NRA carry Guard?

[deadeye111]

Has any TGO members signed up for the NRA carry guard insurance?  I am interested in your opinions.  Spouses coverage is included in price.  

[chances R]

Comparison with USCCA:

https://d3rmvquxnxa9wt.cloudfront.net/pdf/guides/USCCA_CarryGuard_ComparisonChart.pdf

[deadeye111]

Thanks Chances that chart puts it in perspective.  I will pass on NRA CG unless they come up with something better down the road.  

[deadeye111]

Anyone else have any suggestions?

[monkeylizard]

Both also provide access to a video library of training materials, but it looks like USCCA's focuses mostly on laws and information about carrying. NRA CG appears to focus on tactics.

Can anyone confirm or correct that?

[chances R]

I guess that would not surprise me.  Look at the advisors for the NRA, all special forces types.  It always grinds at me a little that a lot of folks simply do not understand the differences between military, police, and civilian firearm uses and 'rules of engagement'.  Same thing in the political arena.  Waving training for LEO and military, especially in our state when knowing the TN law is a very important part of carrying a gun in this state.  And before anyone yells it is about the money, my preference is that one should complete an online test about those laws, much like hunter safety.  Does no one any good to survive the gunfight and have to spend 20 in the big house because you couldn't survive the legal fight.

[peejman]

And now we know why the USCCA was uninvited from the NRA convention. 

[PC7]

On 5/2/2017 at 7:33 AM, peejman said:

And now we know why the USCCA was uninvited from the NRA convention. 

The NRA sells booth space at their convention, I don't think USCCA was "uninvited," they chose not to attend. They were on the exhibitor map.

BTW, I'm looking at both but when I tried to chat with USCCA online it said "unavailable." Then I tried to call and I got an automated response that said they were in a meeting.

I followed that up with an email, and after a week, no response.

Piss poor customer service in my opinion. I'll be staying away from the USCCA. 

 

[scooter]

7 hours ago, PC7 said:

The NRA sells booth space at their convention, I don't think USCCA was "uninvited," they chose not to attend. They were on the exhibitor map.

BTW, I'm looking at both but when I tried to chat with USCCA online it said "unavailable." Then I tried to call and I got an automated response that said they were in a meeting.

I followed that up with an email, and after a week, no response.

Piss poor customer service in my opinion. I'll be staying away from the USCCA. 

Read USCCA | President’s Message: Why I’m Excited About Getting “Kicked Out” of the NRA Annual Meeting…. Yes, they were uninvited two weeks before the NRA Annual Meeting, because the NRA launched Carry Guard. Tim Schmidt, President of the USCCA, attended NRA Annual Meeting as an NRA member anyway and was hosted by the BarrelBlok Booth (#661). The The USCCA is currently having a rather large contact volume due to the press generated by the NRA. Contact the USCCA here.

Edited May 5, 2017 by scooter

[chances R]

8 hours ago, PC7 said:

The NRA sells booth space at their convention, I don't think USCCA was "uninvited," they chose not to attend. They were on the exhibitor map.

BTW, I'm looking at both but when I tried to chat with USCCA online it said "unavailable." Then I tried to call and I got an automated response that said they were in a meeting.

I followed that up with an email, and after a week, no response.

Piss poor customer service in my opinion. I'll be staying away from the USCCA. 

Is it just me, or do I detect a speck of bias here?  (hint: avatar)

8 hours ago, PC7 said:

 

 

[chances R]

http://www.alloutdoor.com/2017/04/25/nra-carry-guard-insurance/

[jh225]

On 4/29/2017 at 10:30 AM, chances R said:

Comparison with USCCA:

https://d3rmvquxnxa9wt.cloudfront.net/pdf/guides/USCCA_CarryGuard_ComparisonChart.pdf

Good comparison, BUT........ Has anyone here used or know of anyone that used USCCA services and if so, did it go as the plan states?

Edited May 5, 2017 by jh225

[chances R]

Not me, hope I never do.  And certainly no one has used the NRA ins. yet either.  Reference my earlier posting on training.  Ran across this by Dave Spaulding which I think is relevant regarding training: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Of81h8Iclnw

[bud]

.

Edited May 30, 2017 by bud

[peejman]

2 hours ago, bud said:

 

USCCA is not an insurance company. They are a company that owns an insurance policy sold to them by a real insurance company. They are allowed to use the policy they own to "protect" the pool they put together based on their own determinations. Their "declarations" page is full of subjective qualifiers like "we may", and lots of use of the word "reasonable".

If I want an insurance policy, I'll buy it from an actual insurance company that offers actual policies that are bound by state regulations of insurance and commerce. If no real insurance company offers such policies, then there is probably a good reason for that.

That being said, USCCA had a brilliant idea to team up with whoever the actual underwriter is, and to play on gun owners worst fear by selling them a dream. The idea has huge profits potential, hence NRA deciding to fish in their own huge pool to realize those profits for themselves.

Exactly. It's called an umbrella policy. They're fairly inexpensive and cover lots more than what these specific policies do. 

