Trump / HPA

[Fourtyfive]

So if Trump can sign in the HPA in his first 60 days will that mean you won't be able to find one in stock for a year or so and the price will drop like crazy by then? Will we be able to make our own? Will those in suppressor jail be released immediately? 

Edited November 12, 2016 by Fourtyfive
Typo

[WarPig]

So many questions unanswered. I looked at a few the other day and thought, "I should ask to put a few on layaway just on the off chance it gets signed and then I can just walk in and pick them up."

But who knows what it would look like. I only have sbrs and a smg in jail right now so it does me no good for release. But I highly doubt the ATF could get their $h!t together to get the form 4s for cans out of their system without royally screwing up all the other stuff in queue.

I also would assume that means you don't have to roll around with your paperwork everywhere you go.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Whisper]

I was discussing this just yesterday with a guy who works at a gun store that sells silencers.  (I won't name the store because I imagine the employee might get in trouble for his candor.)   He said he does not own a silencer himself but has been planning to buy one.  Now that Sauron has been defeated, he says he is going to wait.  His view:  If the Hearing Protection Act becomes law, new silencer manufacturers will appear overnight like dandelions in the spring, and silencers costing $1000 now will cost $200 by summer.

Trump promised a stimulus to American manufacturing.  The HPA would sure help.

Cheers,

Whisper

Edited November 12, 2016 by Whisper

[Fourtyfive]

I believe the HPA says suppressors will be treated the same as long guns.

https://www.congress.gov/bill/114th-congress/house-bill/3799

I smell refund ! 

Edited November 12, 2016 by Fourtyfive

[1gewehr]

Trump or no Trump, it has to pass the House and the Senate first.  If you want it, you should mail a letter to your Congresscritters.

They ignore email, pretend to listen to phone calls, don't even print faxes.  Real mail followed by a phone call works best.

[Whisper]

5 minutes ago, 1gewehr said:

Trump or no Trump, it has to pass the House and the Senate first.  If you want it, you should mail a letter to your Congresscritters.

They ignore email, pretend to listen to phone calls, don't even print faxes.  Real mail followed by a phone call works best.

Agreed.  We should start putting the pressure on now, and keep it on.  Our US reps here in TN will not be changing in January, so we should be in touch with them immediately.

Cheers,

Whisper

[DaveTN]

It’s been in the House Judiciary Subcommittee on Crime, Terrorism, Homeland Security, and Investigations for a year.

I’ve never owned a suppressor because the cost of the suppressor and the costs of ownership are insane.

If they are removed from NFA the costs would fall like rock.

I would like to see it passed, but I doubt it could get the votes.

 

[xsubsailor]

 I believe it's legal to manufacture a weapon for your own use, so if they are treated as a long gun maybe it would also be legal to make your own. If it turns out this way we may also see a lot of "kits" on the market.(Similar to 80% lowers)

[DaveTN]

13 minutes ago, xsubsailor said:

 I believe it's legal to manufacture a weapon for your own use, so if they are treated as a long gun maybe it would also be legal to make your own. If it turns out this way we may also see a lot of "kits" on the market.(Similar to 80% lowers)

If they removed them from NFA it would be legal to make your own unless they specifically banned it. Tennessee says you can make your own, but the Feds say they will arrest you if you do. (The courts have agreed with the Feds)

You can make your own now if you buy the tax stamp.

[Omega]

14 minutes ago, xsubsailor said:

 I believe it's legal to manufacture a weapon for your own use, so if they are treated as a long gun maybe it would also be legal to make your own. If it turns out this way we may also see a lot of "kits" on the market.(Similar to 80% lowers)

In TN it is already legal to make your own, and kits have been available since at least the 80s.  So if the feds make it not illegal you would see almost an immediate drop in price but increase in profit due to sales, win-win.

[nightrunner]

You would see some cheap ones but the guys that are innovating and not using antiquated technology will still be close to current pricing.

Guys like Dead Air, Silencerco, Griffin Armament, etc. would be your innovative guys whereas the guys selling $200 suppressor now are like companies who sell 1911s and ARs. Nothing special about them, they work, but don't have the newest technology.

