Cruel Hand Luke

It depends... For most days going about my business as a private citizen I carry 1 spare G17 mag just forward of my non dominant side hip. For church security duty I carry 2. When talking about shootings in the criminal assault paradigm the odds are exponentially overwhelming that whatever happens will most likely be over one way or the other well before the ammo in my first mag is expended. Obviously the lower the capacity the more your mileage may vary. Since I am not tasked on an everyday basis with laying hands on and taking people into custody that don't want to be taken into custody there is very little on a daily basis that compels me to stay and fight. In the typical civilian encounters where someone approaches and produces a weapon to coerce you to give up your wallet or to go somewhere with them, you presenting a gun and shooting at them (whether you hit them or not) generally tends to create an unscheduled track meet with them running as fast as they can away from you .....and you often running the opposite direction...assuming they are not killed outright. The odds of you even having the time to reload before it is over is unlikely. If the "typical civilian street gunfight" last 3-4 seconds from guns coming out to end of shooting there just isn't much time for a reload in there. John Correia (Active Self Protection) has watched over 15,000 civilian gunfights on video from security cameras worldwide and I have been an attendee at the presentation he does at various training conferences. He says that in all the video he has watched there is almost never a reload accomplished before the bad guys either stop or have run away....especially when people are reloading from their pockets. We watched one of those videos in his presentation where the defender reloaded from a pocket. It took a timed 15 seconds to access the mag and complete the reload. The bad guy was probably 2 blocks away before the guy got the gun up and running again. John goes as far as to saying since he carries a hi cap gun he has stopped carrying a spare mag and carries pepper spray in its place. I have long preferred to carry both because while pepper spray can be very useful it cannot help me clear a malfunction that requires a new mag to make the gun work. So I generally carry a spare mag and pepper spray. The church security paradigm is a little different. We may well be facing a dedicated and prepared opponent for whom self preservation is not their overriding concern. In fact they probably EXPECT to die during the event. In that case it may well take more hits and they may possibly have to be delivered from much longer distances to stop him than would be likely in the typical street criminal mugging/assault . We may be engaging someone who is using cover and we might have to use gunfire to "pin him in place " while a maneuvering element closes with him to render him neutralized. That type of thing has virtually no commonality with the typical civilian use of force. So for church security duty I err on the side of caution and carry a second spare mag.

The guy who cares little and knows even less about actual US military weapons would not be interested in these to begin with. The average gun buyer would rather have a nice shiny new Kimber or Ruger 1911 than one of the CMP military 1911s and that is fine. To each his own. NO one who is buying these guns is expecting a museum piece. They all know they are US Property 1911A1s or 1911s upgraded to A1 spec that likely have seen service and were arsenal rebuilt at some point . They probably also know that some of the frames will be 80, 90,or even 100 years old at this point....the YOUNGEST ones will be 75 years old because 1944 was the last time the US military ordered 1911A1 pistols other than some tiny batches for the Marines. They also know that as they were rebuilt the armorers at the arsenals used parts from the parts bin with little care or inclination to try to match manufacturers so many will be "mixmasters" like a Colt frame and an Ithica slide. Having said that I have seen some that are matching frames and slides, so some buyers might get lucky in that regard. It will most likely have been refinished in the 1980s and now be a dull gray parkerized finish. It MIGHT have a matching upper and lower but it is just as likely to not. THAT is how REAL military 1911/1911A1s were after being turned back in after WWII. And THAT is what the people buying these are buying them for. To have a REAL US Govt Property 1911A1 that most likely went to Europe or the Pacific , to Korea or Vietnam and was reworked afterwards in case things ever got hot with the USSR. Is it the ideal carry gun? No. But I doubt ANYONE is ordering one to carry it. There are far more logical choices that are cheaper and easier to get at your local gun store for that purpose...but those guns are not US Property 1911s and to the people ordering these guns that is far more important.

This one gets closer every day.....

The issue is that you would then HAVE to challenge them. No one is kicking anyone's pet goldfish . I'm merely stating WHY those attorney types who do this kind of thing for a living say that it CAN (not ALWAYS WILL , but CAN) be an issue they would have to answer in a civil case. They are not saying NEVER DO IT...they are saying it is a real thing that may well be argued by opposing council and you should be aware and make your own informed decisions. To be forewarned is to be forearmed. Be aware of the likely arguments and have a counter to them. It is all about how you articulate it..... If you want to use a flamethrower you are welcome to do it .....and in a "good shoot" the use of the flamethrower might not even matter ...but even if you don't get arrested and charged for the good shooting you might still get sued civilly and have to answer why you used a flamethrower. There is immunity from civil suit in TN but if you travel out of state and shoot someone that immunity does not travel with you. You are held to the laws of the state where the shooting occurs and even a good shoot can still lead to a civil case for injury or wrongful death if the other guy is never charged with (or convicted) of a crime. And as to use of a FACTORY +p loadings I already have the answer to any nitwit opposing council who would even be stupid enough to bring that up (that is assuming that line of questioning didn't already get quashed "in limine") ..... again to be forewarned is to be forearmed.

