Brit on his way to TN

[lee wilson]

Hi All

The UK is driving me crazy, I want to live in a country where the majority of people speak English (unlike England!).  So planning on getting properly 'Off-Grid' in TN.  Before applying for Citizenship I want to spend some time in TN to make sure it's the right move.  Only thing I wont have initially is a SSN (and here is where I am looking to you guys for anything I may have missed so feel free to throw rocks at this plan).  I can buy or rent in TN without citizenship as long as I pay cash, having a TN residence allows me to get a TN drivers licence and register a vehicle.  This is enough proof of residence to get a TN resident hunting permit which in turn allows me to purchase a firearm without being a US Citizen (as far as I can tell, being ex-military from another country counts for nothing).  The only thing I'm likely to get screwed on is truck/bike/RV insurance without an SSN.  Does this sound about right??  Look forward to hearing from you.  I'm aware of the time limitations on visas so lets avoid that as a topic pls.

[BrasilNuts]

As long as you can produce one of the following documents, you should be good to go.

 

Acceptable Documents for Lawful Permanent Resident Status

• Permanent Resident Alien Card (I-551)
• Foreign passport stamped by the U.S. Government indicating that the holder has been "Processed for I-551"
• Permanent resident Re-entry Permit (I-327)
• Arrival Departure Form I-94 with “Temporary I-551” stamp and holder’s photograph affixed
• Travel Document issued to Permanent Residents (I-327)
• Travel Document issued to Refugees (I-571)
• Form I-94 stamped  with one of the following statuses:  Asylee, Parolee or Parole, Refugee, Asylum, HP-humanitarian parolee or PIP-public interest parolee

- See more at: http://www.tn.gov/safety/article/dlcitizen#sthash.PIVI3UsS.dpuf

[peejman]

I doubt you need to pay cash to buy or rent. I'd presume you'd set up a local bank account where you end up and can pay for stuff just like anyone else.

Having a hunting license has nothing to do with buying firearms.  

A friend of mine is from England. We call him "the angry Englishman"    He's got a resident alien card and has quite the firearm collection. His purchases typically take a couple days to go through, but otherwise no issues. 

[lee wilson]

That's kinda the point - when I first arrive I'll be on a visa (I-94) WITHOUT permanent US residency or I-51 and so the ATF (regardless of State) says "An alien admitted to the United States under a non-immigrant visa is prohibited from shipping, transporting, receiving, or possessing a firearm or ammunition unless the alien falls within one of the exceptions provided in 18 U.S.C. 922(y)(2), such as: a valid hunting license or permit, admitted for lawful hunting or sporting purposes" which is why I was going through the hoops to show residency in TN which qualifies me for a TN residential hunting permit which in turn satisfies the law around non-immigrants purchasing firearms whilst not technically being a US permanent resident!!  The whole reason for the screwing about is that I have no family in the US to sponsor me and I have no plans on working (early retirement) so no business sponsor so no way to apply for a green-card in advance so need to be there and then apply for a change in visa.

[KahrMan]

The law you quoted says nothing about purchasing a firearm.  It is about possessing one.  Under that law someone can loan a firearm if you are going to hunt with it but it does not say anything about purchasing.

Maybe @robtattoo or @Oh Shoot can supply a little more info that might help you.

 

Oh and welcome to TGO.

[Oh Shoot]

1 hour ago, KahrMan said:

The law you quoted says nothing about purchasing a firearm.  It is about possessing one.  Under that law someone can loan a firearm if you are going to hunt with it but it does not say anything about purchasing

In Federal-ese, you "receive" one by purchasing, gifting, inheritance, or loan. If you are a prohibited person, you cannot "receive" one via any of those methods.

4 hours ago, peejman said:

Having a hunting license has nothing to do with buying firearms.  

Purt sure it does indeed in Lee's case. Look at a 4473, questions 12.d.1 and 12.d.2.  There's the exact situation he speaks about.

