JayC

Lester, I realize, that my math is not meant to be an exact amount here... I know my effective tax rate is below 33% on income tax, probably more like 28-29%, that FICA has a cap that I reach each year, and that I spend less than 50% of my gross income on taxable purchases - but my business spends more than 50% of my gross income on taxable purchases... If anything I'm probably spending 7 or 8% of my gross income on sales tax when it's all said and done. I was trying to make a point that I'm near or at the 50% mark already, and I showed some basic addition that at least gets in the ballpark of that estimate. Lets say you're right and instead of 55% I'm at 47% is it really that much of a difference? Is it morally right to ask me to give even more of my earnings to the government? For us to support SS and Medicare for the baby boomer generation my taxes would have to go up a lot... even more when you factor in not going into even more debt in the process. We've got 100 TRILLION dollars in entitlements we've promised sitting out there, and to pay them all off we'd have to raise taxes to ~25-30% of GDP, today taxes are at ~15-18% of GDP, and my tax bill is nearing 50%, how much is it going to go up if I need to "pay my fair share" (what a joke) of that bill? I'm figuring that 100 TRILLION is to cover the baby boomers for the next 20-25 years, and our economy today is about 14.5 trillion... so about 27.5% of GDP in today's dollars to pay that money off... Combine the need to raise taxes to cover these entitlements with the fact that the work force will be shrinking at the exact same time. For example today work force is ~138 million, with ~65 million retired persons on government entitlements... about .47:1 ratio... in 2015 it's estimated that the work force will be 95 million, and retired persons will account for 73 million... about a .77:1 ratio... Think about that for a second... sometime in 2020's we'll get to a 1:1 ratio, where retired persons equal the number of people in the work force... This is a train wreck coming down the tracks... It's going to tear this country apart unless we do something drastic.

I think you'll live long enough to say the phrase "I was alive when there was still a United States of America".

About the time you get upwards of 85k-90k a year, it starts to become part of the discussion... I'll give you an example... Before being self employed, I worked for a large fortune 100 company... The salary difference between a senior engineer, and the VP of the department was maybe 45-55k a year... about 10k per level... engineer > manager > director > AVP > VP... but the VP got another 200+k worth of stock options every year, while the engineer didn't get any. The reason why? You don't have to pay FICA on stock options, and in most cases, only have to pay capitol gains taxes, instead of income taxes on the stock options (15% vs 33%)... So, every year I asked my AVP to give me more stock options and less salary... because I was making money on the deal And so were they. So, once you realize there are ways to reduce your tax burden, you start to become much more interested in the total package, not just in your salary... when I was interviewing for Director positions with other companies, I wanted to know about the health package, stock options and the other benefits long before I bothered asking how much they wanted to pay me.

As an employer, it would give me more money to spend on good labor... and my good employees would get a raise of 5%-7% over time... OR I'd be forced to drop my prices to stay competitive... In a free market a mixture of those 2 things would happen... Either way you'd end up with more money in your pocket long term.

And you don't think if they didn't have to cintribute that to your SS your pay might not go up a little bit? For all practical purposes, 15% of your earnings go to FICA, the government just has a cute way of hiding 7.5% of it so the number doesn't look at bad on each pay check.

Robert, My post didn't indicated you said, you wanted to be made whole... only a comment from me that it would be nice to do so but the money just isn't there. I made the comment you paid into the system and what *something* out of it... I believe that has been your past statements, that you do want something out of SS - I agree for the record, you've stated you're willing to take some hair cut. The 30% comment is to cover all entitlements for retired persons, not just SS... That is about what we would have to charge just to cover those entitlements in taxes alone, those numbers come from the CATO institute... Now, the reality is that people making more money will probably be expected to pay a large amount than people making less. But, we'd need to increase taxes by at least 30% over all to pay for entitlements through the end of the baby boomer generation... And in fairness a very big chunk of that is medicare more so than SS. I'm already paying ~50%-55% taxes... that is an estimate but here is how I come up with the math... I'm in the 33% tax bracket, I pay 15% (since I'm self employed) into FICA, that is 48%, then I pay 10% sales tax on anything I buy, lets say 50% of my income goes into taxable purchases, so that adds another 5% onto my tax bill... so we're at 52%, then I pay local property taxes, licenses and fees for my business, my vehicles, and business use taxes... So yeah my current tax burden is 50-55% or in that general range. That doesn't take into account 'invisible' taxes... such as corporate tax rates increase the costs of products I buy... Or overhead from having to deal with a massive government bureaucracy. So, yeah, I can see my tax burden being 75-80% of my earnings, to keep SS and medicare in the black, and not pass along more debt to my childrens' children... Maybe my math is off somewhat... but it's not off a lot There is no good solution to the problem... we just have to get rid of entitlements... and it's going to be very painful. But we can't expect the younger folks to pick up the tab. Frankly, with SS the right choice is to reduce payments today on people currently in retirement and those going into retirement. Force the government to sell off assets to build a true trust fund for SS, and make it impossible for congress to touch that money. Then we need a constitutional amendment that limits the size of the federal government to 7% GDP, no exceptions, and state governments to 2-3% GDP... Which would automatically reduce the tax burden to about 10% of GDP... but that will never happen... We'll continue to kick the can down the road, unless the ponzi scheme which is the federal government completely collapses into chaos, then people who are on SS and medicare will get nothing.