As to carry ammo? CCI Gold Dot 124+p . It can be found in most gun stores, it is IWBA/FBI Test Protocol compliant, and works as well (or better) than anything else in the caliber in real world shootings. I also like Corbon DPX but it is far less readily available.

It is not the initial criminal case that they are warning about on the reloads so much as it is in case of a civil action wrongful death case. That is where the "he is so depraved that he felt factory ammo wasn't deadly enough" arguments normally come into play. The argument can be answered but if you use factory ammo it would never even possibly have to be answered.

This one is coming up THIS WEEKEND ! We still have spots available !

A huge THANKS to all who came out and participated ! Of the 19 students I think I knew about half of them from previous classes and I look forward to seeing the other half in class again some time too. Lee put on a very educational block on the legalities of lethal force and Sean provided some TN specific commentary. After lunch I covered how to spot and avoid potential interpersonal problems before they become confirmed interpersonal problems and ways to increase your odds before it goes combative. Then we squared away some core skills of fighting with a pistol in dry work and then did live fire drills replicating the most common street scenarios. Thanks for everyone coming out and working hard even with the potential of torrential downpour. By the time we actually went to the range the weather had mostly cleared up (prayer works) and we were able to get through the shooting without needing fins and scuba gear... A huge THANKS to Lee for coming up and lending his expertise and providing some much needed information in an area that most people think they know a lot more about than they often do. Who knows, with the resounding success this class was we might be persuaded to offer it again in the future.....

Agree emphatically.

OK Guys and gals....last call ! We still have a few spots available so if you were wrestling with whether to sign up or not.... get yourself signed up! You'll end up kicking yourself later if you don't....

My condolences.......

Suarez International CRG-1: PISTOL GUNFIGHTING April 6-7, 2019 Chattanooga, TN Area Instructor: Randy Harris Price $350 Instructor Bio All training must begin with fundamentals. This comprehensive fundamentals class is designed to prep you for the more advanced courses such as Close Range Gunfighting. Through a carefully designed and detailed curriculum we are able to bring you up to a level of skill in a short two day class that previously would take over 4 or 5 days to achieve at other schools. You will learn a complete presentation of the modern combative technique of the pistol which will put you in good standing for any defensive situations you may encounter in the real world. We will also be incorporating fundamental Point Shooting techniques which will prep you for more advanced courses. You will learn the components of various point shooting methods and integrate them into your existing skill sets. This knowledge will put you in good standing for any defensive situations you may encounter in the real world. No experience or prior training is needed to attend this class and it is specially suitable for beginners, or as a tune-up for accomplished shooters. CLASS AND RANGE DETAILS DURATION: 2 days TIME: 9:00AM to 5:00PM CENTRAL AMMUNITION: Approximately 300 rounds (Minimum) RANGE & GEAR REQUIREMENTS: Modern defensive pistol and a holster specifically made for that pistol and designed to be worn on the belt. Three (3) magazines and magazine pouch, a belt of the same width as the belt loops for the holster and magazine pouches, and range safety gear (eye protection, and ear protection). Also Helpful Bring spare clothing appropriate for the weather, including a hat, sunscreen, and bug repellent. Plan to bring lunch, snacks, and water (min 1 gallon per person) for the entire day unless driving to lunch is a viable option from the range location. Bring allergy medication (if needed), a chair (if you prefer), note taking supplies, and a boo boo kit (band aids, gauze pads, antiseptic wipes, antibiotic ointment and tape). You may wish to bring pads such as knee pads, elbow pads, and gloves if the class lends itself to that. RANGE: NOTES: Range is located 40 minutes SW of Chattanooga and 20 minutes from Trenton Ga . It is located where TN, GA and AL all come together on the map. Range is located in Pisgah Alabama. Range is on CENTRAL time. Phillips/Edwards Farm Coming from Chattanooga * Take I-24 west from Chattanooga * Merge onto I-59 S via exit 167 on the left toward Birmingham * Take the GA-136 exit, exit 11, toward Trenton * Turn right onto GA-136 * Turn left to stay on GA-136 (crossing into Alabama) * GA-136 becomes AL-71 * Turn left to stay on Al-71 * Turn left onto AL-117 * Turn right onto CR-330 * Turn right onto CR-332 * End at 763 County Road 332, Pisgah, AL For more info and to register......https://suarezinternational.com/crg-1-pistol-gunfighting-april-6-7-2019-chattanooga-tn/?ctk=4573b355-6ca4-4e62-aafd-6cb34d7f723e

Congrats Tiff ! Have a good class !

