macville

I think there's a law in GA about carrying in a "public meeting" which the park may qualify. Just look into that for more details. Matthew

Strange, I just saw that they are supposed to do the background check within 30 days. Matthew

My bad, some of the people have @cityofknoxville.org email addresses. Matthew

Are we sure it would be legal to carry the uppers into a place where you can't carry? The Fed's consider the part with the serial number a "firearm", so maybe you could still be charged if you carried into a school or something? My new thought is to find a very short bike type lock and loop it around the bottom of the seat and through the trigger guard on my gun. It ain't pretty, but I could still slide the gun under the seat and they'd need bolt cutters to get the gun (unless the broke the plastic trigger guard, but that wouldn't make it worth much when you try to sell it.) Matthew

Tell her to look up names in the data base the stupid Memphis paper has up. It won't be that useful unless someone has a really distinct name, but there's a chance that might be useful. BTW, shouldn't the emails sent to her city email address be public record? Matthew

I love that he keeps giving us gold bullets to shoot at him in the next election. Who is willing to step up right now and say they will run against him in the next election? Matthew

Interesting. When we walked in, the two guards sitting there kinda gave us a blank look and then pointed the room over to the right. Did not go through metal detectors. I kinda had to laugh at the security. If I were a councilperson I would not be happy. The two guards outside were unarmed, and then the city policeman there standing near the door would probably have been shot 5 times before he'd be close to drawing. I'm not saying he's slow or anything, but one cop standing at the door isn't going to really stop anything from going down sadly enough. I don't mind disarming if you provide proper security, but that's just really laughable to me. Matthew

Yes, Michael is a great guy. My wife's family has known him for a long time and I am sad that we didn't see him while we were there last night. We got there late and when they said the vote was going to be pushed back we left right away. Two things though. I got an email from Mayor Haslam today stating that there would be a meeting on the 20th and a vote on the 25th. I thought that it was pretty impressive that someone in his office cared enough to let people know about the next meeting/vote. I figure if he wanted the ban (which he says he doesn't, but you know politicians...) there wouldn't have been an email sent out saying anything about when the next meeting would be. If I wanted something to fail I would make sure the opposition wouldn't know when it's happening. Second, do we still know about legal carry in the meeting room? I know the main part of the building is posted, but I didn't see anything about it being posted in that room. You don't go through the metal detector, so I was thinking that it may not be banned in that room. I noticed that Lumpy says he doesn't have a gun there, but the reason was never because he couldn't legally carry. Matthew

I don't know where you got educated, but that's pretty far off base. "Christians" in America are like Catholics in South America. Yes, there are a ton of people who might say they are "Christian", but that's in name only. Even then, I doubt you'd get even 50% of the country to actually say they are Christian. I might believe 50%+ say they believe in a god. We have two arms police officers at our church, but with a very large church and 3000+ people there every Sunday, I am not counting on them being there fast enough to stop some crazy person. Last year when the shooting happened they locked down the kids, but that's about all they could do. Not what I would really call "safe". Matthew

I will be at the meeting tonight. It might be a total waste of time, but if it is heard, then I will be there to show my support. If anyone else is coming, I will be wearing a black double jay creative t-shirt. You can't miss me as I'm 6'4, skinny, with spiked hair. Please come up and say hello. Matthew

See, that's how I feel. Except, I don't think you should be restricted from carrying in a private school even. They should be allowed to post, but not required. I still would like to get an AG opinion on it just so I won't be caught with my pants down and lose my permit. I'm also going to talk to my state rep about pushing a bill next session to get the private school ban taken away. BTW, did anyone see the AG opinion today that even if you can legally carry in a park, if there are kids there on a school field trip the park becomes off limits? That's totally absurd and the law needs to be changed so a location doesn't become off limits when school kids arrive. I mean, you can trust me at Wal-Mart next to kids, but evidently I go nuts when I am at a school or park with kids???? Matthew

I have been there a couple of times recently. It's properly posted and they have you go through the metal detectors at all doors. In fact, they don't even allow pocket knives in as they have held my tiny swiss army knife before. So just to warn you, don't go in packing. Leave your gun in the car along with any knives. Matthew

I will be down there also to show my support in defeating the resolution. I've written to Chris Woodhull as he is a facebook friend of mine and also Mayor Haslam, who goes to my church. It would be really great if a whole varied group of us showed up to let them know it's a whole cross section of people who have carry permits. And no, you can not carry in the City County Building. It's properly posted and they have a metal detector. Of course, I feel better about not being able to carry there since they do sweep everyone. Matthew

