RobertNashville

Those are all good questions and good points but don't you think the investigating officers and/or the DA asked similar questions? I suspect that if the DA really thought there was a case here they would proceed with one...since they didn't; I tend to think the shooter was, at least "legally', in the right. I'm NOT saying the shooter handled things the way he should or how I would...I tend to believe that drawing a weapon, much less discharging it is something we should actively seek to avoid...that that the armed citizen has a greater obligation to avoid such conflicts than a citizen who isn't armed. However, just because I think that doesn't mean this shooter was legally in the wrong.

I spent 30+ years in accounting and finance...I understand cost...and I'm sorry...I'm just not buying into the $2 grand argument - no offense but I really think you are overblowing the "cost" out of proportion more than a little.Including the cost of the firearm doesn't make sense...of course a person who is going to carry has to have a firearm but that has zero to do with whether there is or isn't a permit process at all. Trying to tie the cost of the weapon to the permit process is just not appropriate, not logical and not the way one calculates that cost of an activity. Yes...there is time involved. Is the process inconvenient; yes. Do I wish we had the option of Constitutional Carry; yes. Can I reasonably and rationally put a $ figure on the time I spent...not really and even if I could, I don't think it truly adds anything important to the argument. I did all my class time, DMV time, driving time, etc on my free time...I freely chose to spend that free time in that endeavor which is how I suspect most HCP holders do. However, the "time" is going to pass regardless of what I do during that time...I could have slept the same number of hours but I wouldn't say that sleeping "cost" me "X" $$$. Unless I'm actually spending time that would otherwise be earning me more money then trying to put a $ figure on it is just not reasonable unless you are going to price out everything you do in life in the same way.

The "little kid's" folks will always try to paint the kid as a good kid who was doing nothing wrong; the reality is very often much different than that. A 17 year old, armed or not, can be a dangerous animal if he want's to be. As has been said, what truly happened here is known to two people, only one of which is alive and in absence of real evidence to the contrary, I tend to side with the person who is still alive to relate the story.

I didn't spend anywhere even close to two grand for my HCP....more like $300 or so including ammunition. As for that handgun, whether we have a permit process or not you still need to have the weapon so its cost really shouldn't even be part of the equation.I don't particularly like the HCP process and I agree it could be done for far less cost and hassle but I just don't see it as prohibitively expensive. Further, I think most of us know that if we are truly going to prepare ourselves for the time when we may need to defend ourselves; we need a hell of a lot more training than the HCP class and that is generally going to mean professional classes that will usually cost a lot more time and money than the HCP process...if someone can't afford to get their HCP how are they going to afford the REAL training that they need to have? I'm all for "Constitutional carry" because I don't believe that a law-abiding citizen should need the government's permission to carry arms any more than we need permission to take breath but EVERYBODY needs ongoing training and that is not usually free.

I don't consider any of my firearms an "investment" - for investments I still buy mutual funds and some gold/silver (the gold and silver just because I like having something tangible with true value that I can hold in my hand). I buy firearms for a couple of different reasons; mostly because I like them and appreciate well-crafted machines and because they are fun to shoot and, because they could save my life. I don't think I'd really enjoy them much if all they were to me was an investment. That said, I do think is important to note that unlike most of the things people spend money on today, a good firearm is an asset that usually won't depreciate and generally will appreciate over time. Spend $1,500 on a flat screen and theater system today and five years from now you'll be lucky to get someone who will take it off your hands for free...spend the same money on a Dan Wesson 1911 and I'd bet you'll get your money back and then some in five years. That said, I wouldn't count on getting rich from collecting firearms but a good firearm will hold its value and usually, over time, at least keep pace with inflation...sometimes, it appreciates faster than inflation. I would suggest that any good quality firearm in any, as 6.8 AR said, "common calibers" will do well long term - they don't have to be incredibly expensive custom guns, just good quality firearms from manufactures with good reputations. "Plastic guns" (and I've nothing against them and have a few) will probably not hold there value as well as more "traditional style" firearms such as a good revolver or 1911 style handgun or say a Marlin or Winchester lever action rifle, Browning A-bolt, etc. Again, nothing against a Glock or similar; I just doubt that they'll be as desirable to have 50 years from now as a good 1911 or Marlin 30-30 would be.

Good point...Ran Paul seems (stress "seems" at this point) to have all of his father's good points but less radical on some of his father's other positions; I see good things for him in the future and I agree, I don't think his father would want to do anything to spoil that and pissing off most of the Republican party (along with a lot of other people who don't identify themselves as "Republican" but still want Obummer out of office) will never forgive the Paul family.

Ron Paul won't win the nomination and he won't be president...it's just that simple. If he runs as an independent he'll prove beyond all shadow of a doubt that he doesn't give a flying f**k about this country because an independent run will ensure a second term for Obama, continued $1Trillion + deficits and two or three left-wing loons on the supreme court. If RonPaulRobots are so wrapped up in their devotion to Ron Paul that they can not or will not see what a second term for Obama will do then they deserve the country they'll be left with by the end of 2016.

I'm sure the candidates are talking about plenty aside from the "porn"...you won't hear it unless you go to their public appearances and fundraisers and such because the press, being a campaign partner of Obummer, would much rather talk about ANYTHING than actual issues...and if while ignoring the issues the press can paint Santorum as a religious nut who hates women or Romney as a follower of a cult that's just a bonus. I don't buy that RP is the "only candidate of worth"...he has good and bad points just like ALL the candidates but that's water over the bridge anyway...he hasn't, isn't and isn't likely to get any traction so his worth as a candidate is a moot point. Our choice in November is going to be between Obama (a socialist who hates our country, hats our religion, hates our guns and and sees the Constitution as an implement to his plans but an impediment he is more than willing to step over) OR Republican candidate "XXX" who may at least apply a tourniquet to our bleeding long enough to keep the country alive until it can someday be return to health. It's a VERY easy choice for me.

