More On National Park Carry

[steamnsteel]

I came across this discussion at another forum and thought I would see what everyone thought about this over here. The general concensus is that no one wants to be a test case.

Title 18, Part I, Chapter 44, Section 930

TITLE 18 > PART I > CHAPTER 44 > § 930

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§ 930. Possession of firearms and dangerous weapons in Federal facilities

[url=http://www4.law.cornell.edu/uscode/HowCurrent.php/?tn=18&fragid=T18F00389&extid=usc_sec_18_00000930----000-&sourcedate=2008-07-07&proctime=Tue Jul 8 04:26:10 2008]How Current is This?[/url]

1111, 1112, 1113, and 1117.

(d) Subsection (a) shall not apply to—

(1) the lawful performance of official duties by an officer, agent, or employee of the United States, a State, or a political subdivision thereof, who is authorized by law to engage in or supervise the prevention, detection, investigation, or prosecution of any violation of law;

(2) the possession of a firearm or other dangerous weapon by a Federal official or a member of the Armed Forces if such possession is authorized by law; or

(3) the lawful carrying of firearms or other dangerous weapons in a Federal facility incident to hunting or other lawful purposes.

Question: How does this come into play for buildings in a NP.

[towerclimber37]

hmmm...say there's someone there to get rid of rodents...(Mike.357 comes to mind) or some such thing as that... ?

that's about the closest I can figure.

[steamnsteel]

Well if I am leagally and lawfully carrying, then I should be legal to carry in a federal facility. Or am I reading too much into this?

Edited January 20, 2009 by steamnsteel

[Fallguy]

AFAIK even with the rule change it is still illegal to carry inside a federal building, even within a National Park.

From handgunlaw.us Off Limits page

On January 9, 2009 carry in National Parks and National Wildlife Refuges is legal if you can legally carry a concealed firearm in the state the National Park or National Wildlife Refuge is located in. Carry in any buildings owned by the federal government (Which would be all buildings in most cases) in National Parks/National Wildlife Refuges is illegal. Other federal laws ban the carrying of firearms in federally owned buildings. The states can pass Laws/Rules/Regulations to ban the carrying of firearms in National Parks/National Wildlife Refuges if they wish. The new Federal Code for this change is below.

Title 36 Chpt. 1 Part 2 § 2.4 Weapons traps and nets.

(h) Notwithstanding any other provision in this Chapter, a person may possess, carry, and transport concealed, loaded, and operable firearms within a national park area in accordance with the laws of the state in which the national park area, or that portion there of, is located, except as otherwise prohibited by applicable federal law.

Chapter 50 Chapter 1 Part 27 § 27.42 Firearms.

(e) Notwithstanding any other provision in this Chapter, persons may possess, carry, and transport concealed, loaded, and operable firearms within a national wildlife refuge in accordance with the laws of the state in which the wildlife refuge, or that portion thereof, is located, except as otherwise prohibited by applicable federal law.

[Guest oldhack62]

This isn't all that hard to understand. If you enter a national park from a jurisdiction in which you are licensed/allowed to carry, you can carry in the park.

Federal buildings -- including those on park land -- are governed by a separate law which disallows firearms. Thus, you are NOT allowed to carry in a federal building, even on national park property.

Two laws, two sets of rules. Just follow the one that applies to your current circumstance. You are either in a national park, or in a federal building.

[steamnsteel]

All I was looking for was some clarification....

[Fallguy]

Question: How does this come into play for buildings in a NP.

All I was looking for was some clarification....

You can carry in a National Park, but you can not carry inside of any federal building in that park.

[dralarms]

You can carry in a National Park, but you can not carry inside of any federal building in that park.

IOW, you can carry while camping, but don't check into the rangers station while doing so.

[MadMarx]

What about carrying in a restroom/outhouse in a camping area in a national park? They could argue that was a federal building because it was a national park owned building...

[Guest SUNTZU]

I go backpacking, I have the whole forest as my bathroom. If you are car camping, I'm not sure.

[Mike.357]

I wondered about the restroom scenario too. Now common sense would say that a public restroom in a campground or a picnic area would not qualify as breaking the intent of the law. But we all know how that may play out. But I am guessing next time I picnicing down in the park I will just go take care of my business.

Doc, last time I camped in the Smokies, while before the law change on jan 9, we were able to take care of it from the outside of the building. They had a little window. Not that it mattered I was abiding by the law that day anyway.

[Smith]

I wondered about the restroom scenario too. Now common sense would say that a public restroom in a campground or a picnic area would not qualify as breaking the intent of the law. But we all know how that may play out. But I am guessing next time I picnicing down in the park I will just go take care of my business.

Doc, last time I camped in the Smokies, while before the law change on jan 9, we were able to take care of it from the outside of the building. They had a little window. Not that it mattered I was abiding by the law that day anyway.

I think getting caught carrying in a park bathroom is the least of the offenses they would get you for!

[RoDan]

I wasn't even aware that you could carry in a national park, when did this law get changed?

[Reservoir Dog]

I wasn't even aware that you could carry in a national park, when did this law get changed?

The new regulation went into effect on January 9th.

[bvarnell]

The new regulation went into effect on January 9th.

And was put on hold on January 20th.

[Reservoir Dog]

And was put on hold on January 20th.

No. That only affected pending rule changes. NP carry was already in effect, and was not pending. If the Obama administration wants to change it back, they will have to go through the whole rule change process.

[Oh Shoot]

And was put on hold on January 20th.

No, it hasn't.

- OS

[Fallguy]

And was put on hold on January 20th.

Wrong

[Guest 270win]

As far as I can tell, you can legally now carry in a state park, if state law does not prohibit it. TN is a little funny with the 'big game' regs, but I think those mainly apply to state wildlife management areas.

The fed reg does require concealment of your handgun, which will cut down on any misunderstandings with anyone not up to speed on the new reg change.

Slick is back in DC...and i'll give him credit by doing as he advised....don't ask...don't tell when it comes to me and my handgun at a national park! Be low key..under the radar and you'll never have a problem.

[Fallguy]

As far as I can tell, you can legally now carry in a state park, if state law does not prohibit it. TN is a little funny with the 'big game' regs, but I think those mainly apply to state wildlife management areas.

I don't think that is right, how do you come to that?

If you are talking about the rule change, the rule change actually allows a state to pass a law against carry in National Park in that state if they want to.

AFAIK the federal rule change does not affect any state laws in regards to carry in state parks.

[Oh Shoot]

As far as I can tell, you can legally now carry in a state park, if state law does not prohibit it. ...

Well, I guess that's true enough, in some states.

But TN does prohibit it.

Also county parks and city parks.

- OS

[Angus]

No carry in a State or City park. NP, carry is legal in the State where you were issued the prmit to carry.

Judged by 12 -vs- carried by 6 depending on your perspective and whatnot.

[Fallguy]

No carry in a State or City park. NP, carry is legal in the State where you were issued the prmit to carry.

Judged by 12 -vs- carried by 6 depending on your perspective and whatnot.

Actually it's legal in any state your permit is valid in, not just the state of issue.

[Angus]

Actually it's legal in any state your permit is valid in, not just the state of issue.

Well shoot, I did not know that...thank you so very much. That is going to make vacation 2009 much more enjoyable. Thanks for the info, that is why I am addicted to this place.

[Oh Shoot]

Well shoot, I did not know that...thank you so very much. That is going to make vacation 2009 much more enjoyable. ...

Choose Yellowstone over Yosemite

- OS