-auto ban most likely would have a downward effect on casualty numbers, it would still be a miniscule amount of the total annual number of gun deaths. I also can’t support any sort of action that penalizes the whole for the actions of the individual. The guns aren’t the problem though. They don’t cause the shootings to happen. Semi-auto and even full auto guns were much more accessible in years past and we didn’t have these types of shootings. Our society is sick and that sickness is causing our children to have these types of psychotic breaks. I can see the problem, but I don’t know how to fix it. What’s the solution? How do we heal something so fundamentally broken? 

I agree with this but it's also impossible to deny that the US has really cornered the market on mass shootings. I keep trying to remind myself that these events are still pretty rare but I am concerned with the current trend. I don't know what the solution is but doing nothing doesn't seem to be working.

[SWCUMBERLAND]

47 minutes ago, n0rlf said:

How it ended is not as important in that it did in fact end. Now after they pick his brain for a week they can take him out back and let the families have at him. 

No.

Hang him, publicly, in as open and public a place as may be found, at high noon. Within the next 14 days, not 114.

I don't give a damn if he was "mentally ill". My mind is toward 17 children and their families.

But I try not to be too onesided... If someone can provide for me the PRO allowing mass murderers to shoot children without penalty, let's hear it.

 

I thought not.

SWC

[Ted S.]

44 minutes ago, Chucktshoes said:

These sorts of mass shootings are a relatively recent phenomenon and even though a semi-auto ban most likely would have a downward effect on casualty numbers, it would still be a miniscule amount of the total annual number of gun deaths. I also can’t support any sort of action that penalizes the whole for the actions of the individual. The guns aren’t the problem though. They don’t cause the shootings to happen. Semi-auto and even full auto guns were much more accessible in years past and we didn’t have these types of shootings. Our society is sick and that sickness is causing our children to have these types of psychotic breaks. I can see the problem, but I don’t know how to fix it. What’s the solution? How do we heal something so fundamentally broken? 

we live in the future accelerationists wanted

[Chucktshoes]

41 minutes ago, Erik88 said:

I agree with this but it's also impossible to deny that the US has really cornered the market on mass shootings. I keep trying to remind myself that these events are still pretty rare but I am concerned with the current trend. I don't know what the solution is but doing nothing doesn't seem to be working.

If it would end mass shootings 100%, I would give up all my semi-auto guns. It won’t though. In addition, our government has neither the ability nor the authority to make that happen. 

Our society makes folks emotionally, mentally, and physically ill. When you combine that with easy access to guns, you have us in the current situation of monthly headlines like this. 

There may be no way to completely rid ourselves of the evil that resides in man, but instead of even trying we as a culture nurture and grow that evil until it always does the inevitable. 

Edited February 15, 2018 by Chucktshoes

[GeorgeandSugar]

Apparently there were red flags. Signs were there. No one apparently spoke out. He was expelled for disciplinary reasons. I wonder if the school offered any help?

Politicians will blame guns. I wonder if there will ever be a discussion about what binds us together? Morals, accountability, responsibility, self-control, pride in self, family and community, patriotism, the flag, national anthem, pledge of allegiance, duty, honor and country.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Sidecarist]

1 hour ago, Chucktshoes said:

These sorts of mass shootings are a relatively recent phenomenon and even though a semi-auto ban most likely would have a downward effect on casualty numbers, it would still be a miniscule amount of the total annual number of gun deaths. I also can’t support any sort of action that penalizes the whole for the actions of the individual. The guns aren’t the problem though. They don’t cause the shootings to happen. Semi-auto and even full auto guns were much more accessible in years past and we didn’t have these types of shootings. Our society is sick and that sickness is causing our children to have these types of psychotic breaks. I can see the problem, but I don’t know how to fix it. What’s the solution? How do we heal something so fundamentally broken? 

Personally I think many of the issues our youth are having are directly related to lack of parenting. Single parent homes particularly where no father is present lack hard boundaries. Nurturing is a wonderful thing but kids NEED rules and consequences too. If they go long enough without them the results are what we see in our society today.

Participation trophies, no sense of accomplishment, or how to deal with loss. So many kids are just adrift in the world. They never get prepared for adulthood, and responsibility. The results are terrifying and the public response will largely be to blame anything BUT they perpetrator of this horrible event.

[Mr.Mildot]

Access to firearms has never been more restricted that at the present time. AR15 has been on the civilian market for over 50 years and is one of the most popular firearms in history, probably millions to 10's of millions of them in the US.  Obviously, something changed other than access to firearms; if there was a correlation then these incidents would be less likely now, not more.

