Situational awareness, common sense, and legalities.

[DaveTN]

Some things have happened in the last week we need to learn from.

Two corrections Officers were murdered on a prisoner transport bus in Georgia. There is video of the murders, but I have not seen it. This is all mere speculation on my part.

Because the two murderers had to come through a locked gate to get to the Officers, I assume they forced their way through or somehow unlocked the gate. I’m not sure how that could happen without the Officers having time to get their guns out. So it makes me wonder...Were they thinking they weren’t justified in shooting these guys because they were unarmed. If that is the case it cost them their lives. They were justified in shooting them as obviously they were in immediate danger of death or great bodily harm. The results support that.

I just read in another post that we have a legal system not a justice system. Absolutely, I have said that several times here. Being a former Police Officer I am absolutely sure of that. I am also absolutely sure that will not change. Justice? If you come through the incident alive you will get as much justice as you can afford. A poor person with a Public defender will likely not get the same outcome as a rich person or a high profile case where the “Big Names” are involved.

Otto Warmbier died this week as the result of a murder. My guess is that he was beaten as soon as he got to prison and had a traumatic brain injury. I suspect the North Koreans waited a year so as not show any evidence. But that just a WAG.

The Officer that shot Philando Castile was acquitted in court.

What do these three incidents have in common? Situational awareness, common sense, and legalities. You are responsible for teaching your kids how to stay alive. One of the guys at work today asked “What do you think made Otto rip down that poster?” I said I can only guess that he forgot where he was and mistakenly thought he had some rights. He certainly didn’t deserve to die over it; but he did.

Was Philando Castile going for a gun? I don’t pretend to know I didn’t hear the evidence. But I’ve been in shootings and had a gun pulled on me more than once. There is no time; you act or die. In this case a jury believed that they would have believed they were in immediate danger of death or great bodily harm. People need to know that whether it’s a cop, citizen, or armed robber, if some pulls a gun on them they have two choices, listen to exactly what the person is telling you to do and don’t make any wrong moves, or fight. There is no middle of the road; there is no time to think. Justice? We will never really know but the Officer stood trial and a jury acquitted him.

I think the two corrections Officers may have taken that one or two very valuable seconds of hesitation and it cost them their lives. What would have happened had they gunned down the two unarmed convicts as they came through the gate? Well.. there would be plenty of people callings for their heads.

Stay alive…. And teach your kids how to stay alive. If they are having an interaction with a cop and it goes wrong; there will be a time and a place to deal with it. Trying to deal with it right then on the street will likely end badly for them. I wish I could help kids understand traffic stops and the ramifications of DUI. They get so much bad information. Some of it coming from their parents and teachers, and a mountain of it coming from lawyers.

[bersaguy]

15 minutes ago, DaveTN said:

Some things have happened in the last week we need to learn from.

Two corrections Officers were murdered on a prisoner transport bus in Georgia. There is video of the murders, but I have not seen it. This is all mere speculation on my part.

Because the two murderers had to come through a locked gate to get to the Officers, I assume they forced their way through or somehow unlocked the gate. I’m not sure how that could happen without the Officers having time to get their guns out. So it makes me wonder...Were they thinking they weren’t justified in shooting these guys because they were unarmed. If that is the case it cost them their lives. They were justified in shooting them as obviously they were in immediate danger of death or great bodily harm. The results support that.

I just read in another post that we have a legal system not a justice system. Absolutely, I have said that several times here. Being a former Police Officer I am absolutely sure of that. I am also absolutely sure that will not change. Justice? If you come through the incident alive you will get as much justice as you can afford. A poor person with a Public defender will likely not get the same outcome as a rich person or a high profile case where the “Big Names” are involved.

Otto Warmbier died this week as the result of a murder. My guess is that he was beaten as soon as he got to prison and had a traumatic brain injury. I suspect the North Koreans waited a year so as not show any evidence. But that just a WAG.

The Officer that shot Philando Castile was acquitted in court.

What do these three incidents have in common? Situational awareness, common sense, and legalities. You are responsible for teaching your kids how to stay alive. One of the guys at work today asked “What do you think made Otto rip down that poster?” I said I can only guess that he forgot where he was and mistakenly thought he had some rights. He certainly didn’t deserve to die over it; but he did.

Was Philando Castile going for a gun? I don’t pretend to know I didn’t hear the evidence. But I’ve been in shootings and had a gun pulled on me more than once. There is no time; you act or die. In this case a jury believed that they would have believed they were in immediate danger of death or great bodily harm. People need to know that whether it’s a cop, citizen, or armed robber, if some pulls a gun on them they have two choices, listen to exactly what the person is telling you to do and don’t make any wrong moves, or fight. There is no middle of the road; there is no time to think. Justice? We will never really know but the Officer stood trial and a jury acquitted him.

I think the two corrections Officers may have taken that one or two very valuable seconds of hesitation and it cost them their lives. What would have happened had they gunned down the two unarmed convicts as they came through the gate? Well.. there would be plenty of people callings for their heads.

Stay alive…. And teach your kids how to stay alive. If they are having an interaction with a cop and it goes wrong; there will be a time and a place to deal with it. Trying to deal with it right then on the street will likely end badly for them. I wish I could help kids understand traffic stops and the ramifications of DUI. They get so much bad information. Some of it coming from their parents and teachers, and a mountain of it coming from lawyers.

This all makes perfect sense except you forgot the most important aspect in our childrens lives and the is PEER Pressure. PEER Pressure cause more you people to get in trouble than all of the other items you listed together. What we need to teach our children is not to fall into the Peer pressure trap and think for themselves and not let others think for them.............JMHO

[peejman]

1 minute ago, bersaguy said:

This all makes perfect sense except you forgot the most important aspect in our childrens lives and the is PEER Pressure. PEER Pressure cause more you people to get in trouble than all of the other items you listed together. What we need to teach our children is not to fall into the Peer pressure trap and think for themselves and not let others think for them.............JMHO

Better yet to teach your kids not to associate with those who might try to pressure them into doing something dumb. 

[No_0ne]

21 hours ago, peejman said:

Better yet to teach your kids not to associate with those who might try to pressure them into doing something dumb. 

Let me know when you find a group of kids who don't do dumb things ...

[peejman]

2 hours ago, No_0ne said:

Let me know when you find a group of kids who don't do dumb things ...

Kids doing dumb kid things is normal. I get the (perhaps incorrect) impression that Dave wasn't talking about 20 yr olds. If a 20 yr old with an American passport really thinks being touristy in North Korea is a good idea.... those mistakes were made long before.