Mark@Sea

Legal carry. Thanks to union participation, legal carry at a town hall meeting is simply prudent. Of course, Rosa could have just stayed in the back of the bus.

Didja hear the one about the peaceful, armed Obamacare protester that was attacked by union thugs? Me neither.

You think TN is hot? Let me extend an invitation to Charleston, SC AKA Hells' south forty. If the temp wasn't over 100 today it was dang close.

For quite a while now, the left has used accusations of racism as an instant debate stopper. Don't like what your opponent is saying? Call them a racist, and change the subject to their supposed dislike of minorities. The hoped for result is that their opponent drops the topic and instead defends against the spurious charge. Not this time. Socialism isn't a racial characteristic, and the only response should be a flat statement that the accuser is a liar. I'm so very tempted to say that very thing to (unnamed) members of this forum, who apparently equate 'racist' with "anyone opposed to my argument". Their use of the term is even stupider than those who call anyone opposed to the tenets of islam a racist. Religion, much less a religious cult built by a would-be world ruler in the dark ages, isn't a racial characteristic either.

I think it is starting now - locals at town hall meetings with home-made signs, in contrast to the dims bringing people in by the busload for protests and votes, and hiring protesters on Craigslist*. Unlike Nancy "Protest is un-American, unless we do it" Pelosi, most politicians are beginning to feel the heat. And as one put it, when I feel the heat, I see the light. Internet helps a lot, too. Believe me, I'm checking to see who voted for Sotomayer, who voted for the 'stimulus' bill, who voted against guns in parks and national carry, before I vote. * DEFEND President Obama's Health Care Plan over August Recess! $500+/wk DEFEND President Obama’s Health Care Plan over August Recess! $500+/wk (Capitol Hill)

Sums it up for me.

Without the NRA, the 94 ban would have been permanent. It would have included every semi-auto. Without the NRA we'd have had national waiting periods, instead we get NICS (or for Tennessee, a state background check, but still instant, more or less). NRA isn't the only organization, but is the largest, and reasonably effective. NRA isn't as hard-line as I would like - but neither are 8 out of 10 on this forum. Sometimes NRA doesn't even leading the charge - but they are good to have in your corner. Besides, it makes the antigunners cry. How cool is that? If you join, it isn't "they", its' "We", and ultimately "I am the NRA". You will be feared and hated by the left, despised as an individual rather than a prole. Thats' gotta be worth cool points, anyway.

Blah, blah, blah, blah, you're all a bunch of racist, loser rednecks. You haven't answered that accusation? Losers! Moving on... Darn those un-progressive (which, by the way, has meant anti-fascist since the 1930's) politicians who endanger progressive ideals by selfishly and stupidly representing their constituents. That argument was easy to demolish; next! Healthcare is a commodity, just as are rifles, pistols, and ammunition. You certainly have a right to all the healthcare you can afford, just as I have a right to all the 1911's I can afford. I don't reach into your pocket to pay for them, please quit trying to reach into my pocket to pay for your medical bills. Calling healthcare (the commodity itself) a right is stating that Doctors, nurses and hospitals have a duty to provide it to you. How audacious of them to expect to get paid for their labors! Uppity slaves! Another one down, lets' go to the finale, shall we? Calling me a hypocrite for not wanting the government to control my healthcare, while at the same time not wanting the government to control my right to bear arms, is changing the punchline in the middle of the joke. Logic check on aisle three, please... The bright spot in all this is that the left isn't even trying to argue the proposition on its' merits. Well, can't blame them, it has none. They are desperately reduced to attacking their opponents' intelligence, moral character, and motivations. I'm heartened to know that there are enough freedom minded individuals in the country that they can't simply ram it through. The bad news is that there are enough people with such a poor grounding in the ideals on which this country is founded that it wasn't simply rejected out of hand. Socialism: a political theory advocating state ownership of industry (such as, say, auto manufacture, or banking, or healthcare). This differs from what Obama is pushing in what particular, please? Remedy my lack of education, if you will.

