macville

I feel like some of you are falling for the line from the anti-gun people that the sight of things scare people and so they are bad. What ever happened to peoples actions? In those pictures all I see are smiling people. If a person came in not smiling, acting really weird, I would say their actions warrant concern. But if they are smiling and do no threatening, aren't they harmless? Why is a person carrying a gun peacefully different than a cop carrying a gun? Both could go crazy and kill you, there's nothing special about law enforcement. Crazy is crazy, not crazy is just another human going about their business.   BTW, I have seen a lot of gun advocates today call these OC'ers crazy, lunatics, dicks, etc. However, there are plenty of people in this country that would call those people the exact same thing for their "moderate" views on guns. So before you throw these OC'ers out as hurtful to the cause and crazy, just remember that the people we are all fighting view you as no different.

  When was TN ever a conceal only state? My understanding was that when the permits came into issue, they started out as a carry permit, not a CC permit. And how much have you OC'ed since getting your permit? I have a decent amount getting my permit 5 years ago (in west knox, state and national parks), but the looks I have gotten when I do OC have 95% of the time been good. I have gotten maybe two odd looks and plenty of questions that were positive. And kids don't really get scared by them. I've heard probably 5 kids when they saw my gun say "cool!" You are living in this fictional world that if you don't own a gun or not used to them, you hate guns. Most people I run into are indifferent to open towards guns (more than I would have ever thought.) The battle is not about getting these people to carry, but to understand that those who do chose to arm themselves are not evil or crazy. It is a winnable battle, but it's not if you tell yourself it's not. We are winning the legal battle in many ways, but it's now time to focus on the heart battle.   Because of those crimes, this is the very time we have to fight and do damage control. If you sit back and try to keep quiet, you are doing more harm than good. The media in this country doesn't let these things blow over. The Knoxville News Sentential was still doing pieces on Newton this summer and not pieces stirred on by other shootings. They would take the tinniest thing that came out about the shooting and make an entire piece from it. They want to keep it in the news because that's how these people fight. Come into modern times and learn how these people fight. We can take these incidents as a good time to step up and say, "hey, mass shootings aren't that common, they are just hyped up in the media and AR-15 are very common guns and have many useful purposes." I know you want to play nice, but the other side doesn't play nice as you can see how they hype with great joy the death of innocent people. 

  Yet, every other group that's out there shoving their "rights" agenda down our throat is winning right now. How? Because they've made their agenda "normal." Why do you think it's any different for us? We allowed a bunch of firearms stuff to become un-common and that's why we've suffered over the last 100 years. But keeping it hushed up and to ourselves never has worked for any other group and it's not working for us.

  Think of it this way. We have to get people used to the fact that we have rights and are supposed to be able to use them. We talk about guns because it's a gun forum, but the 2d applies to other tools and the fact that we have the right to defend our lives.   And how is OC'ing shoving in their face? Am I screaming at them "look at my gun!!!" I feel like there is a group of people on this board that think any OC'ing is like screaming at another person. If that's the case then wearing a t-shirt or having a bumper sticker  with any logos, sayings, etc is screaming your views at someone also. But hey, I wear some shirts because I DO want to make a point, but I am not out protesting about it.

  While I agree with you that it is better for our society, you could argue that about many things...including guns. But by doing so they said that people have a RIGHT to be on your property and you to serve them. If it were true property rights then people could ban whoever and whatever, but they can't.   As much as the core of our rights are God given, they don't matter unless people acknowledge them. When people are used to something, it's not a big deal. That's why firearms in TN aren't a huge deal compared to DC or Chicago, or a good chunk of the NE US. When the major majority of Americans start to not care about firearms, then that's when it becomes very dangerous for the 2d. You can see this with many other rights (1st, 4th, etc) and how Americans have become so used to NOT using their rights that they give them up willingly.

  Except that people DO get used to it. May not be the full acceptance you are thinking of, but it happens. The gay community is a prime example of that. Look at what they've done in the last 30 years. You now have church dominations ordaining homosexuals, and even the most conservative Christians are accepting gays in ways 30 years ago you would have never thought. But the upside for us here is that it's not a moral issue like homosexuality. It's simply an issue that a ton of people have never been around a firearm and only know what the media tells them. Showing them that we don't go crazy with them but have them for everyday protection is important. But doing that without OC is impossible.

  Try banning black people, gay people, etc. and see how far your rights go. Why can they ban one right, but then they have to allow someone else there because of their color or what not? Why do they have to accommodate disabled people? You don't actually have the right to refuse service to whoever your like for any reason your like (see the baker in WA over the gay couple's wedding cake.)   And I still can't find one person on this thread that answered my question of how do you get people used to guns without them being around and seeing guns everywhere?

  Basically, you are saying we should let the few evil people win. Standing by will never help us win-unless it's letting a politician step in it with their big mouths. All we ever do is damage control instead of going on the offensive. Heck, if you look at gun control laws we've basically been on the defensive since the civil war. You want to change people's minds? Hiding our guns in a dark corner isn't going to do that. If you don't like what the OC advocates are doing because you think they are the fringe, then why aren't you out there OC'ing as a normal person? CCW isn't going to change people's mind because they don't know that it's there. The fact that millions of people have a CCW seems to mean nothing to the public, but an armed person out with their family or doing normal stuff has a much bigger impact. If you disagree, then how do you suggest we get people used to guns without them seeing them?