Exactly what powers of arrest do you think police officers have in TN, that regular citizens do not? I'm positive Fallguy can backup his claim by quoting the exact laws... So please take the time to back up your claim he doesn't know what he's talking about. Keep in mind, he's not talking about power to legally use deadly force to effect the arrest, nor is he talking about liability protections from making a mistake while making an arrest. He's talking about the ability to make a citizens arrest in the vast majority of cases where a law enforcement officer can.

It's a statement of fact... When was the last time you've seen a revolution started by retired persons? The fact is younger generations are much more likely to be the ones in the street over having their taxes increased.

Mike, The problem is the money isn't there... it's been wasted, it's gone... The only way to pay your generation is to tax mine a lot more... And give us nothing in return. The money has to come from somewhere... The quicker the baby boomers realize that every dime they get was .15 cents taxed from the younger generations (why .15 because of government waste and overhead)... the quicker we can make the real hard choices needed. The answer can't be pay me because I paid into the broken system all my life... because that answer turns the next 2 generations into slaves who only get to keep 25-35% of their earning, and they're expected to not only live off of that amount, but to save for retirement too... They will spend their entire lives paying into a broken system, and when they can finally retire at 75 years of age, they will not get 1 cent from the government for all the taxes they've paid into the system. It's not my generations fault we're in this mess, it's for sure not the next 2 generations who are coming up behind me, we've just now started to become old enough to even hold political office... the baby boomers have had the reigns of power since 1992, you've had 20 years of kicking this mess down the road, and now that your generation is sitting on the edge of a great abyss, you're looking at the younger generations to make it right. If you think the chaos will be from taking away baby boomers entitlements you're kidding yourself... 65 year olds don't march in the street... retired people don't over throw governments... 15-40 year olds do.

The government doesn't have to default, they can just inflate themselves out of debt, and in the process tax us all invisibly. We're going to have to wake up and see that whats been going on for the last 100 years is killing our way of life, and it's time for a change to self discipline.

So the game plan is to turn the next 2 to 3 generation into slaves to pay for the baby boomers entitlements, and on top of that tell them they won't get anything in return for all their years of paying into a completely broken system? My taxes are already more than 50% of my earnings... We're talking about adding another 15-25% on top of that... and in return when I turn 70 or 75 I can retire with what I've saved in the remaining 25% of my earnings? Why should I be forced to work until I'm 75 years old, and retire with almost nothing, so you can retire in 10 years and have free medical, and $24k a year in a government retirement program?

Robert, I'm sorry, you're missing the point I'm making.... You've paid into the system, but want something out of it and it would be nice to make everybody whole... Where does that money come from? How much should my generation be expected to pay into the system and get NOTHING out? You'd have to take 30% of my generations pay just to pay for promised entitlements over the next 20 years, and in return, my generation get nothing when we retire.

Mike, Again, they don't have the money... how are they supposed to get the money to pay you back?

And where does the government get money to pay for the baby boomers SS? If I'm getting 15% of my pay to invest as I see fit, what other taxes am I paying to let baby boomers to play golf in Florida on my dime for the next 20 years? And what happens to the pile of money I've already paid into the system for the last 20 years? Just considered it a gift to the government? The solution must require everybody to take a haircut... SS needs to be reduced for the baby boomers to provide just enough money for food, and shelter and nothing else... In 2010 the poverty line for 1 person is $10,980 in the lower 48 states.... Which is about $211 a week... That provides a safety net to make sure people in retirement aren't going hungry or being kicked out of a place to live. While not causing a huge tax/debt burden on the next 3 generations.

The problem with that math is, the "younger" generation, many of whom have been already paying into the system for 20+ years, get to pay 30+% of their income in taxes for the next 30-40 years of their lives, to only get to keep 7-10% for their 'government' required 401k. So, the older generations who are responsible for this mess get their retirement income, the 'younger' generation gets to pay into a super expensive "retirement" package mandated by the government where most of our money goes to pay for people to play golf for the next 20-30 years in Florida, while we retire with pennies on the dollar, and are left to our own devices in our old age? I'm sorry but there must be some shared responsibility for this mess... People who have been paying into the ponzi scheme should get something back, but not at the expense of the next generation having to pay 50-55% taxes and getting virtually no retirement out of the deal. The solution can not be that people who are 40 years or younger are forced to pay for the baby boomers retirement, and get nothing in return... the baby boomers are going to have to take a hair cut too.