Again I'm not arguing the lethality of it ... a .22 short can be lethal with good bullet placement and no intermediate barriers (like heavy clothing). Curtis Reeves had no problem killing Chad Oulson at touching distance through a T shirt in the Wesley Chapel movie theater with a .380 for throwing popcorn on him. One shot through the chest from almost contact distance produced a fatality. I'm saying that hollow point .380s don't expand AND penetrate to a depth that I'd be comfortable with for shots outside of arms length or for other than squared up through the chest shots. Add any distance, layering of clothing (especially leather jacket) , a heavily muscled (or just really fat) individual or any kind of angle and there is a VERY good chance that a .380 fired from a "pocket pistol" barrel length gun will probably not penetrate deep enough to hit vital organs. So which do we think is more powerful? .380 or .45 GAP? We'd ALL say 45 GAP all day long. One of my students actually shot a and killed a home invader using a .45 GAP... one round was found in fabric of the cotton walmart hoodie the guy was wearing....it didn't even penetrate the guy's body....of course the the other round that went through his mouth killed him. So if a .45 GAP can fail to penetrate a "Walmart kevlar" hoodie then I'm not feeling so good about .380 . In all honesty I believe the round found in the hoodie probably hit at a bit of an angel and just skidded along the torso instead of biting in and penetrating into the torso. But if a glancing .45 can't be relied on to penetrate then a glancing hit with a .380 is even less likely. Not trying to kick anyone's pet goldfish here. Just want to make sure people understand that the performance of that pocket .380 they are carrying is probably not what they think. Will it kill? Yes and so will a car antenna shoved through your carotid artery. Can you guarantee that kind of placement? Due to the lack of horsepower they just do not penetrate well with any kind of expanding ammo. You can mitigate this lack of penetration with FMJ ammo but then FMJ is not ideal for self defense either. Other than Hornady XTP bullet (which in most bigger calibers expands too little and penetrates too deep) there's just not anything else AT THIS POINT in time that expands and penetrates well enough that I would feel comfy with carrying a pocket .380 as a primary weapon. And in the RARE occasion I am absolutely FORCED by wardrobe requirements to carry only a .380 that is the ammo I use. But I still don't expect a lot from it....

Suarez International CLOSE RANGE GUNFIGHTING June 22-23, 2019 Dayton, Tennessee Instructor: Randy Harris Price $350 Receive $50 off when HITS-7 when you purchase both! On June 21 we are offering Vehicle Gunfighting Fundamentals This is our flagship course and goes as far as you can safely go on a square range with live-fire pistols. The dynamic curriculum surpasses the traditional handgun methods commonly taught in most institutions and focuses of the use of the pistol in aggressive close range applications likely in individual civilian street encounters. The class begins with a tune-up of the fundamentals, then we progress quickly to new skills such as Proactive and Reactive Manipulations, Shooting While Moving Off The X, Reality-Based Multiple Hostiles Engagement, 360 degree CQB Movement, Danger-Close Fighting, Bilateral Shooting, 360 degree After Action Assessment Methods, and Integrating the Flashlight and Other Tools into the Firing Platform. This is the life-saving material that is often ignored in many other programs. In two days, you will receive more information than most armed professionals ever get! We must point out that THIS COURSE IS NOT FOR THE NOVICE SHOOTER. If you have not received basic instruction, or have a question about your skill level, please call us first. CLASS AND RANGE DETAILS DURATION: 2 days TIME: 8:30AM to 4:30PM AMMUNITION: Approximately 500 rounds (Minimum) RANGE & GEAR REQUIREMENTS: Modern defensive pistol and a holster specifically made for that pistol and designed to be worn on the belt. Three (3) magazines and magazine pouch, a belt of the same width as the belt loops for the holster and magazine pouches, and range safety gear (eye protection, and ear protection). Bring your flashlights for the low light module. Also Helpful Bring spare clothing appropriate for the weather, including a hat, sunscreen, and bug repellent. Plan to bring lunch, snacks, and water (min 1 gallon per person) for the entire day unless driving to lunch is a viable option from the range location. Bring allergy medication (if needed), a chair (if you prefer), note taking supplies, and a boo boo kit (band aids, gauze pads, antiseptic wipes, antibiotic ointment and tape). You may wish to bring pads such as knee pads, elbow pads, and gloves if the class lends itself to that. RANGE: The Ridge 11534 Rhea County Hwy, Hwy 27 Dayton, TN 37321 423-605-4242 http://www.theridgeshooting.com/ For more info and to register.....https://suarezinternational.com/crg-2-close-range-gunfighting-june-22-23-2019-dayton-tn/

