crc4

Exactly. If you do get legal 'protection' make sure the policy also includes other means of self-defense besides firearms. Some don't. So if your pistol ran out of ammo and you dropped it to pickup a 2x4, you're not covered.

A few more things if you go that route. Cash only -no checks, credit, credit cards, moonshine, pot, or hookers in exchange. Meet people at locations other than your premises. Don't have people coming to your house. You don't want the traffic or prying eyes. Make any meetings short and sweet. Have all the details discussed in emails prior to a meeting. Also, make your price FIRM. Once they agree on the price via email (it's important to have your description complete and brutally honest about the guns) then all that should take place at the meeting is the buyer looks the gun over and money is handed to you. If you get hundred dollar bills make sure you have a testing pen and check them all. If the buyer likes the gun but makes you a counter offer, take the gun from the buyer, put in back in the trunk, and tell them there's no haggling. The buyer will fork over the money. The entire process from getting out of your car and you getting back in your car shouldn't take more than 5-6 minutes. Get your money and go.

Don't forget liability insurance. If you're working on firearms for profit (not counting a six-pack or pizza someone gives you) you're going to need liability insurance, commercial insurance, fire and theft insurance, etc. That can easily eat up any profits you may receive. Add state and local license fees, business permits, building inspections, IRS breathing on you, and all the other government goodies foisted on you. Remember, there's more to being a gunsmith than all the skills you must possess. There's the business of business. You must be just as skilled in running a business as running a gunsmithing shop. That's where people fail - not at their skills, but having little to no skills at business. What you might consider is rather than opening a gunsmithing business and all the red tape and scrutiny that entails, buy old guns or broken guns, fix them up, then sell them in the private market. No read tape, no taxes, no business licensing, no FFL - just be quiet about it to avoid Uncle Sam's prying eyes and ears. Do it discreetly. Since guns are sold "AS IS" it becomes the buyer's responsibility, not your liability. But keeping it on the downlow is the key. There are lots of people doing that now in the underground economy.

Beautiful shotgun. I'm a fan of double- barrels and your CZ was a great choice. The wood is gorgeous. Merry Christmas as Santa has already arrived and delivered for you.

I do not check out every store or internet seller if I've dealt with them successfully in the past. But I'm also not dropping thousands of dollars with them in our first meeting. When I wanted new gutters, I checked out the BBB first. When I needed a huge tree removed, I checked out the BBB first. I paid more in both cases for the professional services than the guy who sells gutters and installation out of the back of his 1987 Dodge Ram or the 'tree guy' who has a chain-saw, a rope, and two helpers all of whom were meth-heads with rotten teeth working bare-chested in February sweating buckets waiting on their next hit. Both these 'businesses' wanted the money up front. A neighbor went with the tree guy and lost $600 cash on the promise they'd get started the next day. That tree was still rotten the next week and it took a professional tree service 4 hours to bring it down at a cost of $2000.00. Who knows, but spending $600 to the conman who didn't return may have kept the tree off his house. Be aware that many of the top reviews on Google are paid for to get that top ranking, are written by marketing and advertising companies, and are less than honest. Most often with frauds the warning signs are present, but people don't look. Most importantly, they 'feel' something is wrong but don't act on that instinct and go along. A good fraudster never has to force someone to play their game - they depend on the mark to want to play it enthusiastically where emotions outrun evidence. I'm glad you are trying to get on with life. I also understand your wanting to rant. That can be positive in helping someone else not get taken by telling your story. Best of luck to you sir.

No more misleading than when a matress store has "Sealy Posturepedic" on the front of their store. Or a used car dealer has 'Chevrolet' sign out front. I continue to ask this question. How many people checked out this store with the BBB, other Spartan Safe stores around the country, or asked to speak with past customers of Spartan Safe? The info about their customer dissatisfaction was easily found by a search. Look, I'm sorry people got taken, that they were victims of fraud, and in the best scenario will only receive pennies on the dollar. I hate that it's happened to good people. But the big lesson for everybody to learn is to check things out before you put your money down. I can not imagine that anyone took time to say to themselves, "You know, something smells fishy here. Before I pay out thousands up front with nothing but a promise to deliver, I'm not going to feel pressured or so excited that I'm going to wait until I'm completely satisfied that this is on the up and up." So far, no one who got suckered has come forth to tell they thoroughly checked Spartan Safe out and went ahead with the deal. This is not like doing business with Tractor Supply Company. This is a subsidiary of a trucking company, not a safe company nor an authorised subsidiary of Liberty Safes. I worked frauds when I was a detective. Frauds are often perpetrated on those finding that great deal that can't wait or won't wait. They use all the psychological tricks to draw you in to get your money. There's no shame involved though I'm certain many are feeling shamed, embarrassed, and are out a big chunk of change. It hurts. I know it does. But trying to correct the past and looking to Liberty to make it turn out alright is frankly a waste of time and your resources. It isn't going to happen. The best at this point is to make sure you're aware of the bankruptcy proceedings as they crawl along, do whatever you need to do to be on the 'list,' but don't kid yourself that your money will be returned. If you want to do something that has the potential to pay off, work with law enforcement, state consumer agencies, in particular North Carolina where this originated, and do your besI understand. But don't let the fraudsters continue to make you miserable by grinding your teeth and chewing this up for months and years. You can't help what's happened, but you can control how you deal with it.