  I understand what the guy is saying, but he never offers an answer to how we change minds. Because if it's what we've been doing, it's not working because changing laws does not change minds. Acceptance happens through being around, not just because someone says it's the law. Otherwise OC would be accepted no problem since it's legal. This is what the gun community seems to not understand.

  I am sorry, but it's people like you giving up rights over the last 100+ years that have caused us to be in the mess we currently are. We don't politically have much of a way to stand up for our rights now because to get laws back to being Constitutional, we have to sue and that costs a lot of money. Disagree with me on that? How long have we had republicans running TN and how far have our gun laws moved towards being Constitutional??? Hint: almost none. It's time for a line to be drawn our country. Are you for the Constitution or are you against it? Our country wasn't founded by people who didn't push the edge. Heck, these guys are doing LEGAL things, while our founders were doing ILLEGAL things according to the king.   Starbucks may be caught in the middle, but guess what, it's run by PEOPLE, it's not a soulless identity. We need to remember this fact about business AND government. It has become us vs them because we've strayed so far fromt he Constitution. How did the gay community get so accepted in our country? How did black people get their rights equal to whites? How did abortion become legal? Hint: it wasn't by staying in the closet or being quiet! Yet, so many in the gun community seem very content to be very quiet about it and want to force others to be also.   It seems like we are winning, but ultimately we are losing because we aren't winning the entire war, just battles here and there. It's great when we win court cases, but if people are not comfortable with seeing a firearm in public, we have won NOTHING. Court cases don't change peoples mind and that's what matters in the long run. Maybe if more people started OC'ing in an everyday fashion the rifle carrying wouldn't be weird and wouldn't really be necessary. People will not accept things until they are around them in an everyday fashion. This is very basic human psychology that the gun community has ignored.   And to those of you who call OC'ers and especially rifle OC'ers (where it's legal), jerks, dicks, (insert insult name here), don't take offensive if they call you the same thing back for exercising your 1st amend rights. I think it's shameful that you throw such people under the bus and it's more hurtful to our cause than what they are doing because it gives the anti gun people ammo. If it's legal you can say, I wouldn't do that, but it's legal and I support legal activity. It certainly would be a better use of your time and energy to go combat the anti's than grumbling about the tactics that other people are using.

  If any card offers points you can spend (just like with Amazon), don't spend them. ALWAYS take the cash. Why? Because if you spend the points, you don't get any cash back on that! So instead of spending points off my Amazon card at Amazon, I get a check sent to me for the cash amount and then use my Amazon card to make the purchase. That way I get 3x the points instead no points. Also, it's not totally free money. It's actually YOUR money to start with. All they are doing is giving you some of the money back that they charge the merchant, who charged you. I actually wish that merchants had cash discounts for what they are charged for CC fees because I think you'd be better off.

 Kholes has some nice clothes and sometimes great deals on the clearance rack.

What happen to the newsworthy reports sub forum?

How much you want to bet on how many TN LEO's would know that you can't carry on another state's permit if you are a resident? I am not saying you should try, but I bet none that you would run into would even know?

  Considering that it's a group that decided to illegally block the interstate and bring kids to do so, it shows me they are crazy. I try to avoid crazy people. Plow may be a harsh word, but I will be driving through slow enough to not hurt people that are wise enough not to threaten my life and my family (because as a mob those tend to turn really fast in these types of situations.)

  The establishment GOP and supposedly "conservatives" (Rubio, Ryan, etc) are 50% of the problem. We can get it back in the hands of the GOP, but it ain't going to help because they are a half step behind the liberals running towards destruction. There is no swinging it back at this point. We will have a complete collapse of this country sooner than later. It's not if, it's when at this point. It will be better if we do because then we can restart and hopefully get things back on track again.

582

65 discovered sure. But the scary part is how many went unnoticed by TSA. I bet at least 1, if not 10.

  They can't. But they can ask and make it sound like they can.

Do they have the audio that can be translated which proves this claim?

  Did John McCain maybe get his seat because another senator cheated on his wife and McCain won the election? And Megan is only in the spotlight because of her dad (I can't tell if she has more or less brains than her dad.)

  I don't know about you, but I don't go hang out with people I may have to do business with, but don't hold any of my values.

Yeah, I think mine took about 4 weeks and just got it last week.

  They may have been elected Constitutionally but how many of them follow the Constitution they swore to uphold? At what point do you realize that you are the only one follow the Consitution. Would it not be Constitutional to actually RESTORE the Constitution by enforcing it?

Mike you beat me to posting the article. This story shows why constitutional carry is important. Also, since there was no charge to go arm, it shows that  39-17-1322 worked as it should.     Wondering if he didn't renew his HCP because of the cost? Can we say poll tax?