SUAREZ INTERNATIONAL Vehicle Gunfighting Fundamentals June 21, 2019 Dayton, Tennessee Instructor: Randy Harris Price $200 Receive $50 off CRG-2 when you purchase both! On June 22-23 We will be also be offering Close Range Gunfighting 2 Most of us spend several hours in or around motor vehicles, yet very little time training how to fight in and around them. In this class you will learn how to do just that. We will cover everything from weapon access while seated, shooting from the car, as well as using the car itself as a barrier to attack and for cover. CLASS AND RANGE DETAILS DURATION: 1 Day TIME: 8:30AM to 4:30PM AMMUNITION: Approximately 200 rounds (Minimum) RANGE & GEAR REQUIREMENTS: Modern defensive pistol and a holster specifically made for that pistol and designed to be worn on the belt. Three (3) magazines and magazine pouch, a belt of the same width as the belt loops for the holster and magazine pouches, and range safety gear (eye protection, and ear protection). Also Helpful Bring spare clothing appropriate for the weather, including a hat, sunscreen, and bug repellent. Plan to bring lunch, snacks, and water (min 1 gallon per person) for the entire day unless driving to lunch is a viable option from the range location. Bring allergy medication (if needed), a chair (if you prefer), note taking supplies, and a boo boo kit (band aids, gauze pads, antiseptic wipes, antibiotic ointment and tape). You may wish to bring pads such as knee pads, elbow pads, and gloves if the class lends itself to that. RANGE: The Ridge 11534 Rhea County Hwy, Hwy 27 Dayton, TN 37321 423-605-4242 http://www.theridgeshooting.com/ For more info and to register.....https://suarezinternational.com/hits-7-vehicle-gunfighting-fundamentals-june-21-2019-dayton-tn/

ONE week to go on this one!

Maybe...maybe not. I have seen metal binder clips used to affix paper targets to cardboard backers on an indoor range that were hit with .380 that were just dented in..... I've seen the same type clip at the same range with a clean hole through both sides made with 9, .40 and .45 Now I am NOT in any way saying they just bounce off of people... I repeat I am NOT saying they just bounce off people. There are plenty of people killed with .380 every year. I am saying that in that particular time and space that .380 ammo that the person was shooting didn't punch a hole through the binder clip which makes me very leery about expecting very much from a .380 at more than arms length distance.

Reminder that this one is getting closer every day ! Hope to see you there !

Yes. Anything will work. While not ideal, I have had people do the class with a lever gun.

Just under a month to go. Also remember there is the Rifle class ( https://suarezinternational.com/rgf-2-rifle-gunfighting-ii-march-2-3-2019-dayton-tn/ ) on that Saturday and Sunday ! Three days of long gun learning and practice!

This one is just under a month out!

OK we are just about half full now so if you are the type that waits until the last minute to sign up you might not want to wait much longer.

Giving this a quick bump . We have several folks signed up already and I have spoken to several folks who are planning to sign up so this is just a reminder that this is coming up in 3 WEEKS! Lee and I are looking forward to seeing you there!

DATE CHANGED TO MARCH 23rd DUE TO WEATHER FORECAST FOR THE MARCH 9 WEEKEND !!!!!!!!! TN / GA / AL Training Group On Saturday March 23 we will hold our March meeting for the TN/GA/AL Regional Suarez Int Training Group for 2019! Subject : Getting shot sucks...get off the X !!! Instructor: Tier 1 Suarez Int Staff Instructor Randy Harris Location: Hiwassee Land Company Lake in Rocky Face GA . Contact me for directions!!!!!!! Time: 9AM EASTERN time - 3PM EASTERN time Price: $80 - pay at class cash or check. What you need to bring: Pistol, pistol magazines and at least 150-200 rounds of ammo. Revolvers are welcome if you want to party like it is 1899. rD We will work on our pistol skills specifically getting off the X in reactive situations, retaking the initiative and counter attacking. If your skills you learned in Close Range Gunfighting have gotten a little rusty this is the tune up you need! We will also run some "man on man" drills to test skills and add a little motivation. Looking forward to seeing you there!