If you can't win the debate on facts, attack your opponent, is that the way it works? Why turn a healthcare debate into a class-warfare attack? Because the facts don't support your case - so instead of blaming it on sound principles of free market and personal choice, blame the "evil rich" white man, evil insurance megacorps, and/or dumb, racist rednecks. That sort of attack only works if your opponent allows it to. After 8 years of that screeching during the Bush presidency, it has become pretty easy to recognise. I won't buy it. State supporting facts. By the way, last I checked Lufthansa from Atlanta to Berlin was about 600 bucks. Those that grew up with, and really want, a socialized government are free to find one. Just not here.

One of them is about to be paroled.

Doesn't seem to be popular with some folks. I wonder why? Flag Me pictures by Cincy912 - Photobucket

Okay, let me come right out and admit it. I despise Obama because of his color. I will argue against his goals and policies because of his color. I will automatically assume a slanted viewpoint about everything he says, because of his color. I can't help it, I never could stand Reds. Original post has some facts, some inferences, couple of accusations made in very poor taste, and several statements that are exactly opposite the truth. Rather than dissect them, which would "infuriate" someone, I have a few questions. Really easy questions. By what constitutional authority does Obama propose to take control of healthcare in this country? Yes, I said healthcare. If the government controls the insurance, it certainly controls the healthcare. What assurance have I that this is not a large first step toward a single-payer health system, such as the ones in Europe, Britain and Canada that are currently killing their citizens? Especially as noted democratic figures, including Obama himself, are on record as calling it a crucial first step toward such a system? With a deficit three times (and growing rapidly) of the size of the deficit last year, vastly expanded over the Bush deficit that (according to our new president) was a grave danger to America and a matter of fierce urgency, why is doubling this (already tripled) deficit a sane idea? How can closing presidential and congressional town-hall meetings to all except union supporters, guaranteeing that citizens with opposing viewpoints are not heard, be good for the democratic process? How can anyone begin a post with warnings that union 'activists' are going to 'bust' on protestors, and end the same post with a complaint about their right to free speech? Lastly, have you considered that the debate might possibly be so 'one sided' because a majority of Americans (according to Rasmussens' latest poll) are against government controlling their healthcare?

Houston, I think I've found the problem....

Charity is when you reach into your pocket, pull out some cash, and give it to the needy. When you reach into MY pocket for your compassionate deeds, it has a different name altogether. Lets' take another look at the image here, of millions of people too poor, or disabled, or too old to work who can't afford insurance.... Happy days, they are already covered by government run health insurance programs! Medicare, Medicaid... Cue rejoicing in the streets. America is about freedom, including the freedom to choose. That includes choosing not to get health insurance. Obamacare means no choice at all. I've got a name for that, too. And, 44M, I'm not the most important one here? When it comes to making my financial decisions, sir, I dam' well am! And no, healthcare isn't a right and cannot be a right, it is a commodity, like food and housing.

It is a Harbor Freight 7x10. M14man, the old Clinchfield RR runs not a mile away, just borrow the company truck Varmint Al's page inspired me to buy one...

Didja make her pick up the brass? Hope she had fun.

I picked up a new mini-lathe a few weeks ago. I'd probably enjoy it a lot more if I knew how to use it . Any machinists here care to spend a saturday in Kingsport to show me basics? Could come up with a swap of some sort, I'm sure. Ammo, maybe...

"A lot of people are getting their noses out of joint about a poster popping up around Los Angeles comparing President Barack Obama to the Joker. Frankly, I don’t get it. One embraces terrorists and madmen, is dedicated to anarchy and the destruction of capitalist society, and sends the population fleeing in horror from his creations. The other is a fictional character played by the late Heath Ledger." -- Confederate Yankee

Okay, looks like Ralphs' argument actually boils down to a belief that theft may be wrong in the third person ("He stole my wallet"), but it becomes okay when it happens in the first person ("I needed the money"). I disagree. I also note he still hasn't even attempted to answer a couple of minor questions, but hey. If you live in the fact free void of those who believe that a president noticeably to the left of Dmitriy Medvedev, socialized medicine and massive political payoffs are just what this country needs, lets' face it; rational thought isn't exactly your strong suite. I don't see it as a sense of entitlement. I see it more as a bold-faced lie used to grab financial and political power.