The AR came on the market in 1963, at a time when there were virtually no gun laws other than restrictions on machineguns, 5 years before the 1968 GCA.  What has happened in the time period since then, lets reason together:

We as a nation have practically destroyed the nuclear family, eviscerated and emasculated the role of the Church in society and replaced chivalry and self-sacrifice with victimhood and narcissism. 

We abort viable pregnancies due to inconvenience, and promote offing the elderly and ill if we deem their quality of life substandard.  We allow our children to play video games that utilize the exact same psychological conditioning used to make our Vietnam Vets more efficient killers (and caused an explosion of PTSD casualties, you all know that more vets have killed themselves since the war than died in it).  

Instead of mothers and fathers raising their sons and daughters to be ladies and gentlemen,  we tell the kids they might be homosexuals or misgendered, and instead of disciplining and training them we put them on Prozac and Ritalin and give them Facebook to experience the insecurities of puberty on a macro scale, all alone on powerful mind altering medications with no morals and no father to smack them and no mother to hug them.

Short of a revival (and I do mean the Christian sort), I don't know what can turn this around, we've wasted a generation, maybe two now, and I'm staying armed and vigilant because the last thing that's gonna make anyone safer is taking away the ability to meet these threats head on.  I'm sorry to say I don't see this getting better anytime soon, but will continue to pray about it, and do what I can to influence my children and other young people that I can in appositive way...

 

[Spiffy]

Did you see what they were lumping into the stats for school shootings?  Shootings that happen within x feet of a school.......gang shoot out.......school shooting!  Someone kills themselves.......school shooting!  really screws up the "numbers" so it sounds like it happens once a week or something.

[Mr.Mildot]

8 minutes ago, Spiffy said:

Did you see what they were lumping into the stats for school shootings?  Shootings that happen within x feet of a school.......gang shoot out.......school shooting!  Someone kills themselves.......school shooting!  really screws up the "numbers" so it sounds like it happens once a week or something.

It’s like John Lott said in “the Bias Against Guns”, that the stat for children killed by guns included up to age 20 or so and included gang shootings, suicides, homes where felons illegally possessed improperly stored firearms...etc.  It turned out that actual children under 11 killed in firearm accidents in the home was so rare that 5 gallon plastic buckets and queen sized matresses were significantly more dangerous to kids than guns...

School shootings are highly publicized and unbelievably horrifyingly tragic, but still incredibly rare.

Edited February 15, 2018 by Mr.Mildot

[FortKnox]

If you want to see some dumb anti gun talking points go to this thread.

http://officialfan.proboards.com/thread/570090/high-school-shooting-parkland-fl?page=1

Edited February 15, 2018 by FortKnox

[Whisper]

Here's something interesting that I wish would get wider circulation

http://reason.com/blog/2018/02/14/yes-this-is-a-good-time-to-talk-about-gu

Also interesting -- last night on the radio I heard interviews with students and one girl said that if asked who would do a thing like that, kids would have identified the guy who became the shooter.  I think that's probably the case most of the time.  These people are known.

Cheers,

Whisper

 

Edited February 15, 2018 by Whisper

[Dolomite_supafly]

Between National Reciprocity being shelved and the bump stock ban going forward with the leaders we have in Washington I suspect this might be the straw that breaks the camel's back. I hope not but we have a bunch of weak leaders in Washington who only want control and they might use this as the impetus to start working on gun control. Remember Republican leaders are the other side of the same coin.

I seen screenshots of his FB page. He had pictures of mutilated animals. Him holding guns and knives. Definitely a disturbed kid.

 

[n0rlf]

43 minutes ago, Dolomite_supafly said:

Between National Reciprocity being shelved and the bump stock ban going forward with the leaders we have in Washington I suspect this might be the straw that breaks the camel's back. I hope not but we have a bunch of weak leaders in Washington who only want control and they might use this as the impetus to start working on gun control. Remember Republican leaders are the other side of the same coin.

I seen screenshots of his FB page. He had pictures of mutilated animals. Him holding guns and knives. Definitely a disturbed kid.

 

So get in front of it. Let's find leaders that will use this properly for a change! Notice I did not say "to our advantage". 

Time to get leaders that want what is best for the country not what they think but rather what we the people think. Gun control is not the answer, and neither is doing away with all the gun laws. Neither extreme side of the argument is right on the issue. 

Finding the root cause and interupting the chain of events that lead to these mindless and horrific events is paramount to fixing the "Problem".

So find that root cause and treat it. That is most likely a combination of things. Mental health chief amonst them.

[peejman]

When are we going to get serious about school security?  If children are our most precious resource, why do we box them up and leave them largely unprotected?  Walmart has better security than a lot of schools. It's pitiful.  

Would a police car sitting in front of the building have sent him somewhere else? Would someone monitoring security cameras be able to call in the cavalry in enough time to catch it before it started?  How did someone with no business being there even get within shouting distance of the building?