TN Lost Reciprocity With Washington State

[300winmag]

You can look on handgunlaw.us and see that we just lost reciprocity with Washington State due to the whole 18-20 year old military now able to get handgun carry permits.  I know we also just lost reciprocity with Minnesota. 

Looks like you'll need to get a non resident Washington permit if you want to carry concealed there or possibly a non resident Utah permit that is also honored by Washington.  You can open carry in Washington without a permit but I don't think that includes carrying a handgun loaded in a vehicle.

[Chucktshoes]

That's #2. My prediction is that we will go from one of the most widely honored to one of the least by the end of the year. Time to start looking at UT and FL non-resident permits. 

[Rightwinger]

1 hour ago, Chucktshoes said:

That's #2. My prediction is that we will go from one of the most widely honored to one of the least by the end of the year. Time to start looking at UT and FL non-resident permits. 

Or........just stay here and not worry about it.  I lost all urge to travel outside the immediate area years ago.  To many people out there.

[Erik88]

2 hours ago, Rightwinger said:

Or........just stay here and not worry about it.  I lost all urge to travel outside the immediate area years ago.  To many people out there.

Dude I'm sorry but that's a pretty depressing outlook. I love TN but traveling is fun. It would be a pretty boring life if I never left "my immediate area". I understand if you don't want to but for many of us, losing reciprocity is a big deal.

[Erik88]

3 hours ago, Chucktshoes said:

That's #2. My prediction is that we will go from one of the most widely honored to one of the least by the end of the year. Time to start looking at UT and FL non-resident permits. 

I still have my FL permit but it's no good in WA or MN so I'm really not sure it helps me at all. I'm going to keep it just in case we ever move back or get a 2nd house there. I don't think you would gain anything by having a FL permit unless we lost reciprocity with more states. Even then there are several states that don't honor non-resident permits. 

[chances R]

Well IMO this just sucks.  Need to change the law back to the way it was.  The Castle Doctrine applying to vehicle carry was enough for that age group.  If that age group needs to carry on a military installation the commander can take care of that.

Edited January 8, 2017 by chances R

[GlockSpock]

It's a pity what a mess this is. I love as much reciprocity as possible. I also see that the 18-20 year old military thing was meant as a positive thing. Selfishly though I wish it hadn't have happened.

Also too bad other states cannot simply state that they will honor TN permits for those 21 or older.

I too feel the states will drop like flies soon in terms of reciprocity with TN.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Chucktshoes]

7 hours ago, Rightwinger said:

Or........just stay here and not worry about it.  I lost all urge to travel outside the immediate area years ago.  To many people out there.

As an OTR truck driver that's a luxury I can't afford. Travel isn't a choice for me, it is how I provide for my family and reciprocity is a matter of vital concern for me. 

[quickbiscuit]

Why wasn't this intercepted before it passed?  Did TFA/John Harris support this bill?  I don't know the laws of every state, but I'm assuming that there are not many other states that allow the 18-20 y/o military exception.

This is why we should be content with leaving our gun laws alone.  Maybe this introduced with good intentions, but it wasn't looked at from all angles.

[Chucktshoes]

4 hours ago, Erik88 said:

I still have my FL permit but it's no good in WA or MN so I'm really not sure it helps me at all. I'm going to keep it just in case we ever move back or get a 2nd house there. I don't think you would gain anything by having a FL permit unless we lost reciprocity with more states. Even then there are several states that don't honor non-resident permits. 

Just wait. Just wait. 

[Rightwinger]

5 hours ago, Erik88 said:

Dude I'm sorry but that's a pretty depressing outlook. I love TN but traveling is fun. It would be a pretty boring life if I never left "my immediate area". I understand if you don't want to but for many of us, losing reciprocity is a big deal.

Why?  I traveled some early in life, been to Korea and Central America with the military.  I no longer have a need to "GO" see something outside my state.  We have mountains (when they're not on fire) and the big river and nice areas to shoot here.  Heck I don't even like dealing with traffic and security going to Nashville.  No, you can go, I no longer have the desire.  All my needs can be met right here in Tennessee and I'm happy at home or my cabin.

