Fukushima?

[GlockSpock]

So, Fukushima just piqued my interested as of recent. Been reading some updated articles regarding the whole mess. There seem to be two sides of the entire argument:

1) Fukushima isn't and wasn't nearly as bad as Chernobyl. Long term effects will be minimal.

2) Fukushima was and is the greatest disaster in the history of known mankind. In time we will see unforeseen effects on the earth and its inhabitants. The governments and agencies of the world are of course covering this up.

I don't know where I stand. Maybe somewhere in the middle. On one hand the pollution and contamination (worldwide and local to Japan) can be measured by countless independent scientists/people. On the other hand, effects affecting the food chain could take years to fully realize.

On one hand you have a vast number of alarmists who are claiming that the ocean/s are dying at at alarming and unforeseen rate. Others simply claim some of this is due to El Nino and other related factors.

Some claim some of the fuel rods were completely vaporized and released into the atmosphere and anyone denying this is claimed to be lying. The reverse angle is that no, it is proven they did not vaporize and what is being cited as proof for them vaporizing was simply a worst case scenario written shortly after the earthquake which was prevented and did not happen.

 

Like many things, some of this stuff is tough to dig through and decide on. I figured many here probably have been doing research much longer than I. Thoughts?

[GlockSpock]

Thought this was relevant:

 

http://radwatch.berkeley.edu/FAQ

[xsubsailor]

Somewhat related:

 

Scientists discover pollution 10,000 meters below the ocean’s surface in the Mariana Trench

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/energy-environment/wp/2017/02/13/not-even-the-worlds-deepest-ocean-trenches-are-free-of-pollution-scientists-discover/

[peejman]

Being nuclear plant failures is about all they have in common. Chernobyl exploded and threw all its contaminants airborne. Fukushima dumped most of it into the ocean. 

If you want to know what irradiating the ocean looks like, go look at the Barents Sea north of Murmansk. That's where the Russians dumped all their failed naval nuclear reactor vessels. It's not especially deep there. If you stood a missile sub on end, it might poke 50-100ft out of the water. 

[GlockSpock]

Being nuclear plant failures is about all they have in common. Chernobyl exploded and threw all its contaminants airborne. Fukushima dumped most of it into the ocean. 
If you want to know what irradiating the ocean looks like, go look at the Barents Sea north of Murmansk. That's where the Russians dumped all their failed naval nuclear reactor vessels. It's not especially deep there. If you stood a missile sub on end, it might poke 50-100ft out of the water. 

Fascinating. Looks like some already poke out of the water laying horizontally.

[peejman]

5 hours ago, CZ9MM said:

 

Fascinating. Looks like some already poke out of the water laying horizontally.

 

This is a pretty good book about the early soviet nuclear navy. The movie is basically one chapter in the book. 

https://www.amazon.com/K-19-WIDOWMAKER-Secret-Nuclear-Submarine/dp/079226472X

This is a pretty good one too. 

https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/1891620088/ref=mp_s_a_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1487120350&sr=8-1&pi=AC_SX236_SY340_QL65&keywords=blind+mans+bluff&dpPl=1&dpID=51nYicn7iKL&ref=plSrch

 

Fukushima made one major error, which was not putting their generators on the roof. 

[GlockSpock]

18 hours ago, peejman said:

This is a pretty good book about the early soviet nuclear navy. The movie is basically one chapter in the book. 

https://www.amazon.com/K-19-WIDOWMAKER-Secret-Nuclear-Submarine/dp/079226472X

This is a pretty good one too. 

https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/1891620088/ref=mp_s_a_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1487120350&sr=8-1&pi=AC_SX236_SY340_QL65&keywords=blind+mans+bluff&dpPl=1&dpID=51nYicn7iKL&ref=plSrch

 

Fukushima made one major error, which was not putting their generators on the roof. 

I think I've seen that movie before or one similar. I wouldn't have been able to recognize it from the name but the description sounds very familiar.

[conn_air7]

I personally feel like Astana has something to do with the deterioration of our ecosystem.


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[ReeferMac]

While I'm not a nuclear scientist by any stretch, I'm firmly in the 'worst-ever' category. It's going to completely phuk up the pacific ocean IMO. Don't eat any fish.

[GlockSpock]

I personally feel like Astana has something to do with the deterioration of our ecosystem.


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Can't believe the thought never crossed my mind.

[R_Bert]

18 hours ago, conn_air7 said:

I personally feel like Astana has something to do with the deterioration of our ecosystem.

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Astana does not hold a candle to the Mayak complex.   Not even orders of magnitude close. 

(Our group had a $70M contract on Astana 10 - 15 years ago)
 

Edited February 17, 2017 by R_Bert

[GlockSpock]

Astana does not hold a candle to the Mayak complex.   Not even orders of magnitude close. 
(Our group had a $70M contract on Astana 10 - 15 years ago)
 

This is what was referenced.

https://www.tngunowners.com/forums/topic/97624-astana/


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[buck1032]

I had no idea what astana was referencing

[R_Bert]

5 hours ago, CZ9MM said:

 

 

This is what was referenced.

https://www.tngunowners.com/forums/topic/97624-astana/


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Heh.  OK then.  Nevermind. The "individual" you encountered would be astounded by Astana, and downright petrified by the rest of the Russian legacies.  As for NWO...   Astana is too damned cold to be HQ.