Okay, found the school on this website: TN:Ed:SDE Directory Home Page which makes me believe it would qualify as a "school" as they rent my church buildings. It's really absurd that I can't carry on Sunday morning and Wednesday nights because a school for 5 year old's meets there 5 days a week. I'm glad to see that some 5 year old is "supposedly" safer because I can not carry my firearm on the same property. Gag me. Matthew

So do you have any suggestions how I might find out if it's legal to carry or not? Matthew

Does anyone know how this exactly works? I am wondering about carrying at my church because we evidently offer some kind of "school" classes (I thought it was just daycare) The law says: [39-17-1309: ( (1) It is an offense for any person to possess or carry, whether openly or concealed, with the intent to go armed, any firearm, explosive, explosive weapon, bowie knife, hawk bill knife, ice pick, dagger, slingshot, leaded cane, switchblade knife, blackjack, knuckles or any other weapon of like kind, not used solely for instructional or school-sanctioned ceremonial purposes, in any public or private school building or bus, on any public or private school campus, grounds, recreation area, athletic field or any other property owned, used or operated by any board of education, school, college or university board of trustees, regents or directors for the administration of any public or private educational institution.] I also noticed that it says: (d) (1) Each chief administrator of a public or private school shall display in prominent locations about the school a sign, at least six inches (6²) high and fourteen inches (14²) wide, stating FELONY. STATE LAW PRESCRIBES A MAXIMUM PENALTY OF SIX (6) YEARS IMPRISONMENT AND A FINE NOT TO EXCEED THREE THOUSAND DOLLARS ($3,000) FOR CARRYING WEAPONS ON SCHOOL PROPERTY. (2) As used in this subsection (d), “prominent locations about a school†includes, but is not limited to, sports arenas, gymnasiums, stadiums and cafeterias. ------ Okay, that said, I am still not sure if my church applies. First, the classes are Preschool, Full Time Preschool (day care!), State Certified Accredited Kindergarten (which is what may apply), Kindergarten/First Grade Cooperative Program (which is a homeschool type program) & 2nd-5th Grade Tutorial/Enrichment (sounds like an in room tutor) But here's the kicker. NO WHERE on the property does it have the proper sign posted required by law. Would I assume that by that, the classes my church offers do not qualify to be a "school"? Or are they just idiots (which wouldn't surprise me!) and totally ignored the law about posting nice big signs. It's kinda of a big deal because I go there a lot as a youth leader and don't want to be committing a crime by carrying. Matthew

BTW, does anyone have stats about how many states allow local park carry. Any on crime in parks in TN (or even other states.) Anything that might be useful to speak with tomorrow night and to also write emails to the reps. Matthew

Knoxville to Consider Banning Concealed Carry in Local Parks! Please Contact Knoxville City Council Immediately! On Tuesday, July 28, Knoxville’s City Council will consider a resolution prohibiting carry by permit holders in parks within Knoxville’s city limits. Put forward by Knoxville’s Vice Mayor Bob Becker, the opt-out resolution is under item 11 and will be letter ‘O’ on Tuesday’s agenda. Click here to view the agenda. All meetings are open to the public. To sign up to speak against the resolution during Tuesday’s meeting, please contact the City Recorder’s Office at (865) 215-2075. Individuals wishing to speak to the City Council may also sign up with the City Recorder on the night of the meeting. The vote to adopt the opt-out resolution will happen Tuesday at 7:00pm, so PLEASE attend and request to speak during the meeting and at the Public Forum held immediately upon adjournment. The best way to get your opinion through to your local officials is to contact them immediately. Please respectfully urge them to oppose any resolution that would prohibit law-abiding permit holders from protecting themselves in local parks. Resolution: Item 11: letter ‘O’ When: Tuesday, July 28 at 7:00 p.m. Location: Main Assembly Room City Council Building 400 Main Avenue (downtown) Knoxville, TN Local Officials Mayor Bill Haslam City County Building Phone: (865) 215-2040 Fax: (865) 215-2085 Email: mayor@cityofknoxville.org Mayor’s Office William Lyons, Senior Director Department of Policy & Communications Phone: (865) 215-2029 Email: wlyons@cityofknoxville.org Larry B. Martin, Deputy to the Mayor Phone: (865) 215-2086 Fax: 865-215-2277 Email: lmartin@cityofknoxville.org Thomas Strickland, Jr., Director Community Relations Special Assistant to the Mayor Phone: (865) 215-2048 Fax: (865) 215-2085 Email: tstrickland@cityofknoxville.org Council members can be reached by contacting the City Recorder's Office Phone: (865) 215-2075 Fax: (865) 215-4269 City Council Members Vice Mayor Bob Becker - Fifth District 125 E. Columbia Avenue Knoxville, TN 37917 Phone: 865-387-0752 Email: bob@bobbecker.org Joe Bailey - at large 424 Hillvale Turn, West Knoxville, TN 37919 Phone: (865) 637-4477 Email: jdbailey@cityofknoxville.org Chris Woodhull - at large 223 Deadrick Avenue Knoxville, TN 37921 Phone: (865) 661-4131 Email: chriswoodhull@bellsouth.net Marilyn Roddy - at large 920 Iskagna Drive Knoxville, TN 37919 Phone: (865) 637-0333 Email: mroddy@cityofknoxville.org Joseph Hultquist- First District 2240 Fisher Place Knoxville, TN 37920 Phone: (865) 579-1250 Email: joseph49@bellsouth.net Barbara Pelot - Second District 8437 Corteland Drive Knoxville, TN 37909 Home: (865) 693-0454 OR (865) 671-1544 Fax: (865) 693-0525 Email: rpelot3@aol.com Steve Hall - Third District 5748 Acapulco Avenue Knoxville, TN 37921 Phone: (865) 584-9567 OR (865) 522-1195 Email: InteriorFinishes@MSN.com Rob Frost - Fourth District P.O. Box 300 Knoxville, TN 37901-0300 Phone: (865) 525-1303 OR (865) 546-7000 Fax: 865-546-0423 Email: RobFrostCityCouncil@comcast.net Robert J. Booker - Sixth District 2621 Parkview Avenue Knoxville, TN 37914 Phone: (865) 546-1576