[DaveTN]

17 minutes ago, nightrunner said:

You would see some cheap ones but the guys that are innovating and not using antiquated technology will still be close to current pricing.

Guys like Dead Air, Silencerco, Griffin Armament, etc. would be your innovative guys whereas the guys selling $200 suppressor now are like companies who sell 1911s and ARs. Nothing special about them, they work, but don't have the newest technology.

I work in manufacturing and I respectfully disagree. Suppressors aren’t rocket science. They can quickly be adapted to changing baffle types and techniques. When you are selling enough to mass produce them in quantities that would eclipse what is being done now, and you can dedicate machines to them; the price would plummet.

At a reasonable price with no paperwork and no ridiculous waiting times they would be selling thousands of times more than they do now.

I’m sure there would still be $800 suppressors; just like there are $3K 1911’s… if you want them.

But the guys that are innovative know that and would be selling $200 suppressors. And the gun manufacturers would have threaded barrels as a standard option. 

[mikegideon]

I would buy suppressors, and pay decent money for them. My holdup is the tax stamp. I refuse to put up with the unreasonable restraints. Just one more thing that needs to go away.

[Omega]

1 hour ago, DaveTN said:

I work in manufacturing and I respectfully disagree. Suppressors aren’t rocket science. They can quickly be adapted to changing baffle types and techniques. When you are selling enough to mass produce them in quantities that would eclipse what is being done now, and you can dedicate machines to them; the price would plummet.

 

At a reasonable price with no paperwork and no ridiculous waiting times they would be selling thousands of times more than they do now.

 

I’m sure there would still be $800 suppressors; just like there are $3K 1911’s… if you want them.

 

But the guys that are innovative know that and would be selling $200 suppressors. And the gun manufacturers would have threaded barrels as a standard option. 

 

My point exactly, currently there are "solvent trap" kits that only run a couple hundred and perform as well or in some cases better than the higher end cans.  With a Form 1, many build their own out of these have been for years.  No, the way ahead for current manufacturers will be in things like integrated silencers, quick disconnects, and conversion of sealed cans and such.

[hipower]

Darn interesting reading here. I'm going to send some letter in hopes of getting a little attention going as well. Like everyone else here, I would love to add a few cans to my stuff. I have a cheap(relatively speaking) that I bought years ago as part of a Ruger package. Took almost 6  months to be able to get the can then. I've wanted to do it again, but just haven't had the spare cash to pony up for the grift.

[Chucktshoes]

1 hour ago, DaveTN said:

I work in manufacturing and I respectfully disagree. Suppressors aren’t rocket science. They can quickly be adapted to changing baffle types and techniques. When you are selling enough to mass produce them in quantities that would eclipse what is being done now, and you can dedicate machines to them; the price would plummet.

 

At a reasonable price with no paperwork and no ridiculous waiting times they would be selling thousands of times more than they do now.

 

I’m sure there would still be $800 suppressors; just like there are $3K 1911’s… if you want them.

 

But the guys that are innovative know that and would be selling $200 suppressors. And the gun manufacturers would have threaded barrels as a standard option. 

 

 

15 minutes ago, mikegideon said:

I would buy suppressors, and pay decent money for them. My holdup is the tax stamp. I refuse to put up with the unreasonable restraints. Just one more thing that needs to go away.

Dave and Mike hit the both sides of the issue here. The NFA suppresses not just ease of acquisition but also the desire to even purchase suppressors in the first place. (The principle of that $200 stamp has kept me from buying.) That keeps the market small, prices high and the innovators out. How many John M. Brownings have been stopped over the last 8 decades or so because of the legal issues around being able to tinker in the garage? The removal of suppressors from the NFA will result in an explosion of demand, innovation and manufacturers. 

