Las Vegas Shooting

[GlockSpock]

1 minute ago, bersaguy said:

I just heard a few minutes ago that he was using AR15's  that had been modified to full auto and had 10 of them in the room. How true that is still up in the air. What do folks here say about him shooting an AR15 and being able to kill and would that many people at 400+ yards?

Well, considering that there is seemingly roughly a 10% kill rate of the total number of casualties (based off reported numbers hospitalized), I'd saw it sounds about right and nothing unbelievable or off about it.

[GlockSpock]

1 minute ago, shotgunshooter said:

He's a changed man since Trump won and his wife divorced him.

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Emphasize?

[Omega]

2 minutes ago, bersaguy said:

I just heard a few minutes ago that he was using AR15's  that had been modified to full auto and had 10 of them in the room. How true that is still up in the air. What do folks here say about him shooting an AR15 and being able to kill and would that many people at 400+ yards?

A kill shot with a 5.56 AR is doable, been doable for a long time.  Hell, even a 22LR has a range beyond a mile.

[bersaguy]

Just now, Omega said:

A kill shot with a 5.56 AR is doable, been doable for a long time.  Hell, even a 22LR has a range beyond a mile.

Good point. Also he didn't have to really aim but more or less just point at the crowd and fire.........JMHO

[Chucktshoes]

9 minutes ago, CZ9MM said:

Oh yeah, I saw somewhere the first callings of a false flag earlier this morning. I'm somewhat curious to see how Alex Jones approaches the issue since he proclaimed Obama was behind all the other false flag shootings but now he is pretty inline with Trump.

I'm not oblivious to the fact that false flags could and probably even do exist to certain degree, but 500-600 "victims" in a crowd of I believe 10,000+, not to mention all the EMS, hospitals, etc that would also be in on it. If one tries to search and find false flags, this seems like the dumbest shooting in recent history to try and believe is one of them. This is of course in response to the "it never really happened" crowd. If someone wants to try and argue that the shooter himself was the false flag and was either a patsy or still alive, then that's entirely different.

If it was a false flag, I'm putting my money on the NFL being behind it. We haven't argued about protests all morning.  I mean, that's no more ridiculous of an idea than any other false flag theory, right? 

[shotgunshooter]

Emphasize?

I used to follow him pretty regularly. Now I realize what a nut job he is. If you look at his stuff from before his divorce vs after you can definitely tell a change in tone. I don't know how to explain it other than to go listen to some of the Sandy Hook stuff v. this shooting. I listen to his stuff now to fall asleep because it's so boring. Here's a link about his divorce. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/alex-jones-weed_us_58f9134ae4b00fa7de128eed


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[E4 No More]

13 minutes ago, bersaguy said:

I just heard a few minutes ago that he was using AR15's  that had been modified to full auto and had 10 of them in the room. How true that is still up in the air. What do folks here say about him shooting an AR15 and being able to kill and wound that many people at 400+ yards?

That would be an easy thing to do. Marines shot old M16's to 500 yards BEFORE they "improved" the ammo. Shooting from elevation with spray & pray would be nothing.

[Omega]

1 minute ago, Chucktshoes said:

If it was a false flag, I'm putting my money on the NFL being behind it. We haven't argued about protests all morning.  I mean, that's no more ridiculous of an idea than any other false flag theory, right? 

Maybe even a disgruntled Raiders fan??

You can make this fit practically any narrative nowadays.

[GlockSpock]

Just now, shotgunshooter said:

I used to follow him pretty regularly. Now I realize what a nut job he is. If you look at his stuff from before his divorce vs after you can definitely tell a change in tone. I don't know how to explain it other than to go listen to some of the Sandy Hook stuff v. this shooting. I listen to his stuff now to fall asleep because it's so boring. Here's a link about his divorce. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/alex-jones-weed_us_58f9134ae4b00fa7de128eed


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Yeah, I saw about some of his divorce. I just wasn't sure if you meant he was getting more or less out there. I mean, he can't claim this was a false flag can he? If he did, it would mean Trump was behind it.

[shotgunshooter]

Yeah, I saw about some of his divorce. I just wasn't sure if you meant he was getting more or less out there. I mean, he can't claim this was a false flag can he? If he did, it would mean Trump was behind it.

He's gone from Obama being to blame and every ABC agency to the globalists and Soros. It's kind of comical to see him play the blame game to explain what happens in the world.

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[mikegideon]

15 minutes ago, Omega said:

A kill shot with a 5.56 AR is doable, been doable for a long time.  Hell, even a 22LR has a range beyond a mile.