[300winmag]

Some folks do have to travel for work or family and the reciprocity does come in handy.  Others do take vacations all around the country.  The US is a big country and there is a lot to see all across our land. 

People can say not to go visit places, like California, that do not honor TN permits but you might miss out on seeing a lot.  At least you can keep a pistol in the trunk of your car in California and Washington for your hotel room.  Some of the Mid Atlantic and Northeast states aren't quite that good when it comes to people who have handguns without permits.  New York and MA come to mind where you can't even possess a handgun without a permit.

I do know some states do let all 18 year olds get pistol licenses, such as Alabama.  I'm pretty sure Mississippi lets military 18-20 year olds get licenses as does Texas.

I personally think we have more to lose than to gain by having a small group of 18-20 year olds get permits.  If we're going to lose reciprocity, might as well let all 18 year olds get a permit. 

Edited January 8, 2017 by 300winmag

[JohnC]

I'm waiting to be covered under LEOSA (§ 926B) after I get vested under TCA 39-17-1350 and I won't have to worry about this silly mess anymore. 

http://law.justia.com/codes/tennessee/2010/title-39/chapter-17/part-13/39-17-1350

https://www.nraila.org/articles/20140511/hr-218-law-enforcement-officers-safety-act

 

[bud]

.

Edited April 26, 2017 by bud

[Danger Rane]

12 hours ago, Rightwinger said:

Or........just stay here and not worry about it.  I lost all urge to travel outside the immediate area years ago.  To many people out there.

Excuse me for saying, but that's a pretty short sided way to look at this.....it's not like you are talking about not going somewhere blatantly hostile like Afghanistan, or even outside the country. A lot of people have work that takes them outside the great state of TN on a weekly basis, do you recommend they just get different jobs?

I have a son in WA that I visit 6-8 times a year, so this will be directly effecting me, and it's not like I can (or would) say "sorry son I can't come see you anymore, too many people out there and no more reciprocity".

I honestly did not expect that this would actually pass here, as it just doesn't pass the common sense test. I've seen it come up in other places as a feel good thing to talk about...."our youngsters are old enough to take a bullet for the cause but not old enough to drink or carry a gun" but that's usually all it is, feel good talk. 

To think that just because an 18-20 year old is in the military he has been touched by the maturity fairy is lunacy. Add in the "snowflake" effect plaguing our youth and it's even more alarming. He might have more firearms training then some kids his age, but outside a few select military occupations it certainly won't be with a handgun.

I'm sure there are plenty of TGO members that have raised their kids with proper firearms training and the appropriate mindset toward the use of firearms...but that is surprisingly not the case with many kids going into the service nowadays. You would be amazed at the number that have never handled firearms prior to their military service, and the time spent on marksmanship is an absolute joke for the majority of military occupations. 

I say all this having once been one of those young, dumb, and full of you know what youngsters and having spent several years as an NCO leading/nurturing a bunch of them. This was definitely a feel good measure that benefits very few and will negatively effect many. Good job looking at the big picture TN Leadership. 

[Rightwinger]

6 hours ago, Danger Rane said:

Excuse me for saying, but that's a pretty short sided way to look at this.....it's not like you are talking about not going somewhere blatantly hostile like Afghanistan, or even outside the country. A lot of people have work that takes them outside the great state of TN on a weekly basis, do you recommend they just get different jobs?

Actually yes, yes I do recommend they get different jobs if they wish to travel and/or must have a firearm.  If not then you follow the rules wherever your traveling to and through)  If your son lived in New York, Chicago, DC would you still care so much or would you just suck it up and go without a firearm?  I see no difference.  If Tennessee ever changes over to a no gun state, yep I'll change jobs and move. 

[chances R]

Rightwinger, with your way of thinking, if you simply stay on your 'compound' why even mess with a state HCP anyway?  You are perfectly legal on your own property and never have to venture out of your back yard.

[Rightwinger]

Thought I was pretty clear with my reference to the mountains to the Mississippi that what I am is an advocate of STATES rights.  Do I travel much anymore, no.  But if you want to see the Grand Canyon or the Empire State building, you must be prepared for what those states have decreed.  Would I like a national carry, sure, but not at the cost of each states rights.  That means if I or you wants to travel, take into account what the current rules are. 