I have a Norinco 'Paratrooper' with the 16.5 barrel with no bayonet attachments. It's a dependable, rugged truck gun that I enjoy shooting as much as my AKs. I put peep sights on it 20 years ago and it runs like a chicken chasing Junebugs. I agree that Bubba'd SKSs are laughable and subject to great embarrassment for the owner. Thanks for the list to all the information.

That proves nothing in the sense that Liberty isn't responsible for what someone who distributes their safes does without an actual written contract where Liberty takes on that responsibility, which they clearly did not. I think Liberty is is the clear. Liberty didn't sell you the safe directly. They were selling the safes to Spartan who in turn sold you the safe. Liberty wasn't turning loose of the safes to Spartan until they safes were paid for by Spartan. Liberty wasn't dealing with the customer safe buyers. Spartan was at best a middle-man like so many other safe dealers like Tractor Supply Company. Other than the express warranty made by Liberty concerning their safes (usually manufacturing defects and such discovered in a set time frame) there's nothing to sue Liberty for. No one was defrauded by Liberty. Liberty doesn't want this complication involving their reputation anymore that those who were scammed want to be out their money. If Walmart advertises they have Libby's Corned Beef for sale, that doesn't make Libby's responsible if Walmart over-charges you, fails to deliver the product to you, has a surly employee, etc. I think you'll find the same in this case. Liberty is not at fault without proveable evidence and I don't believe there is any.

My last two ex-wives felt the same way, hence ex-wives.

I like the way he reduces all your cleaning products to Hoppes #9 for solvent (Mineral spirits) and mineral oil for lubrication. That's it. He gives you the good reasons why that makes sense. I'm sure the 'Gun Paste is Magic' and the 'Amazing Mystery Oil Lube' people don't want you to see this. I'm giving away lots of half-used products to clean my bench up.

I believe he was referring to the civil suit that OJ lost and the Browns won after OJ was acquitted of the murders. That's what I was referring to that even if found not guilty you can still be civilly sued and found liable in many jurisdictions. Self-defense shooters must have 'clean hands' to be justified. That's why studying SD cases, laws, and the SD shooter's behaviors are critical. Unfortunately, few people who carry do and become victims of the trap they set for themselves after a SD incident.

Thanks for the many suggestions and advice. I'll get one of two different brands to try - one for the car and one for on-person carry. I am going the rechargeable route so I can charge them everywhere. Flashlights have changed. In 1974, this was my duty flashlight and gun. The S&W M 67 and the 4-cell Maglite. The flashlight was really more of a nightstick with a light. Well-made and took the wind out of someone rather quickly. Built like a tank. I still have the replacement bulb in the end cap as I don't recall ever changing the bulb. It's lived in my car by my front door for decades. The Velcro around the top mates with the hook part on the floor to keep it from moving. I wish everything was made as well as these two.

I respectfully disagree. It depends on where you do the shooting. In some locations, not prosecuting a self-defense shooting will be committing political suicide. Look at Rittenhouse. Though the DA was wrong and lost, he was expected by the progressives to do exactly what he did. Remember, you can still be charged and arrested but not prosecuted. It may take months or years for a criminal trial to take place or it may be dropped. You're still on the hook for the legal expenses incurred even if all charges are dropped. Civil suits are easier for lawyers, not more difficult. They get a big payout it they win through settlement or trial. Juries that wouldn't convict in a criminal trial feel sympathy for the shooting 'victim' and look for excuses to award damages. It takes in many ways a much better civil lawyer than a defense lawyer to protect the SD shooter from a civil judgement. Again, there's hefty legal fees to pay even if you win your civil trial. That's why many SD shooters win at stopping the threat but face financial ruin even when the shooting was pronounced 'justified.'

The fact you're a law abiding citizen has nothing to do with the inevitable investigation. Even if you killed a man raping your child in their bedroom, there will be an investigation. Most likely, even if the DA doesn't want to prosecute because it was a justified shooting, he'll take it to the Grand Jury. That's in a county where the DA is friendly to gun owners. Forget about a liberal/progressive DA as then you'll be arrested, made to make a major bond, probably spend several night in jail, then see a judge to set bond. That's just the beginnings of your woes. Even if the Grand Jury votes a 'no true' bill, in some jurisdictions that doesn't stop the dead person's family from hiring their own prosecutor. The legal fees are paid by you. The expert witnesses are paid by you. Paper work is paid by you. You'll pay even if you're not convicted. That's just the criminal action. It's worse for civil suits. That's what happens to law-abiding citizens who were fully justified. Is it fair? Fair doesn't count. Reality does. And that's the reality of what happens.

That's great! It's far better, easier, and cheaper to stay out of trouble than get out of it.