[ReeferMac]

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-02-19/fukushima-aborts-latest-robot-mission-inside-reactor-radiation-unimaginable-levels

 

TEPCO officials have aborted their latest robot mission inside the Fukushima reactor after the 'scorpion' became unresponsive as it investigated the previously discovered hole where the core is believed to have melted.

 

Whelp, we know where the stuff went, it's just SO hot down there we can't even look at it! The darned robot b0rks out from all the radiation. WOW!

 

- K

 

[GlockSpock]

Being nuclear plant failures is about all they have in common. Chernobyl exploded and threw all its contaminants airborne. Fukushima dumped most of it into the ocean. 
If you want to know what irradiating the ocean looks like, go look at the Barents Sea north of Murmansk. That's where the Russians dumped all their failed naval nuclear reactor vessels. It's not especially deep there. If you stood a missile sub on end, it might poke 50-100ft out of the water. 

This is a pretty good book about the early soviet nuclear navy. The movie is basically one chapter in the book. 
https://www.amazon.com/K-19-WIDOWMAKER-Secret-Nuclear-Submarine/dp/079226472X
This is a pretty good one too. 
https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/1891620088/ref=mp_s_a_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1487120350&sr=8-1&pi=AC_SX236_SY340_QL65&keywords=blind+mans+bluff&dpPl=1&dpID=51nYicn7iKL&ref=plSrch
 
Fukushima made one major error, which was not putting their generators on the roof. 

So what exactly is your opinion regarding Fukushima in terms of severity? Twice you referenced the soviet navy, perhaps insinuating that Fukushima isn't as bad as some things gone wrong in the past.

Something that strikes me as interesting is that there are many claiming that the main isotopes released have relatively short half-lives, as in measured in weeks. Thoughts?

The half-life's of things such as this is easy to find, what's difficult/impossible is theoretically determining which ones were being used and were therefore released.

[GlockSpock]

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-02-19/fukushima-aborts-latest-robot-mission-inside-reactor-radiation-unimaginable-levels
 
TEPCO officials have aborted their latest robot mission inside the Fukushima reactor after the 'scorpion' became unresponsive as it investigated the previously discovered hole where the core is believed to have melted.
 
Whelp, we know where the stuff went, it's just SO hot down there we can't even look at it! The darned robot b0rks out from all the radiation. WOW!
 
- K
 

The comments there are optimistic. Only, not so.

Quickly turns into Agenda 21, conspiracy, etc talk.

[GlockSpock]

Ok, here is something many here can comment on.

I'm relatively young and wasn't even alive yet when Chernobyl happened. Now, it was a different time and the internet was barely existent, but was there as much "OMG THE SKY IS FALLING" over Chernobyl as there seems to be for Fukushima?

There seems to be a lot of hysteria right now in certain corners, I'm merely trying to form my own opinion on whether the hysteria is warranted.


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[R_Bert]

Killing robots on a core is not unusual.

[R_Bert]

17 minutes ago, CZ9MM said:

Ok, here is something many here can comment on.

I'm relatively young and wasn't even alive yet when Chernobyl happened. Now, it was a different time and the internet was barely existent, but was there as much "OMG THE SKY IS FALLING" over Chernobyl as there seems to be for Fukushima?

There seems to be a lot of hysteria right now in certain corners, I'm merely trying to form my own opinion on whether the hysteria is warranted.


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No.  I worked in a health physics instrument calibration lab at the time, and it was of great interest to us. It was in the media for a while, and *closely* followed by HPs for most of a decade, but not anything like current situation. (It took a week or more for the plume to arrive in Europe, and several more weeks to "blow up", then media died down in a year or so.)

 

 

Edited February 20, 2017 by R_Bert

[GlockSpock]

Interesting article.

 

http://www.popularmechanics.com/science/energy/a19871/fukushima-five-years-later/

 

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[GlockSpock]

Something else that is interesting to think about in my opinion is the number of nuclear tests, primarily by ours truly as well as the USSR. One would think the totality of those tests would have been much more than Fukushima.


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[aldodds3]

Ok, here is something many here can comment on.

I'm relatively young and wasn't even alive yet when Chernobyl happened. Now, it was a different time and the internet was barely existent, but was there as much "OMG THE SKY IS FALLING" over Chernobyl as there seems to be for Fukushima?

There seems to be a lot of hysteria right now in certain corners, I'm merely trying to form my own opinion on whether the hysteria is warranted.


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Great question. There was a huge amount of concern and fear. The USSR was in its dying days and getting reliable info was slow and tedious. Also the internet was practically a non-factor and we did not have a bunch of "truthers" making stuff up from day 1 and posting it. I'd say fewer people were scared. Also fewer people were aware of what really went down.

I have been to both sites as part of my civilian nuclear power career to study lessons learned.


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[aldodds3]

Something else that is interesting to think about in my opinion is the number of nuclear tests, primarily by ours truly as well as the USSR. One would think the totality of those tests would have been much more than Fukushima.


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As far as radioactive content discharged to the environment? Fukushima is a small fraction of what the world's military has released. Of course it has been spread out chronologically and geographically.


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[GlockSpock]

As far as radioactive content discharged to the environment? Fukushima is a small fraction of what the world's military has released. Of course it has been spread out chronologically and geographically.


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Exactly. This was mainly a response to the "Fukushima is going to render the entire northern hemisphere uninhabitable" crowd.