Can you "unarm" if needed?

[Guest Memtim]

I'm in the wait mode for my permit and looking for input on a question regarding how to deal with carrying but finding yourself unexpectedly needing to be unarmed. For example I could have been in this situation today-being a passenger in a vehicle with others in a work situation and arriving at a posted no weapons allowed location not knowing the prohibition previously. Is there any way to go from armed to unarmed yet retaining possesion of your weapon? Can you unload your gun, disassemble it putting the slide in my case in one pocket, body and action in another, magazine in a sock and still be armed? I don't think that this is remotely possible but I wondered about this scenario and today it could have happened. I never got a chance to get this answered in my permit class and I haven't found an answer in the forums here. Thanks in advance for any input.

[Punisher84]

I'm in the wait mode for my permit and looking for input on a question regarding how to deal with carrying but finding yourself unexpectedly needing to be unarmed. For example I could have been in this situation today-being a passenger in a vehicle with others in a work situation and arriving at a posted no weapons allowed location not knowing the prohibition previously. Is there anyway to go from armed to unarmed yet retaining possesion of your weapon? Can you unload your gun, disassemble it putting the slide in my case in one pocket, body and action in another, magazine in a sock and still be armed? I don't think that this is remotely possible but I wondered about this scenario and today it could have happened. I never got a chance to get this answered in my permit class and I haven't found an answer in the forums here. Thanks in advance for any input.

I'm not really 100% on this, but I'd think carrying a broken down gun in a prohibited location would still be a crime. It doesn't take that long to assemble a gun if you have all the pieces and it's just field stripped.

Your best bet is if you don't want anyone knowing you have it, but can't carry it in somewhere, carry it in a Maxpedition type bag or briefcase. You still have access to it, but you don't have to take it on or off and blow your cover.

[Guest oldhack62]

I have a lockbox chained/locked to the auto frame in a non-passenger area of my car for this eventuality. Unload the chamber, put the magazine in the glove compartment, and the gun in the box (probably in your trunk). Most LEOs will consider this 'unarmed', since you would have to make at least three actions to access your gun -- 1) obtain your magazine; 2) open your car door and get out; 3) open the trunk; and 4) unlock your lockbox.

However, don't even carry the gun onto school property, unless you are just driving through to drop off the kids (even then, keep your damned hands off the gun!). (Disclaimer: just the messenger here -- I didn't make the law!)

[Oh Shoot]

...

Your best bet is if you don't want anyone knowing you have it, but can't carry it in somewhere, carry it in a Maxpedition type bag or briefcase. You still have access to it, but you don't have to take it on or off and blow your cover.

You lost me.

Saying carrying in a maxpediton is not really carrying?

- OS

Edited January 15, 2009 by OhShoot

[Oh Shoot]

I have a lockbox chained/locked to the auto frame in a non-passenger area of my car for this eventuality.....

For the eventuality of .. "being a passenger in a vehicle with others in a work situation and arriving at a posted no weapons allowed location not knowing the prohibition previously" ??

- OS

[Guest Micromancer]

Edit: wrong thread.

Edited January 15, 2009 by Micromancer

[Punisher84]

You lost me.

Saying carrying in a maxpediton is not really carrying?

- OS

No, from what I was gathering of the OP's problem was he needed to disarm, but seemed to not want to let his co-workers know. I was thinking a MAX bag would be a good way to carry, but not have to actually take the gun from the holster and stash it in plain view of his co-workers.

That is what I read into it anyway.

[Smith]

This has been discussed before and the technicalities alone would bog this thread down for 5 more pages of arguing so....... what i have decided is to simply keep it concealed. If you are "working" you and your buddies shouldn't be drinking, so that would be in your benefit should something happen and if no one knows - well, no one knows. No harm, no foul.

I would find it equally difficult, both legally and personally, if something happened while my gun was in the co-workers car. Say like it got broken into or stolen and I'm trying to explain to my co-workers surprise why there was a loaded gun in his car he didn't know about. At that point I have made my difficult situation his and possibly put someone else in a difficult legal position they neither asked for nor wanted.

[Guest Memtim]

Again thanks to all so far for the replies, No bars or drinking activity/establishment involved yesterday. I should have asked- If I had a weapon on my body with no other way to secure it off of me, can it be disassembled in any way to be no longer considered "carrying"? This is a new issue in my life now and I would like to know how I might deal with it. The just don't show and tell issue was obvious but not comfortable to me. Sorry to rehash an old issue but I missed the related previous posts.

