deerslayer

I will not put the orange box stuff through any of my guns--just had too many bad experiences with the stuff. The worst I saw was when a friend (who was fairly new to shooting) with a new Glock 19 said he could shoot it well, but it jammed all the time. "A Glock 19?," I asked. He claimed the "flat points" always hung up, but the "round noses" fed well. My first thought was, "Who loads a flat point 9mm?" I saw him at the range about two weeks later, and I saw his "flat points"--they were .40s! He had bought one of RUSA's 9mm orange box 250 packs, but it was about 20% .40. Nice.

Right eye dominant, left handed shooter with handguns, right handed with long guns. Both eyes open all the time. With handguns, I simply rotate (not tilt) my head to the left and look down the sights with my right eye. Been shooting w/ both eyes open for 30 years (thanks to my father for starting me out that way).

Eddie, I'm so terribly sorry for your loss. Words from strangers probably offer little help, but you are in my prayers. -Tad

Nope--maybe one mile down Old Brownsville east of Canada Rd. 9428 Old Brownsville, to be exact.

Yeah, and where do you get those full auto SIGs?

You'd be suprised at what some match directors create. How do you practice this scenario?

That sounds suspiciously like MSSA.

@the Harley jokes! I ride a Kawasaki

I guess it's just a difference in philosophy. I compare this mindset to motorcyclists who claim that there are two types of riders--those who have crashed, and those who will. As far as comparing apples to oranges, my "target" gun is a stock Glock 19. I bet if you came and shot with us sometime, some of our stages would be remarkably similar to your idea of "protective" shooting. In the end, I agree with you--train and practice with whatever works for you, and whatever works the best for you may be a lousy choice for someone else.

I babysit 25 adolescents ages 21-55. aka UPS supervisor.

Don't forget the Deep Woods OFF.

I think I've read that Jeff Cooper, some years ago, proclaimed the S&W Model 39 (the grandfather of modern DAs) to be a terrific solution to a non-existent problem. While I'm no gunfighter, I do shoot competitively. Competitive shooting certainly does not represent a gunfight, but it does add a stress factor not normally encountered on the range. I've never had trouble crushing the grip. Again, I think this is more a training issue. Practice something until it becomes instinct; then, when the SHTF, maybe some things will actually go right. Just as long as you remember that every bullet has a lawyer attached to it. Me, I'm not training or planning to miss. Come on--let's not get silly. A cocked Beretta or USP is a single action, which is 3 or 4 lbs and probably less than half the travel distance of a Glock. My Glock triggers must be moved 1/2" and are 5.5 lbs. Granted, a DA has a little longer and a bit heavier trigger, but a standard Glock trigger requires quite a bit more effort and travel distance to discharge than a SA.

Mars, I agree with almost everything you said, (I am also of the "I want my gun to be ready" persuasion) but have one question. Surely, you are not comparing a Glock/XD/M&P to a cocked USP or Beretta, are you? That's not a fair comparison. Up until about three years ago, I would have completely agreed with your whole post (being a SIG man). However, I decided that I wanted to get away from the two-trigger-pull guns, and that left basically 1911, XD, or Glock. I don't believe in the "I'm only going to need it to shoot someone at three feet, so the heavy first shot doesn't matter." Needless to say, I became comfortable with Glocks. Of course a heavier trigger will be safer, but I just don't feel that it's necessary for every shooter. Like you, I don't care for manual safeties, but we can't dispute the fact that they make guns safer to re-holster (assuming they are used). I also feel that they are unnecessary (the same way you do). You can make a gun so safe that's it useless.

Evan, who was the chick at RUSA?

Hmmm...I carry a Glock and in a life threatening self defense situation, my finger will be all over the trigger. I think most of the "keep your finger off the trigger" rhetoric is intended for holstering/re-holstering, general gun-handling/non-shooting times. Unfortunately, Glocks and XDs and Smith M&Ps (all three are in the same boat, IMO) are all marketed and widely believed to be simple and more user-friendly. They all require fewer activities to fire a round; thus they are simpler. More user-friendly? That's debatable. They are perfectly safe and arguably more user-friendly in the hands of a well-trained or highly experienced shooter; in the hands of a novice or a careless shooter, the chances of an accident increase. This is often illustrated when someone holsters or re-holsters his gun, and shoots a hole in the ground. It's not simply a matter of remembering not to play with the trigger while shoving the gun in the holster; it should become an instinct. If it's not an instinct, the shooter should maybe stick w/ a DA with a decocker and/or a safety. However, if a shooter lacks the skills or motivation to practice enough to carry one of these guns, I have serious doubts about his competence with ANY gun. Mars is always saying that Glocks are easier to accidently discharge, and I agree, but would like to know how often this involves an experienced Glock/XD/M&P shooter (sorry, most cops don't count). More often than not, it involves a nimrod.

Have them and love them. A little work to put on and get situated, but well worth the effort. For a belt, your options are a top-of-the-line velcro-lined $95 job from Comp-Tac, or to improvise. Me? I bought the sturdiest $20 belt JC Penney had, took it to Guy's Shoe Repair on Stage Road, and paid $12 (?) for them to STITCH a pair of 2" velcro strips on the inside. It has worked well so far. Adjustment depends on how long the strips are on the inside of your belt. The clips come with velcro that has adhesive on one side, but they also recommend stitching. Guy's said they couldn't stitch if the velcro had adhesive, but they had some plain velcro sitting around. If we ever meet at the once-a-month-that-nobody-shows-up-to Friday night TGO meetings at Range USA, you can see the setup in person. Highly recommended

Say again?

either that or they are just as good as the more expensive ones...

+1 Mars and I actually agree? Time to get right with Jesus--the end is near!

Bad day, Mike?

TMI--there is no more room in the safe.

Because cell phones are not necessary.

You really need to get over the open carry thing.