I knew months ago that RP would not win the nomination (in a much earlier thread back in the fall)...I I could figure that out then surely RP knew from the beginning that he would not win the nomination. I'm not sure what he truly hopes to gain; maybe it's just ego. Anyway, he will never drop out because, as I said, I don't think winning the nomination was really he intent in the first place. Newt on the other hand is puzzling....he's won almost nothing and although I haven't seen his financials he must be desperate for money at this point; about all he can do by staying in is spoiling Santorum's chances....that seems even more odd since I really I think Newt dislikes Romney so why he would almost hand Romney the nomination is a mystery.

The real issue here isn't "who" pays...this woman (and I use the term loosely) want's "somebody" to not just pay for her birth control (while she attends a law school that cost more per year than the average family income in this country) but she also wants the government to ORDER a Catholic university to provide insurance coverage that they find diametrically opposed to their religions views.If the federal government can get away with ordering that then they can get away with ordering ANYTHING including what you can say...what you can think and to whom you can pry or that you must pray even if you don't want to pray to anyone. Rush was 100% right on this...and I wish to hell he hadn't apologized.

"Art of The Rifle" by Jeff Cooper; great read and one that every enthusiast should read at least once.

Well...I don't think you've seen me shoot...I can scare a lot of paper targets but hitting them is another matter.

I wouldn't let that stop you...I'm buying a 22 rifle for my niece for Christmas this year. And oh yes, she wants a pink stock!

Yes...apparently they've rolled it for another week. Not sure what that really means for the future; apparently it's still alive but maybe on life support...we have a lot of legislators who want to "compromise" so that they can vote positively on a meaningless bill and appear to be pro-firearms while still not pissing off their big-business campaign donors. We'll see what happens!

***No Longer Available*** Guys, just in case anyone is interested I have a Hornady Custom-Grade New Dimension Die set. It's a Series II 4 Die set TITANIUM NITRIDE for the 454 CASULL caliber for sale; listed in "Gear Classifieds". I probably should keep it as I've been thinking of getting into reloading but even if I do I don't know that I'll ever reload this caliber. Anyway...just though I'd let folks know.

I have no desire to throw my life away in a worthless attempt to be heroic but I tend to find all life as something that should be protected - should I ever be in a position where I can protect an innocent life, I hope to God I have the courage to act. I'm not judging anyone else for their opinions on this; if someone else would never act, that is their right - we each should do as our conscious and our convictions lead us.

No one is or should feel required to intervene and probably in most cases, people shouldn't. However, if I believe some innocent person is in imminent danger of death from an aggressor and I don't believe law enforcement will arrive in time and I'm in a position where I believe I CAN intervene and have some success then I believe that the honorable thing to do IS to intervene. I'm not suggesting that people do so recklessly but that doesn't mean we should never get involved and rely on "911". If by chance I am ever in a position to save an innocent life and I die in the process; well...I can't think of any more honorable way to face the end all of us will face one way or the another.

While we clearly don't know all that went on, it seems to me that the man firing through the door was in the wrong and appropriately charged. In absence of an immediate/imminent threat; discharging a firearm should be that last option; not the first - without knowing that the woman's life was in immediate danger, I just don't see the justification for discharging his weapon through a door or otherwise.

Sharks with 'fricken lasers on their heads????

I'd opt for the dommsday bunker I saw on TV last night. The fellow had rigged four motion sensing video cameras to cover all 360 degrees of his property AND a loud speaker so that the owner, once alerted to a perimeter violation, could warn/threaten, etc. whoever was violating his property. More importantly, the bunker would be impenetrable...the only vulnerable spot for the bunker was the door and they builder tested the door integrity using a swat team with rifles, pistols, a breaching tool and battering ram...they were unable to get in. They then detonated the equivalent of 3 lbs of dynamite and the door still held. Now I know that no system or structure is perfect or will work 100% of the time every time but this was pretty impressive. Of course we are well beyond the "chin link fence" method aren't we!

The rhetoric doesn't change facts no matter how many times it's played. We have to get Obama out of office...NOTHING is more important than that..NOTHING. Ron Paul will not be President...he will not be the nominee...most people figured that out before the primary season began; for those who didn't figure it out before the primary season; it ought to be pretty obvious now. We MUST keep a conservative majority on the Supreme Court or EVERYTHING IT LOST. and we will lose the court if Obummer is re-elected.

I've always assumed, as I hinted at earlier, that if you are being arrested for a crime anything you have in your possession will be searched and that likely the search would be deemed "legal"'; no warrant required...I've never thought that a cell phone would be any different than anything else you might have with you. If I'm wrong about that then someone please set me straight...if I'm not wrong then it seems to me that this story/court decision is pretty much a non issue; or at least not a game changer.

Good stuff!

I'm not sure of your intention of posting this??? I think we all know and no one here has denied that officers make mistakes and that some officers are just as crooked as the criminals they arrest. I suppose that we could eliminate all crimes committed by law enforcement officers if you got rid of all law enforcement officers (they they would just be standard criminals). Likewise, we could also eliminate all unreasonable searches and seizures if you eliminate all searches (which I suppose would be moot if you eliminated all law enforcement since no one would be left to do the searches). However, I don't think either option is a good idea.

Well...maybe you can hop better, faster and higher than I can but I'm not going to be hopping an 8' fence anytime soon; with or without razor wire on top of it!