[mikegideon]

18 minutes ago, Chucktshoes said:

 

Dave and Mike hit the both sides of the issue here. The NFA suppresses not just ease of acquisition but also the desire to even purchase suppressors in the first place. (The principle of that $200 stamp has kept me from buying.) That keeps the market small, prices high and the innovators out. How many John M. Brownings have been stopped over the last 8 decades or so because of the legal issues around being able to tinker in the garage? The removal of suppressors from the NFA will result in an explosion of demand, innovation and manufacturers. 

I would pay the $200 reluctantly. It's the registration and all the other regulatory bull####, like not being able to carry the gun out of state

 

[Omega]

5 minutes ago, mikegideon said:

I would pay the $200 reluctantly. It's the registration and all the other regulatory bull####, like not being able to carry the gun out of state

 

Oh not me, I refuse to pay it on principle alone, for silencers or SBRs.  The idiocy of the entire GCA bugs me, only the well off can play...BS.  Then they insult us again by authorizing "pistols" and "braces" and telling us use doesn't change a gun into a rifle, but don't shoulder a brace, oh no thats bad. SMH!

[btq96r]

If they're legal (even if a background check is required at purchase), the price should fall fast.  I think the biggest drop in price would be as other large manufacturers get into it.  Imagine how competitive the silencer/suppressor market would get if Daniel Defense, and BCM add full time can production to their offerings.  We'd have a good game on then.

[Oh Shoot]

8 hours ago, Fourtyfive said:

I believe the HPA says suppressors will be treated the same as long guns.

Correct, it doesn't remove silencer classification as "firearm".

- OS

[btq96r]

So...what's the NRA's plan for a legislative push on gun issues like this? 

With a Republican President who they helped "bigly" with that early major endorsement, and a Republican Congress that has to have a lot of members with A ratings...they should be able to get a decent chunk of a wishlist through the next Congress.

[mikegideon]

14 minutes ago, btq96r said:

So...what's the NRA's plan for a legislative push on gun issues like this? 

With a Republican President who they helped "bigly" with that early major endorsement, and a Republican Congress that has to have a lot of members with A ratings...they should be able to get a decent chunk of a wishlist through the next Congress.

I would think that it could easily get lost in the noise. Look at how hard it is to get anything done in TN with Republican control. There are a lot of folks there that are politicians first. Depends on how it get spun. But, you gotta figure that it will be a pretty small percentage of their constituents that care. So, is it worth he capital to them?

Somebody is gonna have to sell it well.

[btq96r]

Just now, mikegideon said:

I would think that it could easily get lost in the noise. Look at how hard it is to get anything done in TN with Republican control. There are a lot of folks there that are politicians first. Depends on how it get spun. But, you gotta figure that it will be a pretty small percentage of their constituents that care. So, is it worth he capital to them?

Somebody is gonna have to sell it well.

NRA members should be the one selling it well.  I get writing/calling/emailing your Congressman, which should be done...but if I was being hounded for money by the NRA, I'd tell them that with a Republican President & Congress, funds are no longer defensive, but will be allocated for what they produce.

In realistic theory, the NRA could have a few major items knocked off the list within a year.  The threat of endorsing primary challengers in the mid-terms should be enough to scare incumbents.

On my end, I fully expect the SAF to get hot on filing suits once Trump's judicial picks settle to the district and appeals courts over time.  There's is the long game, but the NRA has to strike while the iron is hot now.

[Hershmeister]

Flood the zone!
HPA
Hughes amendment gone
Remove "barrel ban"

[mikegideon]

6 minutes ago, btq96r said:

NRA members should be the one selling it well.  I get writing/calling/emailing your Congressman, which should be done...but if I was being hounded for money by the NRA, I'd tell them that with a Republican President & Congress, funds are no longer defensive, but will be allocated for what they produce.

In realistic theory, the NRA could have a few major items knocked off the list within a year.  The threat of endorsing primary challengers in the mid-terms should be enough to scare incumbents.

On my end, I fully expect the SAF to get hot on filing suits once Trump's judicial picks settle to the district and appeals courts over time.  There's is the long game, but the NRA has to strike while the iron is hot now.

Only 5 million of us. We are real good at blocking stuff. Gonna be a different deal on the offensive side.