East_TN_Patriot

  As soon as you see PrisonPlanet or Alex Jones cited as the source, it's time to shake your head and click the "back" button on your web browser.  That guy makes things up as he goes along and unfortunately there are plenty of sheeple who take his fairy tales as gospel truth. :shake:

Being able to only speak from the perspective of one who has worked as a LEO in Kentucky and Florida, I would say that they would be legal as long as they weren't so bright that they caused a distraction to other drivers and do not flash while operated on the roadway. It appears the proper Tennessee statute that addresses this would be 55-9-042 (2)(d)(1):

Why is that absurd?  You are arguing that it is "dishonorable" to sell your items for more than either 1) what they originally cost, or 2) more than what YOU think they should go for.  Using your own logic, if it's dishonest price gouging to sell a $12 P-Mag for a 200% profit, then selling a $35 revolver for a 4200% profit must be absolutely criminal. If you want to talk about absurdity, it's suggesting that people selling their own property by listing them for what they believe are market prices is somehow dishonest.  Should people be forced to sell their gold at it's value 5 years ago before the market changes sparked "panic buying" that drove the gold price up?  What about all the people who post in the C&R forum all the time about "buying them cheap and stacking them deep" so that when the prices jump up, you can sell them for a profit?  Your logic just doesn't wash if you believe in free market economics.  What this issue is really about is people being upset that the stuff that was cheap a month ago isn't cheap anymore due to changing political winds and concerns for what that means for the future price and availability of these items.  In a free market system, sellers can use this to raise the price, and consumers can decide if that price is justified based on their opinion of the market whether that price is justified.  You might say $40 for a P-Mag is criminal, but for someone who doesn't have any and is now afraid they will not be able to obtain them in the future at any price, then $40 is a fair price. Clearly, if someone is misrepresenting an item and being deceptive or dishonest to get more than the item is actually worth on the market, then that is dishonorable and violates the ethics of free market economics. Let me be clear on one thing.  I think most everyone who buys and sells on TGO is honest and fair in their transactions.  I have seen some items priced too high, and that's their prerogative.  It will sell, or it won't.  If it doesn't then the seller can lower the price or keep the item.  If a person gets a reputation for consistently overpricing their items or misrepresenting them, then they will not get the continued respect of buyers and will likely find themselves banned from TGO.  No dishonor, no unfairness, no brotherhood; nothing but business.  I've had fellow TGO members send me small parts for free and refuse to accept payment, and I try to return the favor when I can.  I've also paid top-of-the-market price for something because it's something I want and I think that the price is fair overall; not a bargain, but fair.  I just really don't get this price police crap.  If someone were to email me and berate me as being less than honest for my asking price for an honestly described item, they would be getting quite a passionate and unpleasant response from me.

Again, I have yet to see anything posted in the classifieds that I thought was just an absolute steal listed far below it's market value.  I have personally posted items for sale at very reasonable prices based on GunBroker, local retail, and online vendor pricing and almost never get full asking price.  Are these people greedy and selfish for trying to get a better deal for themselves?  I have seen people who had to sell their items due to financial hardship.  Did any of these "honorable" members of the TGO "brotherhood" step up to give them full asking price, or better yet, loan them the money outright so they could keep their firearms?  I know in many cases, the answer is no because I've been one of those folks at one point.  I desperately needed some cash and had people beat me up over the price so much that I ended up taking about $300 less than what it was worth because I needed the money. 

I would suspect these "price police" are some of the same people who lowball any reasonable asking price and/or list their own items at the top of the market.  Let me be clear, I have gotten some fair prices for items I have purchased through TGO, but I have yet to lay my eyes on any firearm listed well below it's fair market value.  In fact, the common advise on this site for new sellers has been to look at GunBroker and other outlets to get a decent idea of what fair market price is for your item and price it accordingly.  If some people don't like that a P-Mag that was going for $12 a couple of months ago is now going for double or triple that today, tough luck.  I don't like it any more than anyone else, but don't expect me to not get the best price possible just to make YOU feel better.  How many times have we heard people talk about the SKS they bought for $99 a few years ago and now ask $300 plus for it today?  How about those $400 AK rifles that now go for $700 or more?  Is that greed or just doing business in the classic free market way?  I wonder, are these folks selling their own items at low prices out of the goodness of their hearts?  I seriously doubt it.  I'm considering listing my underfolder AK with a bunch of mags and ammo to see if I can make a little bit of money and then use that for other stuff I would like to buy right now.  You darn well better believe that I'm not going to list it for what I paid for it when I can sell it for a small mint on GunBroker (although I won't ask those prices either to save me the hassle of going through GunBroker).  If people want to work a deal, great.  If they think I've asking too much, then they are free to pass.   It's not like I'm jacking up the price of food, medicine, or water, and any comparison between necessities of life like those and convenience/luxury items like an AK is disingenuous.   And yes, as someone else mentioned, this thread is revealing a lot about folks.  I think Obama would be proud of some of the anti-profiteering rhetoric going on here.  It's always interesting to see the beating that free-market ideas take when people don't like how the system works.  I don't sell stuff to help your wallet, I sell it to help mine.  If you don't like the price, don't buy it.  I heard this same rhetoric before the 1994 AWB and personally regretting not "panic buying" because I listened to all the people who said the AWB wouldn't happen.  Many of these people are the same ones that said Obama would never be re-elected.  Thanks, but I'll rely on my own judgement and if I'm wrong, too bad for me.  I find it puzzling that asking fair market price for an item is somehow dishonorable. Incidentally, if any of you "honorable" folks have a vintage Colt Single Action Army, I'll be willing to pay you the full $34 retail price that it sold for originally.  I know that no "honorable" person would ever sell one of these for $1500 plus today and take advantage of poor buyer.   http://www.americanhandgunner.com/~hrank/ah/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/6a.jpg  