[mousegunner]

If you accidentally find yourself in such a situation, well, concealed means CONCEALED really well, I would think.

[Fallguy]

I think the answer to your question is simply, No.

The reason I think so is in 39-17-1305, 39-17-1306, 39-17-1309 & 39-17-1311 they all say either firearm or weapon and do not mention it having to be loaded. So simply broke down, especially with the ammo in your possesion would seem to be still considered possesion of the weapon. In fact according to 39-17-1301(15) if the ammo is still in the immediate vicinty of the weapon, it is still considered loaded.

[ZenDog]

Barring a pat down search, metal detectors, or just bad luck a well concealed handgun is unlikely to be a problem even in a prohibited area for a law-abiding person of average intelligence and reasonable impulse control.

To be searched you have to give someone probable cause, or they have to search everyone like they do at some sporting events, etc. If you get searched you have done something stupid, impulsive, or both.

Or you have been incredibly unlucky, and sometimes sh$t just happens that you cannot control. For example, once a security guard at a Stuckey's patted me down for suspected shoplifting- I was young, not carrying, and I had no idea about rights, laws, etc. I wasn't shoplifting, I had never ever shoplifted (I was a bit of a Dudley Dooright in my younger days), and I have no idea why he searched me- perhaps mistaken identity or something. Bad luck. Glad I wasn't carrying illegally that day!

If you see a metal detector, turn around and go somewhere else to figure out what to do. Better to explain to friends or the boss later than to explain to a judge later.

An impulsive stupid person could get into a lot of trouble carrying in a prohibited location- but they could get into trouble anywhere if they are impulsive and stupid.

[ftncityfatboy]

I'm in the wait mode for my permit and looking for input on a question regarding how to deal with carrying but finding yourself unexpectedly needing to be unarmed. For example I could have been in this situation today-being a passenger in a vehicle with others in a work situation and arriving at a posted no weapons allowed location not knowing the prohibition previously. Is there any way to go from armed to unarmed yet retaining possesion of your weapon? Can you unload your gun, disassemble it putting the slide in my case in one pocket, body and action in another, magazine in a sock and still be armed? I don't think that this is remotely possible but I wondered about this scenario and today it could have happened. I never got a chance to get this answered in my permit class and I haven't found an answer in the forums here. Thanks in advance for any input.

could have been as in "you were carrying and almost found yourself in this situation", or could have been as in "had I been in this situation"? I'm going with the latter because I know no one here has or would carry w/o a permit....

[Buzz]

Is there any way to go from armed to unarmed yet retaining possesion of your weapon?

There really isn't any way to do what you're thinking. My understanding is that you're either carrying or you're not. There is no middle ground. Condition of the weapon is not a factor. For example, if you're carrying illegally, it does not matter whether the weapon is loaded.

In the situation, you've got three options:

(1) Keep it concealed and go ahead. Obviously you're risking getting into trouble if you're caught.

(2) Make up some excuse about why you can't go in there. (Last time I ate there, I threw up all night.)

(3) Come clean and tell the coworkers what's up. That is a risk also because mixing guns and employment can come back to bite you, depending on your job and your employer's policies.

One thing I like about autos that won't fire with the mag removed. If I find myself needed to be unarmed, I drop the mag, put it in my pocket, and leave the gun without worrying about it being fired by an unauthorized person (unless they happen to have their own mag).

[Guest m&pc9]

Or you have been incredibly unlucky, and sometimes sh$t just happens that you cannot control. For example, once a security guard at a Stuckey's patted me down for suspected shoplifting- I was young, not carrying, and I had no idea about rights, laws, etc. I wasn't shoplifting, I had never ever shoplifted (I was a bit of a Dudley Dooright in my younger days), and I have no idea why he searched me- perhaps mistaken identity or something. Bad luck. Glad I wasn't carrying illegally that day!

May be he thought you were a cute young lad!

[Punisher84]

May be he thought you were a cute young lad!

[Guest Memtim]

No I wasn't illegally carrying-Never have. Plain and simple, if I would have had a weapon on me what could I have done if anything? The prohibitted location was a law enforcement training academy-not a bar. Substitute any other location you may wind up at armed and prohibitted. Again, thanks.

Edited January 21, 2009 by Memtim