Quote

A friend of mine is from England. We call him "the angry Englishman"    He's got a resident alien card and has quite the firearm collection. His purchases typically take a couple days to go through, but otherwise no issues. 

"Resident alien" is permanent resident, yes? Unlike Lee's situation. Permanent resident can even get an HCP.

 

Lee, I honestly don't know if the average Federal Firearms Dealer handles this sort of thing enough to sell you a firearm, but certainly if you check that you are here on a NonImmigrant visa, and then check that you fall into a category of exception and present your hunting license, as I understand things, then he should, and again AFAIK the background check would be approved.

In a free state like TN we may legally buy/sell firearms between TN state residents in private transactions. The only proviso is that of federal law whereby you must not "know" or "have reasonable cause to believe", that the other person is ineligible to possess firearms, and TN proviso that the recipient is not a minor.

Now here's the ironic part. Assuming you have a TN driver's license, that's about all most sellers will require to see for a sale, and many won't even ask that. If you go into explanation all about how you're not a permanent resident but having a TN hunting license makes you legal and etc,  most will probably back out of the sale, even though you are explaining why it really is lawful!

- OS

Edited February 21, 2017 by Oh Shoot

[Oh Shoot]

Oh, just realized this is in New Member forum.

If you want more folks to probably see it and interact, ask a Mod to move it to main forum somewhere, since it's already off to a good start, rather than just re-posting.

Send a message to MacGyver

 

 

 

Edited February 21, 2017 by Oh Shoot

[Dolomite_supafly]

I will move it down into general to get more eyes on it.

At the bottom of the 4473 it asks if you are a resident alien so I cannot think of any dealer not catching that part unless the purchaser lied on the form.

BTW, my wife is a "resident alien". She carries a gun and has bought a bunch a few. She has had several dealers refuse to sell to her because they thought she needed to be a citizen. After we explained she didn't need to be they let her make a purchase but only after a call to someone else to try to figure out their role. But most dealers she has dealt with eventually figured it out and sold her a gun. I would avoid big box retailers like Walmart because the people that work there don't want to put in the effort and will refuse in a heartbeat if they think their job is about to get harder.

I think the biggest obstacle is getting your stay here classified as a permanent and not a temporary one. I don't think you can buy any firearms while here on a "visitors" visas.

[Handsome Rob]

Howdy from another English expat. A 'non-immigrant alien' actually.

Ok, couple of things.  Firstly, apply for an SSN the minute you arrive, seriously, use airport wi-fi. If you're applying for a visa, you can actually apply for an SSN from the UK.

1. What type of visa are you moving on? Depending on the visa type, you may or may not be eligible for permanent residency.

2. What's your education level? If it's any less than a Higher Degree, permanent resident status is going to be nearly impossible to achieve. There are exceptions for artists but very stringent criteria must be met.

3. Are you married to a U.S.citizen? If not, find one, pronto. It's almost impossible to permanently emigrate to the U.S. unless you have immediate family here or are married to a Citizen.

4. If you're coming on an investment visa, you can apply for a SSN as soon as you arrive. (It was worth repeating)

5. If you don't have an SSN, forget about cell phones, insurance, cable tv etc. You absolutely NEED one to buy anything,  other than groceries, from a store.

6. No SSN, no hunting license. Or bank account. Or drivers license. Or cell phone, cable tv etc.... basically you NEED a SSN.

I'm honestly not trying to put you off, the U.S. IS the greatest country in the world to live, but it's nowhere near as simple as any of the 'Emigrate NOW!' websites would have you believe. It took my Wife  I the better part of 2 years (& many thousands of pounds, never mind the HUNDREDS of thousands we had to spend to buy a business.....) to get here on a 3 year visa & then several thousands more to renew to a 5 year. That was 10 years ago & I'm looking into an extension right now. 8 years & several immigration lawyers later & we still haven't found a feasible route to permanent status.