This is exactly what Dianne Feinstein is proposing:     http://www.feinstein.senate.gov/public/index.cfm/assault-weapons

It's not you or the thread that bugged me.  It was the comments that basically said that all federal employees are "lazy" and "useless" and suggested that all federal employees live life high-on-the-hog with no worries about where their "next meal is coming from."  I think this goes without saying that we are talking about military service members, law enforcement, Veteran's affairs, doctors, teachers, researchers, and Border Patrol (seems that would be a useful job since most people think all those darn illegals are the source of most of our nation's problems), and other people in jobs that many Americans rely on.  My point here is not so much whether these are legitimate functions of the federal government, which is a reasonable discussion to have, but that it seems many here see no problem at all yanking the rug out from under honest people without so much as a "sorry" for their trouble.  It's simply shameful that our society has declined to such a degree that there seem to be no decent caring folks left who have some genuine sympathy for fellow human beings and seem to be so willing to cut another person's throat for what they think is best for them.  I don't care for the federal bureaucracy either, but I'm not so shallow and heartless to say that I don't feel sympathy for any of these workers who may end up out of a job, or can't pay their bills next month when these greedy and corrupt politicians can't get their $hit straight.  We will manage because even though I have a full-time career and a PhD, I still work side jobs to help pay bills, something I have done since I was in policing.  And my wife will always wait tables again as a side job if necessary, as she did for many years while working her allegedly high-paying entry level federal job.  Somehow this amazing federal salary didn't help us when we nearly had to file for bankruptcy after we lost almost 50% of the value on our home in Florida when we moved to Tennessee - FOR HER FEDERAL JOB.  Her amazing salary didn't keep us from racking up thousands in student loan debt while I finished graduate school.  With that, my "lazy" and "useless" "idiot" wife is at her evil federal job today, pregnant and with a fever, working extra - again - for no overtime, because work needs to be done and due to cutting employees, there's nobody else to do it. Do I think that any of these insults were directed specifically at me? Certainly not, but when people paint with such a wide brush, they never know who they are going to include in their remarks. 

I understand the issue and I frankly think the fiscal cliff may be the best thing that could happen to help control government spending. What bugs me is the tone of complete and utter malcontent for regular Americans who are just as much a victim of this as everyone else.  It's not as if my wife, or any other normal federal employees, actually had anything to do with this.  They punch a clock like the rest of the world and rely on their incomes like everyone else.

So you're telling me that if you were offered a job with the federal government making more money than you are now and with benefits, which was always the draw of federal employment, you'd turn it down to make a political point?  I highly doubt that. FWIW, she works in the court system, and they have been cutting positions, not filling positions, not gotten pay raises in 2 years, had increases in the health insurance costs, and restructured their pay scales so that employees won't make as much money as in the past.  I'll admit that I don't know whether other government agencies have implemented the same cost-saving measures, but it's always problematic paint with a broad brush and stereotype all federal employees as lazy and useless because of some examples of bureaucratic waste.  They don't send their employees to fancy conferences in exotic locales.  They don't have fancy parties.  They don't get expensive cars to drive. Their offices aren't lavish or finely decorated.  Our bank account has taken a hit, but I don't complain because I know something has to be done. These conversations are always interesting to me because many of the people who complain about federal government spending (not saying anyone here applies) also take full advantage of federal government benefits and complain if there's talk about cutting those benefits.  I would suggest that many of the more wasteful programs are in areas that most conservative leaning folks refuse to cut spending: military and defense spending.  Among the top 15 countries, the United States spends more money on military and defense that the next 14 countries combined.  Are you all willing to take a cut to your Medicare/Medicaid or Social Security?  Most Tea Party people asked were not.  At the end of the day, most Americans aren't serious about cutting spending.  They only want to cut the things that aren't important to them personally.