I have no issue with TN granting carry privileges to ALL active duty military.  Will that make them all mature enough to handle the responsibility, no, but then I have noted some folks on this site that are obviously in their 40's or 50's that haven't shown the maturity of what some of those 18 year olds do.  If your on active duty, you have stated your willing to give your life for the country.  The least they can do is show that at least in TN, we honor that enough to grant you the title of being an adult.

 

Compound?  Come on Chance, don't be an MSNBC word twister man.

Edited January 8, 2017 by Rightwinger

[mikegideon]

1 hour ago, Rightwinger said:

Thought I was pretty clear with my reference to the mountains to the Mississippi that what I am is an advocate of STATES rights.  Do I travel much anymore, no.  But if you want to see the Grand Canyon or the Empire State building, you must be prepared for what those states have decreed.  Would I like a national carry, sure, but not at the cost of each states rights.  That means if I or you wants to travel, take into account what the current rules are. 

I have no issue with TN granting carry privileges to ALL active duty military.  Will that make them all mature enough to handle the responsibility, no, but then I have noted some folks on this site that are obviously in their 40's or 50's that haven't shown the maturity of what some of those 18 year olds do.  If your on active duty, you have stated your willing to give your life for the country.  The least they can do is show that at least in TN, we honor that enough to grant you the title of being an adult.

 

Compound?  Come on Chance, don't be an MSNBC word twister man.

Sure... one negligent discharge while I was cow tippin', and you call me immature. Strict!

[Rightwinger]

Mike, you don't qualify as you don't have an age as far as we can tell.

And we don't let you out of the state on general principle.

[300winmag]

I am surprised that this 18-20 year old military provision is even legal for giving permits to a select few while excluding the vast majority of 18-20 year olds because they are non military.  If we are going to lose reciprocity with several states over giving permits to people under 21, we might as well just let all 18-20 year olds get a permit.  That is much more fair.  If the politicians are afraid of under 21 permits, then just don't issue them and let us keep the good reciprocity we had. 

I would think if some 19 year old non military wanted to push the issue of TN not giving him a permit but giving a military 19 year a permit, he might have a pretty strong case.  It would be no different than TN saying that someone who is 19 in the military can buy alcohol (away from the bases at civilian liquor stores) and someone 19 and non military cannot buy alcohol. 

[PC7]

We just lost two states in a matter of weeks....great, just great. As others have said, I'm sure many others states will follow.

What other states allow under 21 to get permits to carry? I guess that is the only states we will have reciprocity with when it is all said and done. 

Time to write your representatives folks, they are in session now.

Maybe we can fix this. 

[300winmag]

I bet that under 21 military carry permit law won't be reversed unless it is in court over equal protection.  It helped some folks earn NRA brownie points in an election year without doing anything of substance.  If the legislature tried to reverse that law, then that would appear anti gun.  The politician's excuse for losing reciprocity with Washington and Minnesota will be "Well those are states that went for Obama and Clinton, so they are anti gun and they cut reciprocity".  People will believe it if they are told that just like the silly "No gun sign liability" bill that was passed last year. 

When those guys pass some bills like college or school carry for folks with permits, cutting the 'no gun' signs criminal charge, and this is a stretch no permits needed for concealing, then that might actually amount to being 'pro gun'.

[Oh Shoot]

57 minutes ago, 300winmag said:

.... The politician's excuse for losing reciprocity with Washington and Minnesota will be "Well those are states that went for Obama and Clinton, so they are anti gun and they cut reciprocity".  ..

What's Virginia's age standard btw? They almost already nuked us once not long ago, are they gonna follow suit?

Loss of VA of course really hurts lots of folks here.

- OS

Edited January 13, 2017 by Oh Shoot

[chances R]

Some states are simply not strong carry states, especially where reciprocity is concerned.  VA may be one that simply looks for an excuse to drop a state.  We have certainly opened ourselves up to scrutiny and loss of stature.  Anyone know of any move afoot for a 'fix' ?