[PC7]

16 hours ago, scooter said:

Read USCCA | President’s Message: Why I’m Excited About Getting “Kicked Out” of the NRA Annual Meeting…. Yes, they were uninvited two weeks before the NRA Annual Meeting, because the NRA launched Carry Guard. Tim Schmidt, President of the USCCA, attended NRA Annual Meeting as an NRA member anyway and was hosted by the BarrelBlok Booth (#661). The The USCCA is currently having a rather large contact volume due to the press generated by the NRA. Contact the USCCA here.

I may have misspoken. But, that is just one side of the story. As we all know, there are three sides to every story.

But let's just say they were kicked out of the NRA show. 

What is their excuse for not answering calls, or returning emails? 

[chances R]

I have asked my insurance co. about self- defense shootings.  I can't pin my down for a solid answer . " it depends" is about as far as it goes .  Ask yours

[bud]

.

Edited May 30, 2017 by bud

[scooter]

4 hours ago, PC7 said:

I may have misspoken. But, that is just one side of the story. As we all know, there are three sides to every story.

But let's just say they were kicked out of the NRA show. 

What is their excuse for not answering calls, or returning emails? 

Well, that "side of the story" was the only "side" discussed at the NRA Annual meeting this year as the NRA itself elected to stay quiet on this.

As for not answering your calls or e-mails. I would say that there is no excuse for a business that wants customers. But then, I do not necessarily believe "your side of that story", given that USCCA gives instant feedback via Facebook messages. See the "Typically replies instantly" note on USCCA's Facebook page. I also never had a problem reaching USCCA by phone, especially given that (877) 677-1919 is also their 24/7/356 quick response line to call after a shooting.

And, yes, I am a USCCA member.

[DaveTN]

I don’t think it’s reasonable to expect either one of those policies to cover you in a shooting. Too many possible scenarios they could use for an out. I don’t know for sure, but I doubt there is any insurance company on earth that would cover you if you are charged with a criminal act.

Save your money in case you should need a lawyer, or use it to be trained and understand the law so the chances would be greatly reduced you will need a lawyer.

How many of you have a phone number you can call day or night and get a response from your attorney in a timely manner? That should be your first goal and it shouldn’t cost you.

[chances R]

I could save my premium for 10 years and it doesn't come close to bail money.  Lots of good reports on the USCCA.....I will take my chances in the unlikely event I need them.  Many nationally known trainers are more endorsing them, including Andrew Branca.

[DaveTN]

2 hours ago, chances R said:

 Many nationally known trainers are more endorsing them, including Andrew Branca.

Well….. He is the first person listed on their “Legal Advisory Board” on their website. And he has made himself “Nationally Known”.   

I don’t think there is anything wrong with people being prepared. But like any service they should have the right to understand what will and will not be paid. With all the self-defense shootings, and deadly force threats in this country I would think there would be more information available on these outfits. I don’t see much that isn’t in an advertisement.

I would like to hear the views of our Tennessee Attorneys on here about the likelihood of any of these places cutting a check and mailing it out as is suggested in their commercials.

This is not either of the companies mentioned here….. But it contains some interesting info from a couple of years ago.

https://www.thetrace.org/2015/08/texas-law-shield-concealed-carry-insurance-class-action-lawsuit/

 

[scooter]

2 hours ago, DaveTN said:

Well….. He is the first person listed on their “Legal Advisory Board” on their website. And he has made himself “Nationally Known”.   

I don’t think there is anything wrong with people being prepared. But like any service they should have the right to understand what will and will not be paid. With all the self-defense shootings, and deadly force threats in this country I would think there would be more information available on these outfits. I don’t see much that isn’t in an advertisement.

I would like to hear the views of our Tennessee Attorneys on here about the likelihood of any of these places cutting a check and mailing it out as is suggested in their commercials.

This is not either of the companies mentioned here….. But it contains some interesting info from a couple of years ago.

https://www.thetrace.org/2015/08/texas-law-shield-concealed-carry-insurance-class-action-lawsuit/

No insurance company is covering illegal acts. Self defense insurance companies use a different models and have different coverages. The Post Self Defense Support: The Buyer's Guide by the Armed Citizens' Legal Defense Network goes over the different models. If you would like to understand what USCCA covers, just read USCCA's Self-Defense Liability Coverage Form, which is the actual insurance policy.

I would not necessarily rely on the notorious anti-gun The Trace for firearms related information. It is true that there were issues with Texas Law Shield. However, their Web site spells out what is and what is not covered (see Legalese).

[btq96r]

I remember scanning this thread a bit ago, so seeing this article made me want to post it for others to read and think about.  I think it's quite well done, and goes into appropriate depth considering that Politico's audience isn't as attuned to gun issues as we are. 

"The NRA Would Like to Insure You Now"

http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2017/05/27/the-nra-would-like-to-insure-you-now-215196

 

I can't escape the line of thought that Carry Guard is the NRA diversifying revenue streams for their own financial well being.  Membership pushes and cash drives will be lackluster with President Trump and a Republican Congress in power.  So, with that, I'd look at Carry Guard as I would any other insurance product...designed to collect money and pay out as little as possible if/when claims are submitted.  YMMV.

[chances R]

It looks like NRA insurance is based on reimbursement.  Seems a little like a conflict of interest for them to work their butt off to have you acquitted, ie. it costs them money at that point.  Plus a good attorney initially paid and on your side from the start may actually keep charges from being filed.  My understanding is that USCCA is there from the start with the cash for bail and retainers.