Well, I'm glad to see all the support for fellow Americans who just happen to work for the federal government.  I'll be sure to keep this in mind when my "lazy" and "useless" wife doesn't bring home a paycheck and we get to figure out how to pay our mortgage while feeding a kid and trying to get ready for another due in a few months. It's not the fault of the workers who simply applied for a job and accepted it just like the rest of the world does when the opportunity presents itself.  It's not the workers' fault that Congress and the White House can't get their crap together.  I don't disagree that the federal government is too large and needs to be cut, but to act as if the thousands of people who rely on the paycheck are somehow less important is a load of crap.

      I'm just curious.  Why would you refuse to recycle?

    Actually, that's exactly what this is about.  I have been engaged in some friendly debates with some very educated folks and the crux of their argument is that it doesn't matter if gun control actually helps because "we have to do something."  So, we do something that doesn't work or potentially causes more problems?

I'm a little late to this discussion and I may have missed it said elsewhere, but another reason I like the AR platform is that I personally believe in the idea of an armed civilian population to be called into service in defense of the nation should there be a need for it.  Much like the Minutemen and militia of the American Revolution, I like knowing that I have a weapon capable of using the same magazines and ammunition as the US Military in the very unlikely chance that civilians would need to be called into service and use their own personal firearms.  As far as the issue of gun control and the 1994 assault weapons ban, the National Institute of Justice did their own study on the effectiveness of that law and found that it had little, if any, effect on gun crime.

I second the Walther PPS.  I have owned one for a couple of years and it's one of the finest handguns I have ever owned.  It also has the option of 6, 7, or 8 round magazines, tritium sights, and it has an accessory rail if you choose to add a small laser to the platform.

  Except this pattern is influenced by more than just an election cycle.  This time we have a lame-duck president who is actively talking about banning guns and a tragic shooting to provide the justification.

<blockquote class='ipsBlockquote'data-author="SonnyCrockett" data-cid="857718" data-time="1355145644"><p> buy ammo at your local gun store,support mom and pops</p></blockquote> According to the department manager at my local WM, it's these folks that are causing a lot of this. He said that as soon as shipments come in, the local dealers buy up the stock so they can mark it up and sell it at the local gun shows and in their shops. As far as WM's success, much if it is due to the very same government spending people are complaining about. The corporation gets millions of dollars in tax benefits and subsidies not offered to small businesses. They are also notorious for keeping wages low and hours low to prevent providing benefits while helping employees take advantage of government benefits like food stamps. Smart indeed.

  RGuns look to have some uppers in stock and haven't jacked up their prices.

  After seeing a Spike's BCG alone going for over $300, I thought about throwing my complete Spike's rifle up there and see what happens.  I have another AR I've about finished building, an AK, and an M1A to hold me over.  Hmm...   Thanks to a fellow TGO member, I was able to order a BCG that is supposedly in stock.  I had one on backorder from Midway as well. I'll probably just keep that order in place and see if it shows up. I have a stripped upper that I wanted to build into a target upper, so might as well get the BCG now if it comes in next week like they estimate.  With my luck, they will get 500 in stock and I'll be #501 on the list.

Interesting.  I read that WalMart had pulled all of their AR rifles from the shelves.  Just goes to show that you can't believe everything you read on the Internet.

When did eBay start allowing the sale of magazines again?

OK, I'll chime in with a related UGH... I was shopping around for a bolt carrier assembly for a rifle that is virtually complete except for those parts.  Anyone know of a place that has them in stock and not asking a mint for them?  I just friggin' need one bolt carrier assembly.   *EDIT: I just went ahead and backordered one through Midway.  I just hope it gets filled sometime in the next century.   As far as panic buying, I was at the WalMart in Farragut (don't ask why; I'm pissed for being required to go there), and the ammo selection was virtually zero.  The clerk said that local gun stores and gun show vendors had come in over the past couple of days and bought up virtually everything they had including .22LR ammo.  It appears that even plinking is about to get expensive.  :rant:

So folks, how's the WalMart gun shopping going since they have sold out to the anti-gun crowd and stopped selling black rifles?

I have never bought anything from Cheaper Than Dirt because they aren't that at all.

Specific to the question, the first AWB was a pain. "Per-ban" guns were at a premium, you constantly had to worry about whether a used gun may have had parts added that violated the ban, high-cap magazines were next to impossible to get (even for law enforcement officers), and when you did find some, they cost a small fortune.

I actually thought about that myself. I was getting ready to send one and decided to hold off.