Ralph, the federal government is prohibited from regulating healthcare through the tenth amendment. "They are not to do anything they please to provide for the general welfare, but only to lay taxes for that purpose. To consider the latter phrase not as describing the purpose of the first, but as giving a distinct and independent power to do any act they please which might be for the good of the Union, would render all the preceding and subsequent enumerations of power completely useless. It would reduce the whole instrument to a single phrase, that of instituting a Congress with power to do whatever would be for the good of the United States; and, as they would be the sole judges of the good or evil, it would be also a power to do whatever evil they please... Certainly no such universal power was meant to be given them. It was intended to lace them up straitly within the enumerated powers and those without which, as means, these powers could not be carried into effect." --Thomas Jefferson "Congress has not unlimited powers to provide for the general welfare, but only those specifically enumerated." --Thomas Jefferson "If Congress can do whatever in their discretion can be done by money, and will promote the General Welfare, the Government is no longer a limited one, possessing enumerated powers, but an indefinite one...." -- James Madison "With respect to the two words "general welfare," I have always regarded them as qualified by the detail of powers connected with them." -- James Madison "I cannot undertake to lay my finger on that article of the Constitution which granted a right to Congress of expending, on objects of benevolence, the money of their constituents." -- James Madison James Madison WROTE the Constitution. Would you suggest you have a better grasp of what it means than he did? So no, regulating healthcare does NOT fall under "provide for the general welfare." 10 yard penalty for attempted historical revision. Reasonable opportunity for gainful employment? Dude, this is AMERICA! Education loans and grants. Small business loans. There is better opportunity in this country (although Obama is working on that) than anywhere else in the world for gainful employment. Sheesh. The problem isn't that people who don't or can't work don't have access to healthcare. The problem is that you want your costs lowered by forcing everyone else to join the 'risk pool'. You said that, so your reply is facetious at best. A cut-n-paste reply straight from Democratic Underground - by an 'author' who admits he doesn't know what the bill means, but it doesn't mean what those 'wingnuts' say it means in the plain text of the bill. Because they're right wing wingnuts, and thus must be wrong. Or something. Excellent. Once again, evading the question. Why should Redbarron and I pay to reduce your healthcare costs? What legal, moral or ethical foundation do you use to justify taking our money? By the way, if the evil insurance companies are so against this bill, why is it their lobbyists were pushing so hard for it? If the AMA is so in favor of this bill, why is it they only decided it was a good idea after Obama gave them 245 billion dollars to get on the bus? If taxing people who don't choose to purchase insurance, and using that tax to pay for "those less fortunate" (and yes, while there are some less fortunate souls, off the cuff I'd say it works out about like welfare and section 8 housing - 80 percent are gaming the system because they're unwilling to work) isn't stealing from Peter to pay Paul, what the heck is it? If you can ever get around to a straight answer to my first question, then maybe you could take a stab at these.

Sorry, SunTzu, when it comes to hysterically funny, Ralph has you beat. And he ain't even tryin'!

Shoot, I'm still trying to figure out where the clause that allows takeover of auto industries, banks, insurance and brokerage companies is hidden. No doubt right next to the clause that gives POTUS the right to choose CEO's over and above stockholders and the board of directors.

Welcome!

Yeah, know what you mean. Primary use for this, though, is as a 'root cellar'. It should stay cool enough year 'round for storage of canned goods and whatnot. We lost power at the house a couple of days ago, actually - trees down across the lines. Power was out all day. Last big winter storm a few years ago it was out for 3 days. Sometimes, collecting old gasoline appliances comes in handy

The more we find out about this bill (atrocity is a good description) the more it sounds like the end of medical care in this country. Sure going to upset a lot of foreigners, who came to this country for livesaving care because their socialist systems couldn't provide it at all, or couldn't provide it in time. It might as well be a declaration of war against the citizenry.