Hey Rob, just to let you know that just redirects to the main facebook page. You may need to make sure that everyone can see it in the facebook preferences. Or, just post the text here. Matthew

I did too at a SunTrust last Monday for 45 mins. I'm glad they didn't post because I had $19,000 worth of gold on me that I was putting in a safety deposit box for my grandfather. Since they don't have an armed guard in that branch, I was glad I was able to carry! Really, if you look around there are almost no business that post. And the ones that do post are mainly just the non-legal slash through a gun sign. Matthew

I saw the same sign at the BP here in East TN. I thought it was odd considering they sell a bucket load of guns and ammo. Hopefully, they will post less confusing signs. But that policy still doesn't make sense since people can't carry a loaded gun without a permit. Maybe the idea is that if someone brings an empty gun, they can't go up to where the ammo is and pop some rounds into their gun since they don't keep ammo under lock and key. But that's still a stupid policy since if someone is willing to commit a crime why would they check their gun? Matthew

If they know you have a gun then you are very in deadly danger. It's just like someone pointing a gun at you. You don't know if they are going to use it, but it's assumed that if someone points one at you, they are willing to pull the trigger. With a taser you never know if they are going to come up to you after you've been hit and start kicking you. If someone were to point a taser at me (not a cop), I would have probably feel that my life is being threatened. But good news! You'll probably never ever run into a BG with a taser. Why use a weapon that allows people to ID you after you hit them with it? Not to mention that a gun on the street is much cheaper than a black market taser. Matthew

That's why I bought a gun that has a decocker and can be fired DA. I have one in the chamber and if I need to fire, I just flip the safety off and do a long trigger pull. Matthew

Was it a legal posting? Matthew

To be honest, I have no problems with that. I think that's what freedom is about. They are free to post whatever the like. Personally, if someone posts something like that, then I won't do business with them. But it's their property and they can do what they want with it. The difference between our views is what you consider public. The only thing that is public is property owned by the government. I don't believe that people give up any rights because they open their property up to the "public". It's still private property. Do you have any problems with people who post no smoking signs on their business even though they are not required by law to post? What about no shoes/shirts no service? The difference in our views is that I believe people should have pretty much absolute rights on their property in regards to who they allow on it and what they can bring on it. Doesn't matter if you are open to the "public" or not. We'll probably just have to agree to disagree. What I do believe we all believe in is businesses not being sued when a HCP holder shoots someone legally or illegally (depending whether they were involved somehow: aka serving booze to someone who was open carrying or even CCW). I am a firm believer that the next session of the TN senate should pass a law state as such for all businesses. But what would that look like? I believe such a law should offer at min the same protection that HCP holders already get from the state. If the shooting was legal, then the place of business can not be sued in civil court. Even in an illegal shooting (murder, HCP has been drinking, etc) the place should not be held liable UNLESS they committed a crime (serving a drink obviously, puddle that should have been cleaned up and a HCP holder slips and gun goes off (I'm sure the anti's think that will probably happen 50 times a year), etc.) But what should such a law look like? Matthew