Yep, with enough of it. Kills were about 10% of the injuries. I'm betting 90% of the rounds or better hit somebody. He could have been shooting more than one gun at a time too.

[n0rlf]

All of this is speculation and as he is dead likely to remain that way as he sure cannot tell us. 

The only fact we know for sure at this point is there are a lot of people dead or injured and that the left is going to use this crisis yet again to further their goal on gun control.

Too bad that some just do not get the truth about the human vs the chosen tool when things like this happen.

 

[Steelharp]

6 minutes ago, n0rlf said:

 

The only fact we know for sure at this point is there are a lot of people dead or injured and that the left is going to use this crisis yet again to further their goal on gun control.

The reporters at the WH briefing right now are proof of this.

[Omega]

7 minutes ago, mikegideon said:

Yep, with enough of it. Kills were about 10% of the injuries. I'm betting 90% of the rounds or better hit somebody. He could have been shooting more than one gun at a time too.

I keep hearing 200 rounds being thrown around, I highly doubt they have a full count yet, but if so that would mean pass-throughs and ricochets accounted for the higher number and some of the injured are probably not due to gun fire.

[KahrMan]

44 minutes ago, Sam1 said:

As always info is questionable for a while, but someone just popped on the news and said he had trigger cranks on Ar15's

 

Interesting.  First thing I said this morning when my wife was playing the audio was that I thought it sounded like a crank. Like the videos of the twin 10/22's with cranks. It had that cadence to me.

[GlockSpock]

1 minute ago, Omega said:

I keep hearing 200 rounds being thrown around, I highly doubt they have a full count yet, but if so that would mean pass-throughs and ricochets accounted for the higher number and some of the injured are probably not due to gun fire.

Well, if 500+ people were counted as casualties, some of those people may have sprained an ankle while running, etc. Some of them would have likely just been nicked with a round on a leg/arm, etc and that bullet would still have had enough energy to harm the person behind them as well. However, 200 rounds seems low compared to the reports of multiple rifles, etc. Also, an M-16 has a rate of fire of about 700–950 rounds/min cyclic. If he truly was using a trigger crank mechanism, I imagine the cyclic rate would be lower but still in the hundreds. Even accounting for mag and possibly weapon changes, it seems he would have burned through 200 rounds in a matter of a moment or two.

So with that said, who has found any reputable source for exactly how long, from start to the last shot, that he was shooting?

[mikegideon]

The old blister is thumping her chest...

[shotgunshooter]

The old blister is thumping her chest...

Just another sad attempt to stay relevant.

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[Omega]

1 minute ago, shotgunshooter said:

Just another sad attempt to stay relevant.

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Who is that?

[mikegideon]

2 minutes ago, Omega said:

Who is that?

Oops. She is a nice lady that cares about all of us. 

Edited October 2, 2017 by mikegideon

[btq96r]

Good point. Also he didn't have to really aim but more or less just point at the crowd and fire.........JMHO

Bingo. Based on the crowd size and rate of fire, the shooter approached this as an area target, not a point target. And with a crowd size like that, it was a massive area target indeed.

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[Chucktshoes]

5 minutes ago, btq96r said:

Bingo. Based on the crowd size and rate of fire, the shooter approached this as an area target, not a point target. And with a crowd size like that, it was a massive area target indeed.

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 Yep. I imagine in the coming days we will find out that a significant portion of the injuries and possibly even fatalities were due to crush and stampede injuries as opposed to gunfire. 

Edited October 2, 2017 by Chucktshoes

[jgradyc]

I just listened to a 2-minute cell phone video. The first nonstop burst was about 100 rounds. There was a pause of about 30 seconds and then the next burst sounded different, but it was the same rate of fire. It lasted about 40 rounds. The second burst sounded like an AR15, but the first long burst was deeper... more of a pom pom pom sound. After that, there was another pause, but the video stopped at two minutes before any more rounds were fired. 

Maybe the first gun had a longer barrel?

Edited October 2, 2017 by jgradyc

[bersaguy]

This is just one more reason why I don't go to anything with a crowd of more than what is found in a grocery store or maybe Walmart late at night when crowd is gone...........JMHO.

[ttocswob]

"Bracken Sends" on Western Rifle Shooters Association:

"The mag dump has happened. Damn"

More at link - has video on Alex Jones interview today (I know, but Bracken seems credible) and more interesting, video of alleged shooter at recent Anti-Trump rally.

Definite left-wing association, and lots of other questions.