Hungarian PA 63

[Guest Fenris]

I'm wondering about the 9 x 18 Makarov round for CCW. More specifically, I am considering getting my C & R while I wait for my HCP and getting a PA63 for CCW.

Anyone had any experience with them? I've read various opinions on the net. The firepower seems to be between the .380 and the 9 mm.

I have found them online for about $150.

[Guest fastshotivy]

I've got one and love shooting it.It's fun and I enjoy shooting old guns. I have CCW but the one I have is in very good shape and I work outside and don't want to mess it up. You may also look at a CZ 52.

[Guest Spuds]

I'm wondering about the 9 x 18 Makarov round for CCW. More specifically, I am considering getting my C & R while I wait for my HCP and getting a PA63 for CCW.

If you're waiting on your C&R before getting the Pee-Aye 63, don't. It ain't C&R, and won't be for a couple of decades, since you can't tell what year one was made.

The 9x18 Makarov round is more akin to the .380 ACP than it is the 9mm Luger. The Makarov pistol is easy to control and lends itself to accuracy, hence good shot placement. For that reason, it makes a suitable carry pistol IMO.

However, it ain't a flying ashtray like a good 45 ACP.

[Guest Fenris]

Thanks for that clarification. You are correct. I was looking at a page with several C & R handguns and that one was on it and I assumed...

As for the CZ52, I am concerned with over penetration and the firing pin issue I have read about. I've shot several rounds out of a buddy's CZ52 and it is definitely a decent gun, but I am not sure about the availability of ammo to keep it from going thorugh a bad guy.

[Guest c.a.s.]

Thanks for that clarification. You are correct. I was looking at a page with several C & R handguns and that one was on it and I assumed...

As for the CZ52, I am concerned with over penetration and the firing pin issue I have read about. I've shot several rounds out of a buddy's CZ52 and it is definitely a decent gun, but I am not sure about the availability of ammo to keep it from going thorugh a bad guy.

Wolf has a Jacketed Hollow Point round available, with varying availability. From all accounts I've seen, it's got ballistics very similar to the .357MAG inside soft tissue. The Full Metal Jacket rounds WILL penetrate well, but so will practically ANY FMJ round. MagSafe makes a frangible round, that is also very high velocity. BUT, they are damn near $20 for 5 rounds. I hear the softer cases have a habit of bulging the primers (at the low-end 7.62x39 velocities the Magsafe rounds achieve).

As far as I know, other than rolling your own, Wolf and MagSafe are the ONLY commercial options that are not ONLY FMJ. Wolf also has an FMJ available.

The firing pin shouldn't be that big of a problem unless it was severelly neglected, or heavily dry fired. If you are really worried about it, there are machined firing pins available, as well as the Harrington firing pin that removes the firing pin safety (supposedly, it lightens the trigger). Looking at one right now, I don't think it will be that big of a problem unless you plan un dry firing it a lot.

What might be an issue though, is that the safety is a bit stiff, at least on mom's. You might find the 8+1 capacity a bit small, and there are not a wide variety of holsters available. Some people complain about ergonomics, I didn't mind them. Hogue makes grips for the CZ-52, and the HandAll grips supposedly make it feels better in the hand.

The SIZE, though, is another concern. It's got a somewhat long barrel.

There is no external slide release! There are commercial ones available, and you could POSSIBLY machine a tab on the release (it's actually external in the same position it would be expected to be, but it runs behind the grip at the end).

The magazine release is also an issue, or might not be. It's a eauropean-style magazine release, at the heel of the pistol. It keeps the magazine from dropping free, and might complicate the insertion of another magazine. YOu have to pull the old magazine out, and it doesn't pop itself out at all (or not enough to matter) at slidelock when empty.

You should test your decocker! It seems that it has a habit of failing in more worn CZs. Get a cleaning rod with a top you don't use (I used a patch slot), prefferably a lighter one, and stick it down the barrel. Cock the trigger, hold the pistol upwards (this is ALL after ensureing that the firearm is unloaded), and pull the trigger. The cleaning rod should jump a bit. Then, try it again, except use the decocker instead of the trigger. It should NOT jump. If it does, the intercept notch for the hammer is worn.

[towerclimber37]

I have a pa-63..they're excellent pistols. quite accurate, though you may want to put different sights on it when you get it.

the low profile sights that come stock on them make it kind of hard to aquire a target quickly IN the sights for a careful shot. it's more like finding the sights in the target...but it's a great pistol!

because of the short beavertail on it, it might take a little getting used to where recoil is concerned....the caliber is close to 380..but the powder grains are a bit more..think of it as a hot loaded .380...which is great because most .380s have less muzzle velocity because they're blowback operated.

[Guest fastshotivy]

There a lot of fun.. We build us a outdoor range and hoping that it will dry up a little more so we can shoot a little soon...

[Guest tlondon]

I have a PA-63 and love it and have considered carrying it but have heard that most defense rounds are not to reliable (just hearsay, I have not had any experience with any defense rounds). Does anybody have any info on the different 9x18 HP rounds? Also if you do carry it you might want to change the trigger spring as the trigger pull is WAY heavy.

[Guest Spuds]

9x18 Makarov ammo should not exceed 95 grains for use in a PA-63. Anything heavier, save it for a Makarov.

