JayC

I call BS on that... My family, my wife's family, and I own between us 10+ different business entities, each with insurance policies... I can't tell you how many different insurance companies I've met with and received quotes from in the last 10 years... I've NEVER seen a single policy with that type of language in it... People keep claiming that is why some businesses post... but nobody has ever been able to produce said policy. And even if his insurance company does have such a clause... I'm willing to bet a beer that he can find the exact same coverage from at least 3 different companies for the same price as he is paying now. There are LOTS of anti-gun businesses out there that need to be tossed under the bus... Banks, who won't provide credit to firearms related businesses, just because they're firearm related businesses... but insurance companies requiring that your building be posted, isn't one of them yet....

Maybe I'm missing something... I thought we worked security at a court house, checking everybody coming into the building... If he's checking bags and working security at the door to the individual courtroom, that would be a huge difference.

So no vending machines anywhere in the courthouse? The Judges aren't allowed to bring a sack lunch to work? Or are they the exception to the rule?

Just curious but what law allows you to deny entry to a public building because somebody has a candy bar (food) or a bottle of water (drink) with them? How on earth does somebody having a bottle of water with them pose a security risk to a government building? My bet, it's an order from a little despot in a black robe.

Only case I've seen involved the Memphis airport and somebody carrying there, violation of 39-17-1359 was included in the long list of charges. Not sure what ended up happening, but that is the only time I've ever seen 1359 included as a charge.

Glock 19 Gen 2 in a belt Serpa at my 4 o'clock, and a KelTec P3AT in my pocket with a spare mag. Depending on the clothes I'm wearing, 1 to 3 spare Glock 17 round mags for the G19. Flashlight and 'extraction' tool/pocket knife which has a glass breaker, and seat belt cutting tool built into it. If I'm wearing cargo pants/shorts I also have a personal blow out kit in the left cargo pocket.

Which technically appears to be TDOS violating the law... There is no requirement under the HCP law to prevent the issuing of permits for class C or B misdemeanors even if charges are still pending. There is also no requirement under the law for TICS for that either... then again TICS is completely unconstitutional on it's face

Just to add, they could legally fire you for even asking if you could carry a gun at work... TN is an at will employment state. Not saying your boss would.. but as others have said, it's not illegal, but that doesn't mean it won't get you fired.

Or better yet, check before pumping, and go spend your money somewhere else if it's posted

They'd have to prove you intended to carry with a round in the chamber. Thankfully it's an intent law... In my case when I carry a loaded AR in the car, the bolt is back and the dust cover is up, so it would be very easy to explain how an officer unfamiliar with my firearm ended up finding a round in the chamber.

Oh I bug the tar out of my state senator... I try and have a face to face meeting with him 2 or 3 times a year... my state rep is another story, I live in Beth Harwell's district, the RINO who is blocking virtually all pro-gun laws today... but I did actively campaign against her last time around

Unless posted or otherwise notified by the church that carry is prohibited, churches are the same as any other private business or establishment. With one notable exception, if there is a licensed school involved... then things get tricky, because property owned by the school is off limits 24/7. Note, day care or 'preschool' ran by churches is not a school under the handgun carry laws. So, if the bus is owned by the church, and used for church activities it's no different than driving your own vehicle, or a vehicle for your employer. If the a church ran school owns the bus, then both the grounds and buildings used by the school are off limits, as well as any buses they own/operate. IANAL

Is that the case? Or would the fact that firearm possession is just as illegal as drug possession and we only have defenses under the law make the search reasonable since they had probable cause to search? Seeing as the driver told them he had a firearm in the vehicle? I'm not trying to be smart, I'm just curious on case law involving defenses to a law, compared to exceptions to a law?

Can you imagine the trouble if doofus shot and killed himself with your handgun while you're standing on the side of the road? There is no reason for an officer to disarm a HCP permit holder unless they're being arrested... It's safer for everybody involved that officers not handle firearms they're not trained to handle. The sooner we can get rid of that silly disarm law the better.

Bahh my point is the cost is more than the class and the permit... I make a good living, so my cost is higher than a single mother working 2 jobs trying to make ends meet. But, even for that single mother the cost is a lot more than $250... It's 3 days off of work for her... 1 to take the class, 1 to visit them DMV to apply, and 1 to go get her fingerprints taken... Maybe if she lives in a big city where there are places that take fingerprints without appointment she can shorten that to 2 days off of work, but that is still 16 hours of work she's lost... even at $15 an hour, that is another $240-250 dollars added to the cost of the permit. That is assuming if she's running from her abusing husband, it doesn't take her 3 or 4 weeks to get those 2 days off of work without costing her the job. I know hourly employees I work with on a regular basis who can't afford to take 2 days off of work to go get the permit, let alone the money for the permit... The cost of the permit is so high... it shouldn't cost $50 for a life time permit.

People make poor choices, they shouldn't be punished by the government for failing to pay for a god given right ahead of the time they need that god given right to protect themselves. Nobody is suggesting the government provide them a weapon, only that the government get out of the way.

In my profession I work 6 days a week, if I have to run to the DMV that is time I'm not billing to a customer So it is lost $$$ on my part... To your point, if I choose to take time off of work and do something that I want to do, that does have a cost associated with it, but that cost is my choice... When I take a week off of work to go on a vacation, I choose to give up billable hours for that week. Having to go and give up billable hours to meet some silly and useless requirement dictated by the state is not voluntary, and therefore I don't see as me freely choosing... So there is a big difference in my mind from choosing to go to the range to blow off some steam, and being forced to jump through hoops by the state to get a carry permit. As for my cost accounting... price A $500-600 vs price B $2300-2400 is the cost difference between the money I pay in a constitutional carry state vs TN for the tools and permits required to defend myself. I have a buddy who wants his carry permit, he makes about $40k a year, but has to take vacation days to go to the HCP class, that is real money out of his pocket, because otherwise he would bank the vacation days and take a cash payout at the end of the year. In his case that is 3 vacation days to get his permit. That is real money out of his pocket for something he doesn't need.