Also, if you're just wanting to visit & get a feel for the place, you don't need a visa. The UK is part of the Visa Waiver Programme, meaning that you can stay a full 90 days on an I94. It's not long enough to establish temporary residence in any state (90 days MINIMUM) but it'll let you get an idea of what you're in for. It can also give you a head start on residency if you're already in the visa application process, although you will have to leave to return to the Embassy in London. When you obtain a visa, you'll still have to periodically renew your I 94 as that is only valid for a maximum of 2 years as a visa holder. Plan on traveling to Mexico/Canada every other year. It's the cheapest & simplest way to renew....

 

Ps. Sorry for all the edits, I keep thinking of stuff!

Edited February 21, 2017 by robtattoo

[Handsome Rob]

If you haven't already, go get an appointment with a good immigration lawyer in England. It'll cost a bob or two, but it could save you a fortune. They'll be able to tell you all your options (If indeed there are any) & give you far better info than I can. Every case is different & without knowing your particulars, no-one will be able to give you 100% solid advice.

[E4 No More]

Don't the Brits have a long standing history of claiming that we do not speak English either?

[Handsome Rob]

Only because you don't.....

[Capbyrd]

1 hour ago, SWJewellTN said:

Don't the Brits have a long standing history of claiming that we do not speak English either?

 

 

[Capbyrd]

I'm really happy to welcome another immigrant and especially to our state, but wow Rob makes it sound as though it isn't worth the hassle.    Sounds rough!  

Plus you're going to lose all those great panel and comedy shows like Last Leg, 8 Out of 10 Cats, QI, Would I Lie to You, anything with Richard Ayoade, etc.  I could only watch that stuff for entertainment and never fail to be amused.  

[gregintenn]

Welcome to Tennessee, and to the forum here.

[Handsome Rob]

I'm really happy to welcome another immigrant and especially to our state, but wow Rob makes it sound as though it isn't worth the hassle.    Sounds rough!  

Plus you're going to lose all those great panel and comedy shows like Last Leg, 8 Out of 10 Cats, QI, Would I Lie to You, anything with Richard Ayoade, etc.  I could only watch that stuff for entertainment and never fail to be amused.  

Oh, it's absolutely worth the hassle!!
It's just not as straightforward, cut & dried as a lot of 'Move Abroad NOW!' websites would have you believe.

Sent from a mountain somewhere, using telepathy.

[Oh Shoot]

5 hours ago, Dolomite_supafly said:

...

At the bottom of the 4473 it asks if you are a resident alien so I cannot think of any dealer not catching that part unless the purchaser lied on the form.

specifically, it asks:

   12.a. Country of Citizenship:

   12.c. Are you an alien illegally or unlawfully in the United States?

12.d.1. Are you an alien who has been admitted to the United States under a nonimmigrant visa?

    12.d.2. If "yes", do you fall within any of the exceptions stated in the instructions?

13. If you are an alien, record your U.S.-Issued Alien or Admission number (AR#, USCIS#, or I94#)

 

Question 12.d. Immigration Status:

An alien admitted to the United States under

a nonimmigrant visa includes, among others, persons visiting the United States

temporarily for business or pleasure, persons studying in the United States who

maintain a residence abroad, and certain temporary foreign workers. These aliens

must answer "yes" to this question and provide the additional documentation

required under question 18.c. Permanent resident aliens and aliens legally admitted

to the United States pursuant to either the Visa Waiver Program or to regulations

otherwise exempting them from visa requirements may answer "no" to this question

and are not required to submit the additional documentation under question 18.c.

 

Question 13. U.S.-issued Alien Number or Admission Number:

U.S.-issued alien and admission numbers may be found on the following U.S. Department of

Homeland Security documents: Legal Resident Card or Employment Authorization

Card (AR# or USCIS#); Arrival/Departure Record, Form I94, or Form 797A (I94#).

Additional information can be obtained from www.cbp.gov. If you are a U.S.

citizen or U.S. national then this question should be left blank.