[Guest Fenris]

I shot one last Friday and I'm going to get it. It was a very tight shooting gun. I did see what everyone was talking about as far as the DA pull. I experimented with grouping and had the same sight picture everytime. My DA shots were all within an inch of one another, high and to the right of the SA shots, which were about 1.5" apart (there were more SA shots so it was spread out more). I didn't notice a bad recoil. I did shoot a P64 using the same ammo and really felt the sting.

I'll post pics and range report when I get it and run a couple hundred rounds through it.

[Mike.357]

Get a cleaning rod with a top you don't use (I used a patch slot),

or use a pencil with the eraser end facing the firing pin.

[towerclimber37]

If you're waiting on your C&R before getting the Pee-Aye 63, don't. It ain't C&R, and won't be for a couple of decades, since you can't tell what year one was made.

The 9x18 Makarov round is more akin to the .380 ACP than it is the 9mm Luger. The Makarov pistol is easy to control and lends itself to accuracy, hence good shot placement. For that reason, it makes a suitable carry pistol IMO.

However, it ain't a flying ashtray like a good 45 ACP.

that's the truth!!

but it's a good, cheap pistol that will do the job required and is accurate enough... so it gets a thumbs up from me!

[Guest Fenris]

or use a pencil with the eraser end facing the firing pin.

I've read about the pencil decocker test. I checked the decocker before I bought the pistol. The guy selling it to me was glad to know that trick as well.

Decocker works, but I still don't trust them.

[frankmako]

got the polish made p-64 and it is a great gun. just like an old ppk. the only problem is ammo is high. saw some ammo at a gun store in nashville last week and they want $44.00 a box. but as a gun goes they are not bad and will do the job.

[Guest Fenris]

That is high! Was that for JHP, or what?

I'm getting ball about $10/50 rounds.

The guy had a P64, but it slapped me around too much when I shot it.

[towerclimber37]

got the polish made p-64 and it is a great gun. just like an old ppk. the only problem is ammo is high. saw some ammo at a gun store in nashville last week and they want $44.00 a box. but as a gun goes they are not bad and will do the job.

you can get silver bear ammo pretty cheap! I got 500 rounds for a little over 100.00 at ammo to go.

here's the link http://www.ammunitiontogo.com/catalog1/product_info.php/pName/500rds-9x18-makarov-silver-bear-94gr-fmj-ammo/manufacturers_id/19

[Guest Fenris]

I'm looking at wolff springs and I'm going to get the 15lb recoil spring, but which hammer spring should I get to lighten up the DA?

[towerclimber37]

I'm looking at wolff springs and I'm going to get the 15lb recoil spring, but which hammer spring should I get to lighten up the DA?

ohhhhh...I wouldn't mess with the hammer spring...then again, I have no experience twiddling with that..I find that it works pretty good like it is. Perhaps one of the other Makarov guys has experience with it...

the recoil spring is a good idea..but the hammer spring? I'd advise against it.

anyone else? yea, nay?

[Guest weemsf]

You might want to consider the CZ82 in 9X18 Makarov. Very accurate, no decocker, but it does has cocked and locked capabilities. Carries 12 rounds plus one up the spout. C&R for around $190-200.

[Guest Fenris]

I have handled the CZ82, and may look into that one day. I've promised the wife that I'm done with new guns until we finish paying off student loans. I just got some holsters at Hero Gear and I'm breaking them in.

I like the feel of the FEG. I've got to practice more with it. I seem to be anticipating the recoil.

[Guest Matchguy]

I'm looking at wolff springs and I'm going to get the 15lb recoil spring, but which hammer spring should I get to lighten up the DA?

I've been an active pistol shooter and instructor since 1965 and I have one cardinal rule I will never violate:

Never mess with ignition.

The manufacturer calculated the strength of the hammer spring with regard to the weight of the hammer, length of hammer fall, weight of the firing pin, length of travel, resistance of the firing pin rebound spring, and force required to detonate a primer. That's a lot of math and you can get into serious trouble in a defensive gun by lightening a hammer spring merely to lighten the double action pull. I think you could accomplish your goal by disassembling the gun and stoning the bearing surfaces of the parts used to lever the hammer back to fire the gun double action, excluding sear surfaces. Removal of burrs, lubrication, and crud removal can make a real difference.

There have always been guys who will compromise ignition in order to achieve a better trigger pull, and there are also gunsmiths who will do it for you. But they never seem to be around to provide covering fire when the gun fails to fire in a critical defensive situation. With all due respect, you should leave the hammer spring strictly alone unless you're prepared to bet your life on the results of the change.

Jer

Edited February 18, 2009 by Matchguy

[Guest Fenris]

Match, thank you for your wisdom. I'll try the cleaning suggestions you made and just order the slide spring.

[Guest Matchguy]

Match, thank you for your wisdom. I'll try the cleaning suggestions you made and just order the slide spring.

Thanks Fenris......first time I've ever been accused of wisdom!!

Jer

[Guest PerazziTM1]

You might want to consider the CZ82 in 9X18 Makarov. Very accurate, no decocker, but it does has cocked and locked capabilities. Carries 12 rounds plus one up the spout. C&R for around $190-200.

I can 2 second this thought. I have a CZ82 bought with my C&R and thinking of getting another one. The is not to hot but the pistol was a nice surprise and today I used it as my carry weapon.

+1 on the CZ82

Wally