Even if the AR had been loaded but not one in the chamber, it would have still been legal.

The DA didn't take a pro-gun position... he took a CYA, don't charge a politically connected member of the community, or face re-election problems stance. A pro-gun stance would have been to come out and state the lw is a stupid law and he wouldn't charge any adult for carrying a firearm on school grounds in his counyty... not just a politically connected person.

Robert, the total cost of your permit was a lot more than $300, and I can prove it. Remember total cost is not just the cost of the class, the permit, it's the time you had to take to go to the class, take the class, and the entire permit process. I was highlighting the fact that for somebody who needs to protect themselves, they likely need a carry firearm, holster and carry ammo... The average price of a quality handgun being $400-500, $50 for carry ammo, and $50 for a holster, so between 500 and 600 hundred just for the tools... can you do it for less, sure, but not a lot less... for an average worker that is the majority of a weeks take home pay... then you get to add the government cost on to that. 10 hours for the class, when you factor in drive time, and waiting around time (counting drive time, my class was more like 11)... 3+ hours at the DMV (I was there over 4), and another 2 hours to get fingerprinted. So 15 hours or so average time... When I got my permit, my internal billable per hour was $75, so 15*$75 = 1125, add in $100 for the class, $20 for the ammo, and $150 for the permit, and you're just shy of $1400. 15 hours for somebody making $20 is still $300, plus class, ammo, permit you're talking $580, as much if not more than the handgun they had to purchase for self defense. My guess is, you make more than $20 an hour... so yeah the permit cost you a lot more than $300. I can tell you right now, having co-workers and friends who are in their early 20's who want to get permits, having to work 50-60 hours a week, working 6 days a week, it is a hardship for them to get a permit, besides the upfront tax from the government, the time off is a killer in this economy. So yes I think it's fair to say it is prohibitively expensive. We both agree people should train more, but even at the current levels of training of the population at large, they are still 5 times less likely to shoot and kill an innocent person than a police officer. I'm all for more training, but it shouldn't be a government requirement... I haven't seen a rash of HCP holders hitting innocent bystanders have you? But I also haven't seen a rash of otherwise law abiding citizens hitting innocent bystanders either. We're in agreement all law abiding citizens should be allowed to carry any firearm they're legally allowed to own, and it's in their best interest to receiving training and keep their shooting skills fresh... I just don't believe the government has anymore right to mandate the type of training or how often anymore than how many times a minute you're allowed to blink your eyes.

Frankly I'd be shocked that any DA would attempt to charge under that defense... very short trip to the re-election fight of their lives. The fact remains that many people can't afford to get an HCP, I think we can all agree the permitting process and costs related to it are a significant hurdle preventing a lot of lower and middle income people from getting the permit, for example my permit cost me about: $1395 to get back 8+ years ago. Today that cost would be a lot more, $1855 or so. That is just the wasted man hours, class, ammo, and permit costs... it doesn't include the price of the handgun, carry ammo, and holster, which today would start to approach $2500. $2500 vs the risk of getting charged for carry ammo and a firearm from your car in the range parking lot to the range? I just don't see it happening. The cost of getting a permit is too high, it's corporate welfare for shooting ranges and instructors, and provides little to no benefit to the public or HCP holders. We could provide the entire class online for $5-10 per student 24 hours a day 7 days a week, have it automatically submit their permit application electronically, and have the entire permit process cost less than $50-60, and have the permit be for the life of the individual getting it. Hundreds of dollars per permit to weed out 1% or less of applicants is insane.

In the news where? Not here in TN. You can't take things you read about in NYC, NJ, CA, IL and compare them to here in TN. We have clear cut stand your ground laws... And DA's here often time run away from any case where otherwise law abiding citizens defend themselves or others... I'll point out we had a teenager shot outside running away from a house where he was playing 'ring and run', the local DA wouldn't charge the adults who shot the teenager citing self defense. Now IANAL but that doesn't seem to qualify as self defense in my book... but the DA knew nobody would convict scared parents for shooting the bad teenager We might not have the best gun laws here in TN, but DA's know not to go after otherwise law abiding citizens or they won't get re-elected, and we might get upset enough to change the laws. Frankly, I'd like to see a Texas style after dark trespassing law here in TN....

Maybe not a loaded shotgun, but a loaded 22... I can see that... My answer would be snapping turtles and snakes... any reason to be armed incidental to fishing, or camping would be covered... including protecting the camp from wild animals. Could bad people try and use this to carry around a loaded gun under guise of incidental to one of the above activities... sure... but just because somebody could abuse it, doesn't mean the defenses are not there for others who are carrying a firearm incidental to these activities.

Well since it's only a defense, I'm pretty sure a DA could charge you, and leave ti to the jury to decided whether it was incident to... I'd refer to having an unloaded firearm, and ammo in a bag walking from your car into a shooting range as incident to a shooting sport. How else is somebody without a HCP supposed to legally transport the firearm and ammo from their vehicle to the range? Also, not everybody has a car, so carrying an unloaded firearm with ammo from your home to the local range on a bike or by walking is illegal? The travel to and from the range is incident to the activity of sports shooting.

See as shooting sports is a legal defense to be armed, I don't see how an officer makes a charge under those conditions stick.