 

 

Edited February 21, 2017 by Oh Shoot

[Handsome Rob]

14 hours ago, lee wilson said:

That's kinda the point - when I first arrive I'll be on a visa (I-94) WITHOUT permanent US residency or I-51 and so the ATF (regardless of State) says "An alien admitted to the United States under a non-immigrant visa is prohibited from shipping, transporting, receiving, or possessing a firearm or ammunition unless the alien falls within one of the exceptions provided in 18 U.S.C. 922(y)(2), such as: a valid hunting license or permit, admitted for lawful hunting or sporting purposes" which is why I was going through the hoops to show residency in TN which qualifies me for a TN residential hunting permit which in turn satisfies the law around non-immigrants purchasing firearms whilst not technically being a US permanent resident!!  The whole reason for the screwing about is that I have no family in the US to sponsor me and I have no plans on working (early retirement) so no business sponsor so no way to apply for a green-card in advance so need to be there and then apply for a change in visa.

I just re read this.

Do you won't actually be here on a visa, just the I 94.

That's a problem. To get a driver's license you'll first need an SSN & you'll have to show proof of lawful residency in the state, for a period spanning no less than 90 days. Basically, you'll have to present 3 month's worth of utility bills, under your name, with a Tennessee address. 

The I 94 is issued to all foreign travelers within the U.S. & is not a visa. You would have to apply for a visa to be able to stay longer than 90 days & with no family here & no work sponsor that's pretty much not going to happen.

I'm sorry to say it, but unless you marry a Citizen, you have no recourse to move to the U.S. (unless you have a Doctorate/Phd & are prepared to use it or are prepared to sink $500,000+ into a business you're prepared to run)

[Oh Shoot]

6 minutes ago, robtattoo said:

....

That's a problem. To get a driver's license you'll first need an SSN & you'll have to show proof of lawful residency in the state, for a period spanning no less than 90 days. Basically, you'll have to present 3 month's worth of utility bills, under your name, with a Tennessee address.

Looks like SSN isn't necessarily required?

"A Social Security Number or sworn affidavit if no Social Security number has been issued."

http://www.tn.gov/safety/section/dlmain

Here is sworn affidavit:

http://www.tn.gov/assets/entities/safety/attachments/ssnaffidavit.pdf

Also, I see nothing about the "90 days" worth of documentation to establish residency? Everything just says "current" utility bill, "current" bank statement, "current" lease/mortage, etc.

http://www.tn.gov/safety/article/dlproof

- OS

 

[Handsome Rob]

That is correct, as worded, but you absolutely will not be issued a license without 90 days worth of current proof.

 

All that aside, the unfortunate fact  is that you can't just move to the U.S. & apply for permanent residence or Citizenship 'Because I Want To' You need to show positive proof that you are needed here, in some capacity. Either through investment or profession. I've spent the last 10 years trying to figure a way around that, but to be legal, it's simply not possible if you're from the UK. Country of Origin plays a massive role in this.

[Handsome Rob]

The 90 day thing 'may' have changed, but in '09 it was required. It is (or, was) 90 days so that visitors on simple I94 entry permits (everyone that comes here from a foreign country) couldn't simply get a license & disappear. Proof of residence or proof of Intention to Immigrate was required.

[Capbyrd]

25 minutes ago, robtattoo said:

Either through investment or profession. 

 

 

They just want your money!  And if you are retiring and won't be earning an income, the FEDS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! won't be able to tax the piss out of your earnings. 

[Chucktshoes]

It sounds like the website with a solution to his problem is Match.com. 

[Handsome Rob]

3 minutes ago, Chucktshoes said:

It sounds like the website with a solution to his problem is Match.com. 

[Chucktshoes]

I'm only half joking. Let's be honest, early retirement says to me that Lee is of a reasonably young age (40s-50s) and has some means. Throw in an English accent and finding a wife (even one who is flexible on the vows of fidelity if that's one's desire) shouldn't be much problem at all.