Yes. But it certainly applies in states even where a case of self-defense was determined to be justified that civil actions can proceed. Lawyers love these type of cases. Due to only requiring a 51% preponderance of the evidence rather that the higher (say 97%) for a guilty verdict in a criminal trial, it's more likely than not you will be going to civil court and much more likely to be found at fault. It's easier to come out clean from a criminal trial than a civil one. That's the reason to have a 1,000,000 personal liability policy (most often attached to homeowner's policy) and some type of self-defense 'insurance' policy that offers civil trial protection. Considering what you have to lose either way, it's cheap compared to a civil judgement and civil and criminal defense costs.

I suggest contacting a local TV station. Most have some type of 'consumer' oriented segments where they investigate ripoffs. This might get the word out to others and the more people swindled the better chance someone in government might get involved.

That's a self-aggrandizing statement that may be true or a statement meant to throw suspicion and possible criminal charges off of themselves. I find it hard to believe that employees weren't knowledgeable about the business model of taking deposits and providing nothing. The more I read about Spartan Safe, the more it seems like a scam from the beginning. The first few 'legitimate' customers may get their safes or they may be shills who talk about the deals they got and excellent customer service. Like the winner at a Three-Card Monte game who's working with the dealer. A specific red-flag is the sweetheart deal they offered, plus free delivery 'only' they required all the money up front. That's not a good business deal for the consumer. A legit business will take a deposit, have you sign paperwork that the deposit will be forfeited if you don't go ahead with the purchase. That way they keep your deposit and can sell the item at full price and are protected. That way the consumer can only lose his deposit even if it's a scam. Then they string you along for two-three months for those who paid with mosts credit cards as that exceeds the chargeback time. A least this can be a lesson for others to learn from. I'm betting that less than 1% of those who were scammed checked out the company before purchasing. A deal 'too good to be true' was just that. More internet searching shows that Chadley Management Company is a trucking company. There's your free delivery offer. This could be where the cash flow went. It would be interesting to know when Spartan Safe started business, how many safes were sold, how many safes were actually delivered, and if their policy was always to collect all monies up front.

Looking at the Chapter 7 bankruptcy filed, the odds are no one who is not a secured creditor will see one dime. That's regardless of the statement "CHADLEY MANAGEMENT INC. indicated on its bankruptcy petition that it expects there will be sufficient assets in the estate to make a payment to the unsecured creditors." With liabilities of 10-50 million, and assets of 1-10 million that's doesn't bode well for those who paid for but never received safes. The above statement is often used to keep creditors wishing, hoping, and off their backs. While there still could criminal proceedings, the bankruptcy filed at first glance doesn't look promising for those who were screwed out of their cash. Also expect 1-1.5 years for this to wind its way through Bankruptcy Court.

Old School Guy teaches Firearms Cleaning What you should know. These are the best explanations I've seen for the whys, hows, and what you need. Read his resume and you'll find he's an expert. Save yourself a lifetime of money spent on ineffective snake oil products. If you'll watch this video, this gentleman breaks it down for you. It's an hour long and worth every second. I love it when myths get busted as I learn something valuable and save money.

My 18-year-old carry flashlight has died. Technology has changed since 2005. I need a new one for simple night walks with the dogs, evening restaurant visits, and shining in the eyes of thugs. This is the one I've found - Streamlight 66320 MacroStream USB 500-Lumen Rechargeable Compact Flashlight Does anyone have experience with it? Any other light or information I should consider? Thanks.

Just curious. How long had Spartan been in business? Did anyone do their due diligence in checking out the company before putting money down? Investors thought Bernie Madoff was a really great guy so there was no reason to check him out. Sorry for your loss. I understand how frustrating it can be when you've been hoodwinked. As to the police getting involved, I wouldn't count on it. Cases like this are far too paper heavy, require specialized attorneys for a paper chase that the local DA doesn't have on staff, and there are violent crimes that will always take precedence over incidents like this. Then, if and when someone is charged, the money is long gone. Unless you agree to pay a lawyer a huge retainer up front, no lawyer will do it for a backend fee. That doesn't mean you might not get some justice, but at what price? Sometimes you have to let it go, learn, and don't eat yourself up for days, months, and years. Good luck whatever you do. PS. I did some looking around. Much of their website is still available. Print out (pdf) of everything you can find on their sites. Check out other places too like the Better Business Bureau (In Arizona they got a D) Facebook pages, anything that may show fraudulent advertising and attempts to deceive.

Maybe have a camera with a Barrett .50 attached that sends more than a post card for habitual traffic offenders, fleeing felons, and DUIs.

One of the joys in having guns is working on them for maintenance and improvements. After watching Practical Shooter on Youtube I made myself a wooden bench block. Wooden Bench Block by Practical Shooter Picked up a 4' outdoor stair tread that has 3 grooves running lengthwise. Check the board carefully and avoid knot holes and cracks. Cut a 12" square, and drilled plenty of 3/8 and 3/4 inch holes both in the grooves and on the flats. Round the edges with a router (could also use a 4-in-1 hand file, sandpaper block, or power sander). Sanded the grooves and flats with orbital sander 220 grit. I used it last night to replace a trigger pin. What a difference between the hockey puck-sized block and this 12 x 12. I also have a 3' piece left to make a block for long guns. The cost was $14.00 for the board and about an hour of work with tools. Money and time well spent.

Thanks for the response. I'll check them out.