The money's gone... The government stolen it, wrote worthless IOU's and gave it away to special interest groups. Don't feel bad I've only been paying into the system for 20 years, but my money has been stolen too. Who exactly do we lock up? This has been going on for 50 years... exactly who should we throw in jail? Only way to give you your money is to print more paper money out of thin air. We either make the hard choices now, or we wait until the government collapses from mismanagement and debt, then nobody gets anything back. It's a ponzi scheme you're forced to invest in...

Yeah, that is the ticket, the grandkids should have to pay 50+% of their income in tax for the next 40 years, and finally get to retire at 75 years old, so you can retire today at 65. 10 years from now, every worker in America will have to cover 50% of the social security for 1 retired person, which is about $1250 a month in today's money. That doesn't include income tax or money to pay medicare for that same retired person. The sooner everybody including those over 50 years old figure out they've been part of the largest ponzi scheme in the history of the world, and the money just isn't there the better off we all are. I understand you were sold a bill of good for something that isn't there, but you have no right to force me to become a slave just so you can sit back and retire when the money stolen from you isn't there.

Ok, lets get started... Freedom of speech... Hmmm, lets see, free speech zones anybody? Not only do they violate your freedom of speech, but they also violate your ability to seek redress against the government. So, no my freedom of speech can and will be limited as the government sees fit... But I'll grant you that the freedom of speech is one of the least destroyed natural rights. As for right to trial, I believe it's a right to a jury trial, and the government has figured out a lot of ways to abuse that right... Try getting a jury trial during a reckless driving hearing... The government has made up 'administrative' offenses which tend to bypass a lot of requires placed on criminal courts. Lets talk about double jeopardy for a minute.. we have the 'separate sovereign' exception, as well as the hung jury exception.... So no that right is not completely intact. Self-incrimination, maybe... SCOTUS has had some questionable rulings on that one here recently... for sure wiretapping is a clear violation IMHO. Now the huge one which you brought up... unreasonable searches... We've lost that entire right, and you know it... Lets see all the ways that god given right has been violated... first lets start with RAS/PC police can search your person, your home, your car, your cellphone without a warrant. Patriot Act gives the right for FBI agents to write their own warrants on a napkin, with no judicial oversight. Your computer can be searched without a warrant when entering the country. No our rights protected by the 4th amendment have been completely trashed - probably one of the worse examples. Rights are absolutes which stand above what the majority wants at any given point in time... We have a process for taking away rights, which is a jury of your peers unanimously voting to convict you of a crime, otherwise your rights can't be touched. Majority rule is 2 wolves and a sheep voting on whats for dinner... I didn't sign up for that, and neither did our founding fathers. The form of government they created was a necessary evil 230 years ago, now that it has been allowed to grow out of control for the last 160 years, it's a monster that we must stop. My fear is that the only way to stop it at this point is going to result in bloodshed.

Very true, but at least this time it will be self inflicted

I disagree, none of our God given rights haven't already been breached and destroyed. We don't have free speech, and for sure little freedom of the press left... the 2nd, 4th, and 5th Amendments have been for all practical purposes removed... What rights are still fully there?

You'd be able to carry home without an HCP, just not in other states. So in the second case the restriction wouldn't be a huge deal since it only takes 1 business day to get a new ID. I'd still be more concerned about only being able to have 1 ID, instead of now where we can have as many HCP's as we want.

Also keep in mind, for the first time in my life time we have a true republican controlled legislature in TN, with a republican governor. It's very unlikely that the Democrats could prevent this legislation from moving forward.

He was arguing we didn't need a bill of rights for the Constitution... as bad as it is today, just imagine how bad it would be without the first 10 amendments. His argument was wrong if anything they didn't put enough safe guards in to protect us from the tyranny we face today.

I think we have a winner!

I'd call where you plan to have her take the test and ask them what distances they use for the shooting test, I'm pretty sure the number of shots from each distance is left up to the instructor. The total number of shots required by the state is 48, but most instructors I know have you use an entire box of ammo. The instructor I know use this sequence of shots (but again I'm pretty sure it's up to the instructor) 3 yards - 12 rounds 7 yards - 12 rounds 15 yards - 6 rounds 7 yards - 6 rounds 3 yards - 12 rounds As for the test questions, first I'd reminder her it's an open note multiple choice test, that is designed for anybody with an 8th grade education to pass. That less than 1% of the population who attempts the course fails... But some subjects to go over: 1. Identify different types of revolver frames from a silhouette 2. Difference between semi automatic and revolver pistol silhouette 3. The requirements to get a handgun permit in TN 4. The differences between a clip and a magazine I'm sure others will give you good ideas... truth is they cover all the information in the class, every instructor I knows allows you to take notes, allows you to use those notes during the test, and has some method to indicate which parts are on the test as he goes over them. The instructor has a vested interest in making sure everybody who takes his class who can, passes the test, which means the pass rates are almost always 100%.... Your wife would do fine to just show up and take the class the hard part will be spending 5+ hours watching out of date TDOS videos and trying to not fall asleep She won't have any problem writing down the test answers as the instructor goes over them, and then picking the correct true/false or a,b,c,d answer right after the class.